[BudgetPlan1]

I'm just trying to avoid my general proclivity to doing the wrong thing first; usually the *expensive* wrong thing.

Just picked up a new 2008 Mustang GT 5-speed and after surfing around for a bit, like I need some insight to avoid past mistakes.

As far as background, my current experience w/ computer controlled cars is with our 2004 Corvette. We’ve done the long tube headers, cold air intake thing and when it came time for PCM recalibration, we went with a full dyno tune on a load bearing Mustang dyno. This was done w/ HP Tuners and involved re-mapping fuel and timing tables, torque management reductions, cooling fan adjustments, etc., the ‘full deal.’ I don’t pretend to know the intricacies of this process but I mention it here as, from what I’ve read, tuning the 05+ Mustang platforms seems mostly done by handheld tuners (SCT, Diablo, etc.) which, in the Corvette world, are viewed as less than optimal when compared with custom dyno tuning.

With that in mind, I’m probably gonna limit the Mustang mods (yeah, I know…I say this now) to:

Definitely (also known as “immediately”):
1. C & L Intake w/ some kinda tune
2. Bassani aft-cat exhaust (#46075, already installed; stock exhaust lasted a whole 300 miles)

Possibly (also known as “don’t know if it’s worth it”):
1. Under drive pulleys
2. Bassani Power-X Crossover w/ hi-flo cats

Very remote possibility (also known as “don’t know if it’s worth it ‘cuz this stuff is getting expensive”):
1. American Racing LT headers w/ hi-flo cats.

I have some questions re: the above items I was hoping you could provide some insight on.

1. C & L Intake w/ some kinda tune
* Are people shipping the SCT X-Cal 3 w/ CAI packages? It seems to have some good added features over the previous version, most important to me is enhanced logging and more memory. We use EFI Live to do data logging on the Vette and I really find that ability useful.

* Is a ‘handheld’ tune sufficient for these limited mods, even if I end up doing the pulleys and Power-X crossover sooner rather than later? Or, would it be worthwhile to actually go to a shop and have a true dyno tune done? Is there even software to tune this platform to the extent that they can in the HP Tuners/EFI-Live type environments for other platforms (i.e. LS-series GM platforms? I would, however, enjoy the ability the handheld would provide to re-load stock tune, do data logging

2. Under drive pulleys
* Are pulleys worth doing, do they really add enough power/throttle response to justify expense (albeit they are not that pricey)? Or are they just one of those generally accepted ‘things’ done to this platform that are dubious w/ regard to actual results (trust me, they are enough of these types of things filling Corvette catalogs that one must remain suspicious).

* Additionally, are there any disadvantages/downsides to changing the rate at which the accessories are driven (longevity, reliability, etc.)

3. Bassani Power-X Crossover w/ hi-flo cats:
* Obviously the cats will flow better, but I’m guessing it doesn’t free up that much power. Is this a worthwhile addition for anything other than sound considerations?

4. American Racing LT headers w/ hi-flo cats:
* Are LT headers a worthwhile addition on this platform. The 32” primary headers w/ merge collectors (LG Motorsports Pros) really woke up the Vette, not so much in peak HP but rather in the more usable and entertaining torque characteristics ‘under the curve’. I’ve read varying opinions on whether or not LT headers are a decent cost vs. performance proposition on the 4.6 3V.

Sorry for the long, rambling message; just trying to avoid some of the expensive mistakes I made w/ the Corvette (i.e. it took me 3 filters/CAI strategies to get the right one and if I had to do it again I’d go with American Racing headers as opposed to the LG Pro’s).

In the end, I’m just looking for a fun, responsive Mustang GT that I’ll take down the 1/4 mile every once in a while, durable and reliable without risking too much w/ regards to killing the warranty. I’m guessing the whole 1/4 performance issue will end up being a question of traction anyway so "ultimate" power isn’t my primary goal, daily entertainment is.

Lemme know what you think…thanks.

[BKid]

Originally Posted by BudgetPlan1

I'm just trying to avoid my general proclivity to doing the wrong thing first; usually the *expensive* wrong thing.

Just picked up a new 2008 Mustang GT 5-speed and after surfing around for a bit, like I need some insight to avoid past mistakes.

As far as background, my current experience w/ computer controlled cars is with our 2004 Corvette. We’ve done the long tube headers, cold air intake thing and when it came time for PCM recalibration, we went with a full dyno tune on a load bearing Mustang dyno. This was done w/ HP Tuners and involved re-mapping fuel and timing tables, torque management reductions, cooling fan adjustments, etc., the ‘full deal.’ I don’t pretend to know the intricacies of this process but I mention it here as, from what I’ve read, tuning the 05+ Mustang platforms seems mostly done by handheld tuners (SCT, Diablo, etc.) which, in the Corvette world, are viewed as less than optimal when compared with custom dyno tuning.

