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Old 04-30-2005   #1 (permalink)
SMP
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Default Anyone SuperCharged thier GT

I will eventually be super charging my mustang gt. I just wanted to know if anyone had used this Votech KIT or heard anything about it. Any feedback would be great.

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/revie...0&sort=1&cat=3

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Old 04-30-2005   #2 (permalink)
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Default Supercharger

Do your homework! Centrifugal superchargers work best at high rpm. If you want to go that way, take a good look at the Procharger. Roots and screw types work throughout the entire RPM range. Kenny Bell told me that they should have a screw type unit available in June or July which should deliver an additional 140 hp. I have heard that Ford racing is replacing the older roots technology with the newer screw type superchargers. Whipple is also a good screw type unit. You will pay more for a screw, but I think it is worth it. A supercharger will probably void the warranty unless you can get your dealer to install it. What the hell! It is just money! If you blow the engine, you can replace it with a 5.0! I plan on getting the Kenny Bell!
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Old 04-30-2005   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crab
Do your homework! Centrifugal superchargers work best at high rpm. If you want to go that way, take a good look at the Procharger. Roots and screw types work throughout the entire RPM range. Kenny Bell told me that they should have a screw type unit available in June or July which should deliver an additional 140 hp. I have heard that Ford racing is replacing the older roots technology with the newer screw type superchargers. Whipple is also a good screw type unit. You will pay more for a screw, but I think it is worth it. A supercharger will probably void the warranty unless you can get your dealer to install it. What the hell! It is just money! If you blow the engine, you can replace it with a 5.0! I plan on getting the Kenny Bell!
Yeah i will will wait...not in a hurry..Want to see what's out there and who blows thier engine first...
Have you seen some of the specs for the Shelby 06? They are saying 40,000....... I wish I could get my hands on one of those... I guess i will have to stick with my 05 GT.....







Shelby Cobra GT500's supercharged 5.4-liter DOHC V-8 produces over 450 hp

Just as the original Shelby GT500 was the "step up" to big-block power from the GT350, the new Ford Shelby Cobra GT500 steps up to Ford's 5.4-liter "MOD" V-8. The result? The GT500 is the most powerful factory Mustang ever. Its supercharged 5.4-liter, 32-valve V-8 evolves from SVT's experience with supercharging the "MOD" engine to deliver more than 450 horsepower and 450 foot-pounds of torque. The cast-iron-block, four-valve engine is force-fed an air-and-fuel mixture via a screw-type supercharger at 8.5
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Old 04-30-2005   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crab
Do your homework! Centrifugal superchargers work best at high rpm. If you want to go that way, take a good look at the Procharger. Roots and screw types work throughout the entire RPM range. Kenny Bell told me that they should have a screw type unit available in June or July which should deliver an additional 140 hp. I have heard that Ford racing is replacing the older roots technology with the newer screw type superchargers. Whipple is also a good screw type unit. You will pay more for a screw, but I think it is worth it. A supercharger will probably void the warranty unless you can get your dealer to install it. What the hell! It is just money! If you blow the engine, you can replace it with a 5.0! I plan on getting the Kenny Bell!
Good advice! I'm considering the Vortech. I won't be drag racing ... I'll be doing most of my driving on the expressway. I have an auto and once you punch it you are at 4000 rpms right in the power range of the vortech. My tranny might not take much over 400 rwhp so I need to be wise about what I'm doing. The guys at Alternative Auto are advising me. They have an 05 auto (they own) that they are moding right now. Once they get their car right I'm turning mine over to them. Good luck with your choice.
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Old 04-30-2005   #5 (permalink)
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I'll believe that $40K Shelby when I see it. I think it's supposed to be an 07, too...

In the meantime, I just picked up a Saleen Series VI blower for my GT. I'll post some results when my other mods come and I get it installed and tuned.
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Old 04-30-2005   #6 (permalink)
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So there are three types of super-chargers?
1)Roots
2)Centrifugal
3)Scew type

i understang that Vortech is Centrifugal, so does kenne or anyone else make a Scew type Supercharger for the stang gt?

Also a lot of people get screw and Roots mixed up so here is some diffrences:

Twin Screw vs. Roots SC arrangement

It's in PDF format so you need adobe reader but I'll post a few highlights here...






