[MustangFaith72]

Well, a few weeks back, I complained to Ford about a bad engine tick between 1000 and 2000 RPMs. The tick sounded like you were clicking the ignitor on your grill or hot water heater. Ford's fix was to put a mystery additive in the oil. The tick went away immediately, and Ford alleged the solution would be permanent. See here:

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/2011-mustang-gt-tech/250613-2011-mustang-5-0-engine-problem-fords-strange-fix.html

I drove the car the next 1500 miles or so, and the "ignitor" tick didn't come back (I thought I heard it once, but it was so faint that I wouldn't have let it bother me). However, the idle quality began to slowly deteriorate at idle. It always had a funny tick/chirp on the passenger side that Ford said was "normal," but now it sounds like it has a stereotypical "lifter tick" when warm at idle and just off idle. It sounds awful.

But wait, it gets better . . . .

When the additive was put in, I was told I could still change my oil at the next scheduled interval, and the ignitor tick would still be gone. So, I changed my oil at it's normal interval, and the noise immediately came back with a vengence!! So, I now have the awful ignitor sounding tick right off idle, and I now have what sounds like a lifter tick at idle (I realize the car doesn't have lifters, but that's what the tick sounds like).

But wait, it gets better . . .

When I brought the car back to the dealer (who has been outstanding in trying to help me with this), they contacted Ford. Ford wants the dealer to try and isolate the "lifter tick" to one bank or another, thinking it might be bad lash adjusters. As for the "ignitor tick," Ford wants the dealer to drain two quarts of oil out, and replace them with 75w-140 rear end lubricant! They claim the noise will go away with break in, and that adding two quarts of this thick lubricant will speed the process up. Of course, they can't say how long the car must be given to "break in." Note, I have about 5000 miles on it now.

So, the owner's manual says that the car needs 5w-20, but they want to replace 1/4 of the oil with something about as thick as tar.

This is unbelievable . .

 

[Yeahdoug]

I have the ignitor sounding tick. When I first bought the car it did it while at idle. Over time it has gotten fainter and now does it only around 2000 RPM, not at idle anymore. I have 5000 miles. I'm hoping it will be completely gone eventually. I've heard a few different stories about what it could be. Multiple people have said it was directly related to the production hold a few months back. No one from Ford will come clean with what component is making the noise.

 

[cdog1157]

That sucks, I'm gonna be so freaking paranoid when I get my car. I will definately drive it first and if it's got a ignitor tick then I will not be buying. I'll just wait a few more months for the 2012, maybe a Boss, and maybe they'll have all that figured out.

 

[1BADCOYOTE]

Noise occurred for me after 5w50 synthetic put in the crankcase. Removed 5w50 and put in 5w30 Pennz Synthetic, voila! noise gone. Now with mods and exhaust cannot hear any noise if there was one anyway. The problem here, is we do not know the true extent of any problem or if it even exists; it may be just noise. The noise coupled with the lack of answers or reasonable solutions does raise some concerns, however.

 

[orgchem]

I was really stoked about ordering a 2011 GT sometime this month; but all these recent posts about problems are making me hesitate a bit... so conflicted!

 

[MustangFaith72]

FORDMOPAR -- it is important to note the noises I am experiencing are not small things that most would ignore. These are loud, embarrassing ticks that even my wife asked WTF?

As for others thinking of ordering a 5.0, it would be irrational to think that you likely to have the same problem. However, Ford's response has been enough to make me think I won't be ordering another. My problems are easily solved with a new engine -- but Ford instead wants to throw 2 quarts of tar in my current powerplant.

 

[Nuclearranger]

I hope you get this resolved. However I think your entitled to a new engine under the lemon laws if this happens so many times. Not sure, might want to look into it.

 

[Blubyu]

Mine makes a tick at idle, and if I am in a drive thru I can hear it off the wall! I wonder if this is the same ticking now I cannot hear it while driving! Do you think I should be worried it is a really faint ticking, but I was told that it is normal for this motor with the high compression, that this is something that just comes with it! Not sure??