With that in mind, I’m probably gonna limit the Mustang mods (yeah, I know…I say this now) to:

Definitely (also known as “immediately”):
1. C & L Intake w/ some kinda tune
2. Bassani aft-cat exhaust (#46075, already installed; stock exhaust lasted a whole 300 miles)

Possibly (also known as “don’t know if it’s worth it”):
1. Under drive pulleys
2. Bassani Power-X Crossover w/ hi-flo cats

Very remote possibility (also known as “don’t know if it’s worth it ‘cuz this stuff is getting expensive”):
1. American Racing LT headers w/ hi-flo cats.

I have some questions re: the above items I was hoping you could provide some insight on.

1. C & L Intake w/ some kinda tune
* Are people shipping the SCT X-Cal 3 w/ CAI packages? It seems to have some good added features over the previous version, most important to me is enhanced logging and more memory. We use EFI Live to do data logging on the Vette and I really find that ability useful.

* Is a ‘handheld’ tune sufficient for these limited mods, even if I end up doing the pulleys and Power-X crossover sooner rather than later? Or, would it be worthwhile to actually go to a shop and have a true dyno tune done? Is there even software to tune this platform to the extent that they can in the HP Tuners/EFI-Live type environments for other platforms (i.e. LS-series GM platforms? I would, however, enjoy the ability the handheld would provide to re-load stock tune, do data logging

2. Under drive pulleys
* Are pulleys worth doing, do they really add enough power/throttle response to justify expense (albeit they are not that pricey)? Or are they just one of those generally accepted ‘things’ done to this platform that are dubious w/ regard to actual results (trust me, they are enough of these types of things filling Corvette catalogs that one must remain suspicious).

* Additionally, are there any disadvantages/downsides to changing the rate at which the accessories are driven (longevity, reliability, etc.)

3. Bassani Power-X Crossover w/ hi-flo cats:
* Obviously the cats will flow better, but I’m guessing it doesn’t free up that much power. Is this a worthwhile addition for anything other than sound considerations?

4. American Racing LT headers w/ hi-flo cats:
* Are LT headers a worthwhile addition on this platform. The 32” primary headers w/ merge collectors (LG Motorsports Pros) really woke up the Vette, not so much in peak HP but rather in the more usable and entertaining torque characteristics ‘under the curve’. I’ve read varying opinions on whether or not LT headers are a decent cost vs. performance proposition on the 4.6 3V.

Sorry for the long, rambling message; just trying to avoid some of the expensive mistakes I made w/ the Corvette (i.e. it took me 3 filters/CAI strategies to get the right one and if I had to do it again I’d go with American Racing headers as opposed to the LG Pro’s).

In the end, I’m just looking for a fun, responsive Mustang GT that I’ll take down the 1/4 mile every once in a while, durable and reliable without risking too much w/ regards to killing the warranty. I’m guessing the whole 1/4 performance issue will end up being a question of traction anyway so "ultimate" power isn’t my primary goal, daily entertainment is.

Lemme know what you think…thanks.

This is my 2 cents on these mods. I like the CAI AND Tune from Bammachips.com that would be the first. I like the Moto Blue pulleys from Rpmoutlet.com yes noticeable increase in power. I was looking at the Kooks long tube headers with x pipe and high flow cats,very good.American racing also very good just more money. Get some lower control arms,anti-squat brackets,and upper control arm from Cheperformance.This will help traction a lot. Power House 1 piece drive shaft whith che drive shaft loop.If you have an automatic a TCI torque converter would also be good. That about covers the safer mods that will not interfere with your warranty. Now keep in mind if you should have to take your car into the dealer you will have to put you factory box intake back on and return the tune to stock.Unless you buy an Airaid,Kand N, or CnL with insert. I recommend the Airaid, that is what I use it has a 101mm tube with a venturi insert, that can be removed later if your motor ever gets to where it can use that much air.If you leave the venturi in which is recommended for motors that are not built it is great because you do not have to put the factory box back on before going to the dealer,just set the tune back. Oh and GEARS for sure.

[bigwilly43729]

Intake- Fine. I'd get the JLT, but the C&L is just as good. Get a Brenspeed or BamaChips tune, especially if you get headers.

Exhaust- Fine. It's more for sound at the end of the day. Get what you like.

Headers- Fine. Have never heard anything bad about ARH.

UDP's-Leave them on the shelf. I couldn't notice a difference and you want bang for your buck. Some will tell you otherwise, but that's just me.