TWIN SCREW vs. ROOTS


Because of their ability to produce an abundance of boost (HP and torque) at virtually any engine rpm, the Twin Screw and Roots type are the two
most logical choices for supercharging. Both are essentially positive displacement SUPERCHARGERS (each revolution produces "X" cfm
regardless of engine rpm). Although their appearance is similar, one should not confuse the two. Internally they are as different as night and day.
LOWER POWER CONSUMPTION: The Twin Screw requires 10-16 less HP (depending on boost) to drive, leaving more horsepower for the
engine to transmit to the vehicle wheels for increased acceleration, passing, towing, hill climbing.
COOLER CHARGE TEMP: It also discharges air into the engine at a much lower temperature. The cooler denser air charge from the Twin Screw
equates to even more engine horsepower and torque potential with less thermal stresses on the engine.
INTERNAL COMPRESSION: The Twin Screw compresses the air between the rotors. This "internal compression" means less work to boost the
air pressure and quicker boost delivery to the engine. The compressed (boosted) air resides in the supercharger and makes it behave like an air
tank . . . squeeze the throttle and out comes the boosted air. The amount and boost level depends on throttle depression.
Eaton Corp. who is currently manufacturing the Roots type - and is also licensed to produce the Twin Screw - has this to say in their literature when
comparing them: "A Screw Compressor [Twin Screw] also provides more air for an engine's cylinders but it first compresses the air, thus
providing more boost than a Roots [Eaton] type supercharger. The additional boost allows engine manufacturers to extract more power
from an engine." ...Eaton Corporation


MORE:

It has come to our attention that our potential customers, enthusiasts and the media often confuse the "Roots" style superchargers with the "Twin
Screw." They all labor under the false misconception that both of these positive displacement superchargers are identical in operating principle and
efficiency! Frequently the Twin Screw is referred to as a "Roots." It IS NOT a Roots. These products ARE NOT THE SAME! (see Twin Screw vs. Roots
Operation).
It has been well documented in numerous tests by automotive engineers around the world that the Twin Screw concept is, unquestionably, more
efficient (cooler air charge temperature and lower parasitic loss). Ford, GM, Chrysler, Saab, Volvo etc. are among the many who have tested the Twin
Screw. The Mazda Millenia has used one for years and in 2001 Mercedes selected the Twin Screw for their latest high performance cars.
It is not our intent to knock the Roots type. Both are proven, reliable OEM quality superchargers. However, the Twin Screw is clearly more efficient.
Over 80 companies, including Eaton, have been licensed to produce the patented highly efficient Twin Screw rotors for compressors and
superchargers. Millions have been produced. The Twin Screw is a product who's time has come.
The superchargers tested were the Kenne Bell/Autorotor 3150 (Twin Screw) and a popular comparable Roots type. Both are rated at 1.5L and
recommended for applications up to 450HP. They were tested at 12000 rpm and 70° at sea level with the 3 boost levels indicated. Both are commonly
used superchargers. Two larger superchargers - a Roots type and a Kenne Bell/Autorotor 420 Twin Screw with ratings of 600HP - were also tested.
Again the test results confirmed the Twin Screw enjoyed up to 30% lower air charge temp and 30% less parasitic loss at all 3 boost levels.
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Old 05-01-2005   #7 (permalink)
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$$ is preventing me from doing it at the moment... I can't afford both a S/C and a new motor this year! I look forward to hearing which S/Cs work well and which are simply too much for the GT motor. My instinct is to go with a twin screw... my (possibly flawed) rationale is if the top fuel dragsters aren't permitted to use a twin screw, it's gotta be good!
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Old 05-01-2005   #8 (permalink)
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Check out this link:

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/...sp?ProdID=1208

This will give you an Idea of pricing and performance gains. Also, with the whipple kit, all you have to do is replace the PCM and the fuel pump with thier supplied parts. Much easier install than many systems. This is what I'm putting on my Stang, and it should be available be end of May!!!!

Charles
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Old 05-01-2005   #9 (permalink)
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...and to answer your question "does kenne or anyone else make a Scew type Supercharger for the stang gt?"

Whipple has or will very soon produce a twin screw supercharger for the 'stang GT. Same for Kenne Bell. The Saleen Series VI is also twin screw.

Procharger, Paxton, and Vortech are all centrifugal (at least for the 05 Mustang)
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Old 05-01-2005   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delurker
...and to answer your question "does kenne or anyone else make a Scew type Supercharger for the stang gt?"

Whipple has or will very soon produce a twin screw supercharger for the 'stang GT. Same for Kenne Bell. The Saleen Series VI is also twin screw.

