What I am saying is that they dont produce a ram air effect. They are nothing more than a glorified CAI. Period. I suppose they work to get air to the filter, so in that respect...sure they work.
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'97 GT with 80mm C&L MAF, C<rue-Flow CAI, MAC 70mm TB, Superchip, 180 thermo, B&M Ripper, King Cobra Clutch, FRPP aluminum quad/adj cable, MAC O/R H pipe, MIL's, Flows, Granatelli Solid control arms, FRPP 4.10's, FRPP aluminum driveshaft, Fidanza aluminum flywheel, FRPP 9mm wires, TMD aluminum U/D pulleys, Steeda full length SFC's (welded in), and 17" polished aluminum Cobra wheels with Nitto 555 Extremes, Kenwood/Alpine sound. Waiting for install: PI intake.
Originally posted by Fordgasm So you are saying that the shaker on the 2003 Mach does not work? I think it looks great and I think it does work but not at low speeds.
I usually just like to read and pick up information as this is a great forum with lots of information and knowlegeable people, however, in this case I take issue with the "vetteguru" regarding the Ram Air write up. After reading what was mostly a disertation on everyone else's misunderstanding of fluid dynamics, mechanics and fluid flow theories, as well as vetteguru's self appointed wisdom, this write up could have been pared down to about 1/3 of its length to get to the point.
What is being missed is that putting a "scoop" or "gathering device" into the path of any fluid moving past it, no matter what the shape, will cause some of the fluid to be diverted through it...be it liquid or gas. BTW-Intake Velocity Stacks are a great way to increase flow without an increase in pressure and they neck down from a larger diameter to a smaller diameter. (BZZZT...guess I'm not going home with the consolation prize just yet!)
The point is, that with Ram Air the "fluid", i.e. air, in a engine's intake, is not intended to be pressurized. The intent is to allow more air to be available to the intake so that ambient atmospheric pressure is more easily maintained inside of the intake for the use of the engine as the engine speed and load increase. That is, there is always sufficent air volume on hand at the intake to avoid a shortage inside of the intake as the requirements of the engine increase...or looking at it still another way, there is less chance of seeing a vacuume in the intake. Incurring a vacuume inside of the intake starves the engine for air. Ram air is a enhancement of the engine intake system for efficency resulting in better flow if designed properly, but in no way a power adder.
Installed in an automobile, the engine has to have various configurations of air plumbing due to the design of the body or the entire configuration of the car which may not be optimum for engine air intake. Ram Air, if designed properly, helps avoids power loss due to the engine evacuating its given intake of air and creating a vacuume as its requirements inrease. THIS IS NO MYTH. In the same breath (pardon the pun) if designed improperly, with 90 degree bends, too long of tube length or other constrictions Ram Air is useless ( a good example of this is the aftermarket shaker hood for the late model Mustangs ).
Additionally, the analogy of Ram Air to Super/Turbocharing is a very poor one. Supercharging and Turbocharging ARE engine power adders. An engine is basically a self preputating air pump...it displaces its respective volume of air in cubic inches or liters as it turns each revolution. Super/Turbochargers basically increase the displacement of the engine as they compress more air through it on each revolution. Again Ram Air compresses nothing nor is it intended to.
If you use the analogy that vetteguru does between super/turbocharging and Ram Air then you can look at it from a standpoint of "negative boost" (vacuume), "ambient air pressure" (zero boost) and "postive boost" (super/turbocharged). The only way to get positive boost is with a positive displacement compressor(Roots style, Twin Screw or Wipple etc.) or a blower/turbo(centrifugal style). BTW- positive displacement blowers do not require supersonic air to compress. Ram Air in this respect does not provide positive boost...it DOES however avoid negative boost and DOES help maintain zero boost at higher engine speeds and loads by enhancing the intake, not artifically adding displacement of air. That's a big difference.
Vetteguru may want to rethink "The myth of Ram Air" and what its intent is.....
Regards, TarPony
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2000 4.6 L V-8 Mustang GTConvertible, 5 spd, Black x 3, 18" Saleen's, 8.5 front, 10.0 rear. Nitto NT 555 Extreme 245-40-18 front/285-35-18 rear, Style Bar, chassis stiffened, PIAA Lights, Eibach Pro Kit Plus Lowered Steeda CC Plates. www.webshots.com/user/wjwheezer KEYWORD:wjwheezer
Other Car: 2005 Audi S4 Avant 4.2L V-8/40 valve, 340 HP --- one extremely fast grocery getter (no pics yet).
Well, the Ram Air hoods look the coolest IMHO. Also they can be used to keep the engine cooler which is a plus. But it seems there are onlt 2 ways of getting HP gains from the intake above and beyond an aftermarket manifold so take your pick
And the point of this thread is to clear up what a lot of people fail to understand...ram air is just a another way to get air to the filter. The misconception that it acutally "rams" more air into the engine is just that, a misconception. It does nothing more than make air available to the intake...hmmm, sort of like a glorified CAI. Where have I heard that before. And while I wont disagree that "some" air is gathered in by the scoopes, they would benefit greatly by a better design and location. I thought this thread was dead.
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'97 GT with 80mm C&L MAF, C<rue-Flow CAI, MAC 70mm TB, Superchip, 180 thermo, B&M Ripper, King Cobra Clutch, FRPP aluminum quad/adj cable, MAC O/R H pipe, MIL's, Flows, Granatelli Solid control arms, FRPP 4.10's, FRPP aluminum driveshaft, Fidanza aluminum flywheel, FRPP 9mm wires, TMD aluminum U/D pulleys, Steeda full length SFC's (welded in), and 17" polished aluminum Cobra wheels with Nitto 555 Extremes, Kenwood/Alpine sound. Waiting for install: PI intake.
Well now my 01 Cobra is being painted Sonic Blue.Her mods now are 410 gears,Duel Exuast flows with off-Road-pipe,and Iam in the process of ordering a supercharger with intercooler and what ever I have left engine too.
that is some good input but if you hook the shaker to a super charger it will help the charger to put more cold air to the motor sence the charger make heat so i think the ram air is helping to make power in that set up
Originally posted by bosslegacy02 that is some good input but if you hook the shaker to a super charger it will help the charger to put more cold air to the motor sence the charger make heat so i think the ram air is helping to make power in that set up
bosslegacy02:
You definetly have a point there, I have the same set up on my supercharged '01 Grand Cherokee Jeep. The induction is just inboard of the left headlighrt behind the grill, blows into a plenum containing a K&N filter and directly into the supercharger, very effective.
One RAM AIR I see as functional will be the 2005 Mustang's '67-'68 Shelby style of hood. Up front, direct with no bends and directly into the intake. Not a supercharger but making all the air that the engine needs available at all times.
Regards, TarPony
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2000 4.6 L V-8 Mustang GTConvertible, 5 spd, Black x 3, 18" Saleen's, 8.5 front, 10.0 rear. Nitto NT 555 Extreme 245-40-18 front/285-35-18 rear, Style Bar, chassis stiffened, PIAA Lights, Eibach Pro Kit Plus Lowered Steeda CC Plates. www.webshots.com/user/wjwheezer KEYWORD:wjwheezer
Other Car: 2005 Audi S4 Avant 4.2L V-8/40 valve, 340 HP --- one extremely fast grocery getter (no pics yet).