Midpipe-An H is my personal preference, but that X will be fine.

Invest in some gears and suspension mods as your budget allows. Huge difference in that department as well.

[06hoss]

Welcome to the Mustang Modding World.

First thing I would have to say is that you are absolutely right is saying that a dyno tune is preferred over a canned, hand held tuner tune.
A canned tune is the way to go if you don't want to spend the money of a dyno tune, but a dyno tune will tune the engine much more precisely since it's for your exact engine.

1. C & L Intake w/ some kinda tune...excellent pick. I have the C&L street intake with a Predator tuner. It came bundled that way. The Predator loads tunes a little slower than the SCT, but once you get your dyno tune done and loaded, it really doesn't matter which handheld you have. You may want to shop around if you want an SCT with the C&L....Brenspeed, etc. C & L sells both a street version of the intake and a racer version. They are both very, very close in HP and torque output. The street version is aluminum which will heat soak on you and isn't as good for drag racing as the racer version which is plastic. But you won't notice any difference on the street since the thin plastic actually transfers heat quicker than the thick metal. On the street, you will lose a tiny amount of torque with the racer version since the air velocity actually slows down a tad due to the bigger MAF. You could also look at the JLT CAI...it is another excellent choice.
2. Bassani aft-cat exhaust (#46075, already installed; stock exhaust lasted a whole 300 miles)...If you are talking just about the overaxle pipes or even the entire exhaust with cats, then I hate to tell you on this one since you've already installed it, but you've already hurt the budget on this one. Bassani makes excellent products, but they are more expensive than other quality products. Also, you don't really need an after cat exhaust upgrade on these cars since the stock pipes are already mandrel bent and are stainless. The over axle pipes are the only ones I haven't replaced.
Now if you meant axle back instead of cat back, then we are just talking the mufflers and the sky is the limit on that one. You can go anywhere from slightly louder than stock muffs (either chambered or straight thru) or very loud...you just have to ask around. If you are putting an X pipe on, you may want to stay with a straight through muffler since they eliminate the raspiness better than chambered mufflers. Try looking at Magnaflow or Dynatech...there's another good straight thru out there, but I can't remember it right now.
1. Under drive pulleys ...they provide a small gain...slightly less than 10 HP, but they also give you a small bump in mpg (and we all need that now) and they also reduce wear on all your accessories since they are turning slower. I have the Steeda UDPs which are excellent...they have that technology sharing thing with Ford, so the damper is the exact weight that it should be. MotoBlue also makes a good set. The good thing about the UDPs on these new stangs is that they aren't a piggyback set like they used to use on older stangs. You completely replace the crank pully and damper. I think they're worth it.

Bassani Power-X Crossover w/ hi-flo cats ...that's a very good X pipe but expensive...See below for more info.

American Racing LT headers w/ hi-flo cats... another excellent choice...somebody has been doing their homework...LOL. This is the LT set that I have and I'm very happy with them. You can order the X pipe from them or even an H pipe if you like the sound better. You want to get the smaller primaries (1 5/8 instead of 1 3/4) if you don't plan on going with forced induction or serious head and cam work. The smaller primaries actually have a higher gas velocity on a mildly modded motor than do the larger primaries.

Don't forget a short throw shifter. The latest and greatest seems to be the MGW, but I have an Hurst and am happy with it. You could also get a lighter, one piece driveshaft. This mod is worth more on the newer stangs than it was on the older ones since our stock, 2 piece driveshaft is so heavy (46 lbs). My new driveshaft only weighs 16 pounds. I have a DSS (Drive Shaft Shop) shaft which is a little more expensive than some others our there but they have an excellent Spicer U joint on the unit. There's lots of good, lightweight drive shafts out there though.

Time to get modding my man!

[stlwagon]

Keep in mind that you need the tuner anyway if/when you decide to get a dyno tune down the road.

[06hoss]

Not necessarily. My tuner will do a dyno tune even if you don't have a tuner. He just charges a little more. I think he just uses his laptop instead of a hand held tuner to load it. I've got a hand held so it was cheaper.

[stlwagon]

Originally Posted by 06hoss

Not necessarily. My tuner will do a dyno tune even if you don't have a tuner. He just charges a little more. I think he just uses his laptop instead of a hand held tuner to load it. I've got a hand held so it was cheaper.

I'd say that's the exception. Don't think most tuners have the ability to do that. Either way, I wouldn't want a tune on my PCM that I didn't have access to and also not have the ability to flash back to stock if needed.

[A7X1031]

Originally Posted by stlwagon

I'd say that's the exception. Don't think most tuners have the ability to do that. Either way, I wouldn't want a tune on my PCM that I didn't have access to and also not have the ability to flash back to stock if needed.