Procharger, Paxton, and Vortech are all centrifugal (at least for the 05 Mustang)
NOW the 5Million dollar question or the price of a new Motor. How much can these Stangs take? I don't want to blow it up . I love my warranty
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Old 05-01-2005   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckles
Check out this link:

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/...sp?ProdID=1208

This will give you an Idea of pricing and performance gains. Also, with the whipple kit, all you have to do is replace the PCM and the fuel pump with thier supplied parts. Much easier install than many systems. This is what I'm putting on my Stang, and it should be available be end of May!!!!

Charles
Good post..........I like the performance figures for that supercharger...
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Old 05-01-2005   #12 (permalink)
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Like all previous generation Mustangs, it will be popular to supercharge the 2005.

Knowing how this engine will hold up is pretty much a slam dunk. The short block is the same as all previous 4.6L engines. And a supercharger puts stress on the shortblock components. The only unknowns may be head gasket seal, valve seating, and the dual intake runners. The valve train itself has little stress.

This is going to be a GREAT engine for supercharging. Like the 4V Cobra engines, Ford got great intake flows to get the current HP out of it. The SC will just enhance this feature.

Between the Twin Screw and the Centrifugal superchargers??? Well, I know both. Here is my opinion.

1) Ease of intall?.....Hands down the twin screw

2) Looks? the twin screw

3) Fit?.........Centrifugal, because on the twin screw you will have to cut a hole in your hood possibly.

4) Performance?............Centrifugal superchargers.............I know there is going to be a lot of opinions on this one, but the only reason the twin screw has gotten any recognition is do to the 03-04 Cobra. It came with it, so enthuisasts are stuck with it. Not many will go twin screw by choice. The Centrifugal superchargers will make more HP and they are cheaper. They are harder to install, but easier to get the engine tuned. I would guess that companies who will sell the twin screw are going to have a difficult time getting the new 'fly by wire" and tempermental engine management system of the 05 to like what they have done. The twin screws have to come up with a completely new intake system and get it to run right, whereas the Centrifugal superchargers can use most of the stock system.


The reason Ford uses the twin screw is because of the assembly line. It is more efficient to install. And with the new Cobra coming out with one, this debate will most likely get hotter.

The Vortech is suppose to be done. I read some pretty incredible numbers in the recent MM&FF on the 05 with a Paxton Centrifugal supercharger. How about 613HP!!! I think the factory short block will hold up well for many miles around the 425 RWHP mark. You should expect prices for the new SC's to be right around the $4K mark, plus install. You can expect to pay around $1K for install and misc parts. Highly recommend you go the Intercooled route, which most will be. You will also want to upgrade your clutch fairly soon after the install, the stock one won't last long. Fortunately, the 2005 GT has stronger parts in it, that should make the car better for an SC then previous years. For example 31 spline axles, better suspension, a more rigid body, etc.

You guys will become like the rest of us. At first we didn't see the need to void our warranties for Mods on our first Mustangs, but you will some become part of the "Collective"

Hope this helps!
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Old 05-01-2005   #13 (permalink)
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Regarding the tune... don't they all come with a new computer? (And fuel pumps...)

I think I'll have my top swopped out before, hopefully taking the guess work outa the stress point on stock valves, lifters, etc...

I'm also a bit weary about the stock alu block... should be fine they say... then we have the pistons with rings, rods, crank... But I'm sure we'll all know in a few months where the 'weak' parts are... hopefully it will be published...

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Old 05-01-2005   #14 (permalink)
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Default Probably going with the saleen Twin Screw...

I like the Saleen the best of what I have seen. Here are the pros I see with this unit:

1) 400hp with only 5 psi of boost. Engine will run cooler and I doubt that the stock Auto ( my car ) could take much more than 400hp.

2) This unit fits completely under the stock hood.

3) No tubing running all over the place with multiple air connections to come loose. It uses the stock intake system. The inter cooler is a water to air unit built into the intake system.

4) It is EPA 50 state approved.

5) The super charger is inverted. This allows longer runner tubes to improve bottom end torque.

6) Comes with a custom tune by Saleen matched to the car.

Cons:

1) Darn thing costs $5,000...

Hope to order one soon. I am working with my dealer ( a Saleen dealer ) to hopfully get a little better price and get it installed.
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Old 05-01-2005   #15 (permalink)
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Procharger makes great quality blowers I would consider
the Procharger though.
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