I read your story. Several observations.
I am surprised you went back to the dealer after being "stung" the first time. I am sure there would be a dealer in the area, hearing the first story and your potential purchases, would have cut you a comparative deal.
I think there is something to be said about - fool me once shame on me, fool me twice - shame on me. Fool me 3 times - well you get the picture.
In a fight, never pull a gun or break the neck off a bottle unless you are going to use it. Never threaten, I will go to the Attorney General, Go and make the complaint. Go somewhere else and buy the car. Remember - everything has a cost. The "deals" you got at the dealer cost you at the Finance companies. They have heard all the stories, and saying the dealer did not pay will be hard to believe with your name on the account.
Oh well, drive happy.
Well, they are certainly guilty of being dumbasses, in the first degree. It will feel really good to hear you get satisfaction out of this!
I worked for a car dealership (sales) and it was an amazing experience for which I am grateful. The salesmen were genuinely nice people and never wanted a customer to have a bad experience. A surprising number of very devoutly religious people are in sales. Of the six salesmen I worked with, one was a Seventh Day Adventist and another was a Jehovah's Witness (I never told them where I lived ).
The owners and managers are under a lot of pressure and generally work 11-14 hour days, frequently six days a week. All but one were divorced and currently had a drug or alcohol problem or were in a support group for drugs or alcohol. It is an exceedingly emotional game. How long could you stand people rejecting you, day in day out, before it got to you?
What happens when things start to get behind, financially?
Customers get hurt.
The dealership seems to have gotten into a bad situation but that's no reason to get hurt by them. I can't wait to hear what happens.
Hey Mr. V, this reminds me a little of the Erpenbeck Housing/Banking scandal that happened here in Cincinnati a few years ago. The guy was seriously robbing Peter to pay Paul until he crashed and burned and left a lot of people holding the bag when they bought new houses built by him and their old houses were not paid off.
If you have time on your hands, this link contains all the related newspaper articles in chronological order...starting at the bottom.
I read your story. Several observations.
I am surprised you went back to the dealer after being "stung" the first time. I am sure there would be a dealer in the area, hearing the first story and your potential purchases, would have cut you a comparative deal.
I think there is something to be said about - fool me once shame on me, fool me twice - shame on me. Fool me 3 times - well you get the picture.
In a fight, never pull a gun or break the neck off a bottle unless you are going to use it. Never threaten, I will go to the Attorney General, Go and make the complaint. Go somewhere else and buy the car. Remember - everything has a cost. The "deals" you got at the dealer cost you at the Finance companies. They have heard all the stories, and saying the dealer did not pay will be hard to believe with your name on the account.
Oh well, drive happy.
Understandable that I am no doubt a fool. However, I am firm believer anyone can make an honest mistake. So the first time the dealer's excuse was believeable. The second time I was a bit concerned. The thrid time I put my trust in a family friend. My family has known and worked with Carl for nearly 15 years. Oops my bad for trusting in a "friend."
As for the State Attroney General, that was not an idle threat. I did not threaten the dealer with going to the AG, I simply told them to expect a lawsuit, which I have initiated. I have actually already made the formal complaint to the state AG, the local DA and the CA DMV...no threat, but action taken.
I am fully aware that the finance company expects payment from me unless the loan has been transferred, assumed, paid off, or otherwise closed; hence why I made a payment to protect my credit. It just adds to the damamges I will collect form the dealer. No dobut I will not be doing business with his dealer, nor will anyone I know.
What scares me is that you can sic the IRS on them, things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm(I wouldn't ever want to beat you at poker)
Believe it or not, the legal community is not as big as one might think. I am a government lawyer, I happen to have serveral friends and colleauges that work for the IRS, the DOJ, the State AG, several DAs, the State Franchise Tax Board and several other government agencies. You would be surprised what can be accomplished via a handshake or a good golf game.
[quote=$teve;585106]Yes this is fraud, def. a misrepresentation of a fact, that is material, with knowledge of its falsity and intention to deceive. Actually multiple counts of fraud.
Dealer is over his head in debt as many others commented. He begging from Peter to pay Paul. Problem is he messing with people's credit histories along the way.
AG's office needs a letter with your post in it. May want to send it to the local paper if you are in a nasty mood.[/quote]
Done that as well as contacted a local new station to talk to their "problem solvers."
5 years ago a local (Portland OR) used car dealer lost its dealer license for not paying off trade ins. It would be a great winfall if a dealer could wait until they sell your trade in to pay for it. Sounds like this dealer is about to go belly up if the issuing bank will not cash a check from them.
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06 Redfire GT, Whipple 3.4L 18#'s of blow, 4r70W etc.
5 years ago a local (Portland OR) used car dealer lost its dealer license for not paying off trade ins. It would be a great winfall if a dealer could wait until they sell your trade in to pay for it. Sounds like this dealer is about to go belly up if the issuing bank will not cash a check from them.
My goal is to help facilitate this dealer loosing their license, going belly up and costing them as much as possible in that time.
Okay, maybe I can be a bit vindictive. But in my opinion, they need to learn their lessons and maybe other dealers might learn a thing or two (I grant, not likely, but one can hope).
sounds like the dealer is working on a floorplan...meaning that they have the vehicles on the lot financed and a pymt is due every 90 days or so...they can sell a trade at the auctions with no title and that just means that the dealer who bought that car at the auction can not sell it until the title is present....which is why I rarely buy an auction car w/o the tilte present..I own a small car lot...years ago I had the same thing happen to me, traded in a car and it took 2 months to get it paid off. I called an attorney and she told me that there was no time limit for them to pay it off and next time I traded to make them write it in the contract that they would pay off in 30 days.....
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I was depressed last night so I called Lifeline.
Got connected to a call center in Pakistan.
I told them I was suicidal.
They got all excited and asked if I could drive a truck.
My goal is to help facilitate this dealer loosing their license, going belly up and costing them as much as possible in that time.
Okay, maybe I can be a bit vindictive. But in my opinion, they need to learn their lessons and maybe other dealers might learn a thing or two (I grant, not likely, but one can hope).
if there have beeen previous complaints at the DMV they prob want to shut em down also...it's really hard to do that tho... Good Luck! Your best bet is to find a dealer that has had problems with them...the DMV is tougher on dealer to dealer sales than dealer to consumer....
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I was depressed last night so I called Lifeline.
Got connected to a call center in Pakistan.
I told them I was suicidal.
They got all excited and asked if I could drive a truck.
Interesting story, almost the same thing happening to a small dealer here in NH. Not making the payoffs on trade-ins. What I heard had happened was they were so anxious about making sales in a crappy market that they were giving great deals on the trades. Now they can't unload those trades if, only at auction putting them behind that 8 ball. I bet you find this very common right now with the car market in the crapper.
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"Too many people spend money they haven't earned to buy things they don't want to impress people they don't like"
it's hard to survive a slow market in the car business if you are not careful....I own all my inventory and will never have a floor plan and I do not take trades that have large balances owed....there was a dealer here that went to jail for doing what this dealer is doing....
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I was depressed last night so I called Lifeline.
Got connected to a call center in Pakistan.
I told them I was suicidal.
They got all excited and asked if I could drive a truck.
Shame on the dealer 2X and shame on you the third. By the way who is financing your autos? FMCC is a division of Ford Motor Company and usually floors the cars on they lot also, meaning they actually own they cars unless they dealer pays for them in full and the dealer only pays interest and that is why they sell the older stock number for less. If the bank was not FMCC I wouldn't ever go back to the dealer. At a Ford dealership you should look at financing through FMCC 1st. Not who they say will finance you because they usually get a kickback of a interest point that you pay for anyway.
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