Yea I agree, Ford can be real adamant about voiding your warranty if you mess around with the PCM. If you do decide to get a tuner make sure you reflash it when you take it in for service. Anything involving the PCM (basically the brain of your car) is a real touchy thing with Ford because you can alter so many things by it.

[GoStang]

What are your long term goals? If your planning to Turbo/Supercharge the car then spend your money on the things that can help control that power. If not, what has already been said is a great start.

[BudgetPlan1]

Thanks all, good info. I'm not looking for crazy power, just a bit more entertainment. Think I'll do CAI/tune and maybe pulleys for now.

Do like the newer sct tuner (version 3 I think) for the data logging and ability to go back to stock if, um, necessary.

[xchris]

Originally Posted by GoStang

What are your long term goals? If your planning to Turbo/Supercharge the car then spend your money on the things that can help control that power. If not, what has already been said is a great start.

Yea, with all the money you want to spend i would just save it all and supercharge it or even start building the block and then supercharge it

[SirQ]

I'm a noob too, but from what I've read on AFM over the past six months, you might want to take a look at 3.73 or 4.10 gears (stock standard is 3.31, and 3.55 is an upgrade option), it's another relatively easy and inexpensive mod that will add noticeable gofast to the car.

[06hoss]

Originally Posted by stlwagon

I'd say that's the exception. Don't think most tuners have the ability to do that. Either way, I wouldn't want a tune on my PCM that I didn't have access to and also not have the ability to flash back to stock if needed.

They should all have the ability to do it as part of their licensing agreement, but I agree with you that I wouldn't want to go without a handheld either. But, they should be able to go back to stock by going back to their dyno tuner if need be...he should have the stock files not tied to any specific VINs...the handheld vendors tie those files to the VINs when you download them to sell handhelds.
Me, I'm with you, I want the handheld, but I know some of the younger guys have to pinch the penny hard for their mods and you can do a dyno tune without a $400 handheld, it's just nowhere near as convenient.

[jaja6009]

Welcome to our world Budget plan 1. Dam I feel honored a Vette guy steps over to a Mustang.
Heres my 2 cents:
Cold Air intake: Many good brands ( C&L, JLTII, Steeda, Airaid, etc) If you get a tune (Brenspeed, Bama) they all will make really good power. +20hp IMO this is the best mod becuase of the power gain and its so easy to do yourself.

Exhaust: Axle back exhausts will not add any power they are just for sound. S197's have 2 1/2 inch exhaust stock and Ive heard even the exhaust manifolds flow good.
Shorty headers are not worth it. They do not really add peak hp but you will pick up some power elsewhere in the power curve.
Longtubes will add 15-25 hp. They are expensive and need a midpipe to go along. They are hard to install but can be done at home. Some brands will need to be removed to drop your transmission.
Full size x or h pipe: This is if you have stock exhaust manifolds or shorty headers. You can get them with cats or not. Ive seen a magazine get 9 hp and 9ft/lbs from a BBK catted xpipe. Think more without cats but it will get loud.

Also be careful some mufflers and x or h pipes dont sound good when mixed. Thats a thread by itself. But then again sound is opinion.

Pulleys: Steeda and Motoblue seem to be the popular brands. They will add a guranteed 5hp and maybe even get close to 10hp. MPG will increase and you accessories will slow down meaning they should live longer.

Driveshaft: There are many driveshafts out there. The stock driveshaft is a very heavy 2 piece. Some aluminum shafts weigh only 16, 17 pounds. If you have an auto beware sometimes these shafts will have a vibration when letting of the gas quickly or at certain speeds. Ask around. I heard Spydershafts are good for autos.

Shifter: A good aftermarket shifter will get rid of the soft mushy feeling the stock shifter has. Some have adjustable stops so you cant overthrow the shift. They all will offer shorter shifts some more than others. But some shifters will not work with some dirveshafts. Most if not all shifters may feel stiff and notchy.

Gears: get some gears. 410's for maual or 373's for autos. This will really make the car feel different when launched hard. They will reduce MPG because you will be reving higher and are hard to install yourself.

I hope this helped.

Also drag radials on the street or track will help you hook up harder without getting too deep into suspension/traction mods.

[GoStang]

BudgetPlan1, this is a great place to ask questions before you go spend the money and do something. The Ladies and Gentlemen on the sight a very very friendly and helpful. Alot of the can tell you I've been there and done that. I think everyone gets the mod mania feeling, but with this darn car there are many things sometimes that have to be done first before you install the part you really wanted. Just keep in mind your long term goals so you don't end up buying parts that you won't need later.