 

[Ben99GT]

Well, a few weeks back, I complained to Ford about a bad engine tick between 1000 and 2000 RPMs. The tick sounded like you were clicking the ignitor on your grill or hot water heater. Ford's fix was to put a mystery additive in the oil. The tick went away immediately, and Ford alleged the solution would be permanent. See here:

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/2011-mustang-gt-tech/250613-2011-mustang-5-0-engine-problem-fords-strange-fix.html

I drove the car the next 1500 miles or so, and the "ignitor" tick didn't come back (I thought I heard it once, but it was so faint that I wouldn't have let it bother me). However, the idle quality began to slowly deteriorate at idle. It always had a funny tick/chirp on the passenger side that Ford said was "normal," but now it sounds like it has a stereotypical "lifter tick" when warm at idle and just off idle. It sounds awful.

But wait, it gets better . . . .

When the additive was put in, I was told I could still change my oil at the next scheduled interval, and the ignitor tick would still be gone. So, I changed my oil at it's normal interval, and the noise immediately came back with a vengence!! So, I now have the awful ignitor sounding tick right off idle, and I now have what sounds like a lifter tick at idle (I realize the car doesn't have lifters, but that's what the tick sounds like).

But wait, it gets better . . .

When I brought the car back to the dealer (who has been outstanding in trying to help me with this), they contacted Ford. Ford wants the dealer to try and isolate the "lifter tick" to one bank or another, thinking it might be bad lash adjusters. As for the "ignitor tick," Ford wants the dealer to drain two quarts of oil out, and replace them with 75w-140 rear end lubricant! They claim the noise will go away with break in, and that adding two quarts of this thick lubricant will speed the process up. Of course, they can't say how long the car must be given to "break in." Note, I have about 5000 miles on it now.

So, the owner's manual says that the car needs 5w-20, but they want to replace 1/4 of the oil with something about as thick as tar.

This is unbelievable . .

Your oil "additive" was probably some 10W-40 as per the 3V TSB.

I absolutely do not believe FORD told the dealer to put an extremely high in Phosphorus GEAR LUBE into your engine. It sounds like the dealer is feeding you a line not to mention would likely void Ford's own emission systems warranty.

You may want to consider putting in some 0W-40 to see if that combats the issue. Ford is specifying 5W-50 in the '12 Boss 302 FWIW.

 

[F91]

Excellent post Ben!!!

 

[1BADCOYOTE]

FORDMOPAR -- it is important to note the noises I am experiencing are not small things that most would ignore. These are loud, embarrassing ticks that even my wife asked WTF?

As for others thinking of ordering a 5.0, it would be irrational to think that you likely to have the same problem. However, Ford's response has been enough to make me think I won't be ordering another. My problems are easily solved with a new engine -- but Ford instead wants to throw 2 quarts of tar in my current powerplant.

I have no doubt the engine noise is loud. But my point is Ford does not have an answer as to what the cause of concern is, is it a part where imminent failure is a possibility or is it as simple as parts yet to be broken in? The noise still present after 5000 miles and the mystery additives and rear end goop solutions makes me think someone is throwing "everything" against the wall to see what sticks. This trial and error solution, making the customer's vehicle the guinnea pig, is no solution in my book.

 

[MustangFaith72]

Excellent post Ben!!!

Actually, not really.

The dealer has been outstanding, and I'm sure wouldn't make this up. As a matter of a fact, before Ford told my dealer to put in the rear end lube, they had it done for at least one other person (and it didn't work). See here:

OASIS Special Service Message on my 2011 - Page 2 - SVTPerformance

As for the original additive, again, I saw the bottle. It was a pint of what looked like shoe polish, not 10w-40 motor oil.

And myself, I won't be putting in anything that is not strictly called for, i.e. 5w-20, as I don't want to be blamed for the problem. At one point, after seeing posts on this forum where a member was told 5w-50 was okay, I asked if changing the oil weight was authorized -- and the Regional Field Rep and the Dealer Rep both told me 'no.' Also, see FORDMOPAR's post about 5w-50 making his engine sound worse.

FORDMOPAR -- gotcha . . . and I agree. Ford is swinging wildly in the dark here.

 

[SJPONY]

I'm sorry to hear of your issues. However, you said you changed the oil at the regular ingterval, yet you just now have 5000 miles on it. I'm not trying to say it is related to anything ,but, out of curiousity, why did you change the oil before 5000 miles?

 

[F91]

No, really. Ben seems to know what he's talking about and offered a solution that seemed to be more based in the possibility of actually working than some of the Engineers involved have suggested. I'm starting to get curious about this now also. How many times has the oil been changed in your car? I plan on running a heavier weight oil based on some comments here. a 5w-40 is going to void my warranty? Honest? Anybody do the screwdriver trick to determine where the noise is actually coming from? Pulling the valve cover won't show wear on the affected part?

Actually, not really.

The dealer has been outstanding, and I'm sure wouldn't make this up. As a matter of a fact, before Ford told my dealer to put in the rear end lube, they had it done for at least one other person (and it didn't work). See here:

OASIS Special Service Message on my 2011 - Page 2 - SVTPerformance

As for the original additive, again, I saw the bottle. It was a pint of what looked like shoe polish, not 10w-40 motor oil.

And myself, I won't be putting in anything that is not strictly called for, i.e. 5w-20, as I don't want to be blamed for the problem. At one point, after seeing posts on this forum where a member was told 5w-50 was okay, I asked if changing the oil weight was authorized -- and the Regional Field Rep and the Dealer Rep both told me 'no.' Also, see FORDMOPAR's post about 5w-50 making his engine sound worse.

FORDMOPAR -- gotcha . . . and I agree. Ford is swinging wildly in the dark here.

 

[Alticavis]

Im just throwing this out there as a FWIW......

Obviously there is some sort of issue regarding your concerns. thats not going to be what I address.....

What I will address is the concern of Ford determining the problem, and engineering a solution.

We all understand that things can be designed perfectly, but in the real world have a couple problems. That seems to be the case here. Now what we have to remember is if there is a technical issue/design issue internal to the engine, then someone has to figure it out, right???

For example, You have a Check Engine Light on, the technician has to do diagnosis to determine the cause of the Light......it seems when there are technical/design issues with an engine, the Ford Engineers must do the same exact thing, the only difference is Ford Technicians have pinpoint charts that the Engineers design to help diagnose a CEL, Ford Engineers may not necesarilly have the same type of thing.....

Thats why they are trying different things in an attempt to fix. Its their form of Diagnosis, and if your car just happens to be one of the 1st to exhibit the problem, or even one of the select few that might, it seems reasonable to assume that there may be more involved in the process of determining the fix......

These TSB's, and SSM's dont come from the sky, they come from seeing, and feeling the components exhibiting any certain type of problem - the more they see, the easier it is to pinpoint. Things like this take time - I do sympathize with you knowing that it is taking time away from your enjoyment of the car, but think of it this way - your car is helping Ford design a fix, so that other cars may continue........


I say cut Ford and the Engineers some slack - I guarantee that they are working around the clock to determine a fix. This engine is the new Poster Boy for Ford, and the Mustang. They arent just going to say 'kiss my ass' to the engine.......

Again, FWIW,

Matt

 

[MustangFaith72]

Thanks for the input.

SJPONY -- While Ford is advertising a 10k oil change interval, the manual says to change it when the oil life indicator says so, or 10k miles, whichever comes first. My oil change indicator is working on a 5000 interval, so that's what I am doing.

I did change it at 1200 miles just to be cautious, with the expectation of changing it again at 5000 and then going on 5000 mile intervals from there on out. Because of my schedule, it actually got changed this time at 4600+ or so. I knew I'd be busy the next week, and the Ford engineer made it clear that I could change it on my interval (after the additive was put in), and the tick would still be gone. Wrong-o.

F91 -- I wasn't trying to disrespect you or Ben, just pointing out the inaccuracies in his post. I haven't used anything but the 5w-20 because I don't want Ford to blame me for the problems. As for voiding the warranty, they would have to prove using the different weight is what caused the problem, but I don't want to wage that war.

Alticavis -- I hear you. But, in this case, it is obvious Ford is not trying to find the real fix, just swinging wildly in the dark in hopes of keeping their repair costs down. I'm a capitalist, so I understand what they are thinking . . . it's cheaper to risk lawsuits and consumer complaints then to fix these the right way.

 

[F91]

Cid- I am truly hoping that the car gets fixed. I also think Ford is letting this run it's course. If they cannot diagnose the problem, they are waiting for it to break. If it turns out to be a global issue, you bet your bottom they want to fix it.
Good luck, I wish you nothing but the best.

 

[Alticavis]

Alticavis -- I hear you. But, in this case, it is obvious Ford is not trying to find the real fix, just swinging wildly in the dark in hopes of keeping their repair costs down. I'm a capitalist, so I understand what they are thinking . . . it's cheaper to risk lawsuits and consumer complaints then to fix these the right way.

I see where you are going.......Along your same lines, maybe they have a good idea on what the failure is already, but are trying to go about the least intrusive way of repair, before breaking down to buy a whole engine......(in you case, I would probably demand an engine replacement after all the BS)

It seems to make sense as a business to try the most cost effective route possible - hypothetical quote from Ford - 'it seems issue MAY be fluid related - lets try some additives and see what happens' -- if additives work, then problem solved, cheaply, BUT if they dont work, 'well, looks like its time to start taking these apart and inspecting them'......

Cidsamuth, Im with you 100%. something does need to be done somehow or another......Im just throwing stuff out there, hoping not to make too big of a fool of myself

 

[SJPONY]

cidasmuth, that is more clear. Mine is on a 5000 schedule also. I just wondered why you changed it again before 5000. With all this going on, I'm waiting until 5000. First, they can't fault me for following a guideline more strict than the manual and on target with the oil indicater. Second, I was told not to change it by a certified mechanic and I'll stick by his word. I'm also sticking with the 5/20 so I can't be blamed for any issues that may aries.

I also have a 100K mile warranty, so if it blows up and I have followed all the maintencance recommendations/requirements, then so be it. I certainly don't want that, but that is why I got the warranty.

I really do hopoe you get your car worked out. It sucks that you now have a bad taste for Ford. They are not the best, but they are among the better options out there right now in terms of quality, reliability and value.

My 2010 F-150 has had no issues, nor did my 2010 Mustang or my 2011 Mustang so far (knocking on wood). My 2010 Chrysler 300C goes in soon for a recall and several warranty items. So far, I'm least happy with it, although I'm not totally unhappy. They all have their issues.

 

[Ben99GT]

F91 -- I wasn't trying to disrespect you or Ben, just pointing out the inaccuracies in his post. I haven't used anything but the 5w-20 because I don't want Ford to blame me for the problems. As for voiding the warranty, they would have to prove using the different weight is what caused the problem, but I don't want to wage that war.

I made that post before I read your other post, I didn't realize you actually saw the bottle containing the additive. I still find it incredibly hard to believe Ford engineers suggested a 75W-140 gear oil for the engine. Keep in mind gear oils are outrageously high in phosphorus/SAPS in order to provide the necessary protection for the extreme pressure sliding movement seen with hypoid gears. Also, while gear oils are incredibly high in phosphorus they are also low in zinc (the detergent part of ZDDP) as gear lubes were not formulated to deal with combustion byproducts. Ford is calling for low SAPs motor oils to protect the emissions systems warranty.

Also keep in mind that a 140 weight gear lube is equivalent in viscosity to a 60 weight motor oil, which are available and better suited to an engine and emissions systems.

Viscosity Charts

If the dealer wants to put a 75W-140 gear lube into your engine, I'd tell them you prefer 2 quarts of this: http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=130&pcid=21

Compare the viscosity (in centistokes) to this 75-140 gear lube: http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=39&pcid=4

As you can see, they are virtually identical.