I had the March Ram Air on my 97 GT. I noticed a HP difference at hwy speeds. The problem I had was the thing acted like a road vaccumm. My K&N was wrecked by bugs, dirt, cigarette butts -etc.
__________________
Defyant Marauder
"Comfort, Class, And Hair On Fire Performance"
1998 Cobra #4645 out of 5174. Built on 6/12/98 [sold]
Not if you have an intake designed to use the air trapped by the cowl.
__________________
"I've been around long enough to know how ignorant I am. I don't assume the universe obeys my preconceptions. Hah! But I know a frelling fact when it hits me in the face." -Rygel
My ROUSH Rides
98 ROUSH Stage 2 GT
03 ROUSH Cobra
Cool, It would be funny to see a trans am driving at Mach 5 speeds. My guess it would disinegrate. Another myth revealed and at the expense of the consumer. If GM would not make their vehicles so ugly I might have considered buying one (the key word is considered).
I have a variable RAM air system on my mustang, depending on how far the windows are opened a certain amount of air rams throught the cabin.
Ever wonder why they sort of retired the Camero and Trans am? They ran out of old corvete parts. GM really took a dump on the new concept vehicle SSR too (that retro pick-up thing) It was supposed to produce 455Hp but they dropped it below 302Hp. Looks like they found another use for that retired LS1 motor!
not much of a chevy fan, I don't care much for Dodge either but I believe some of their products (with exception of those damn mini-vans) are okay.
Even if there is a vehicle that could beat my car (hopefully another Ford) it would not matter much to me. So far what I have learned through research and experience is that the 4.6L is a strong and reliable power plant if you take care of it properly. I used to own a 87 Ford Escort GT witha 1.9L motor that just would not die (even without oil). I drove that thing to the ground (literally). The motor was still running even after 264K miles when I had it hauled away for scrap.
I finally decided to register on this site - it's tough to get around these days with 12 million message boards- lol
I think I can shed come contradiction here. Of course mine is based on proven facts and reality and not fancy physic type words.
Lets get to the bottom line. Our cars run off a vacuum and whenever you can reduce Vacuum you will gain HP. I am not saying you will ever see boost, but you will see "less" vacuum - hense, you will go faster.
No less than 50 people have reported back to me that back to back test confirmed that my "Build-it-yourself" ram air does in deed work. My experience in my previous 96 Cobra was 3/10ths and 1 mph at the track. There was not 1 case where the person did not go faster - period.
He is correct though, that most of the BUY systems will not work.
It is VERY important to follow the tech article EXACTLY as written. Do not use smaller pipes or corrogated pipes.
Just don't believe everything you read - even if it is well written!
I am no expert on this sort of thing but here goes.If there was no pressure difference in air trapped inside of a tube moving thru the air ,then how does the air speed indicator work on an aircraft.It is open on one end facing into the relative wind flowing around the wing.The other end is connected to a sensitive gauge marked to reflect speed through the air instead of pressure.You could install several of these in your intake tracts and measure any benefits or not of a ram-air system.An altimeter would work even better,they are even more sensitive.
__________________
04 Mustang GT 1200H-D Sportster(heavily modified)42Flathead chopper 74 CI BUY AMERICAN
I wish I thought of my fluids classes and the incompressibility of air at such a low velocity before I bought that Cervini's hood. I do however love the look of it. Sweet and intimidating looking cold air box from a rearview mirror!
What about cooler air being denser which means more charged? What about less turbulent air through more direct route (like RAM)? I didn't think anyone actually believed that RAM air was a type of forced induction. Ever notice what is sitting on top of the blower on a top fuel car? They have changed over the years to provide a more direct (less turbulent) path to the impellers. RAM air mistaken for FI, that's just silly
I finally decided to register on this site - it's tough to get around these days with 12 million message boards- lol
I think I can shed come contradiction here. Of course mine is based on proven facts and reality and not fancy physic type words.
Lets get to the bottom line. Our cars run off a vacuum and whenever you can reduce Vacuum you will gain HP. I am not saying you will ever see boost, but you will see "less" vacuum - hense, you will go faster.
No less than 50 people have reported back to me that back to back test confirmed that my "Build-it-yourself" ram air does in deed work. My experience in my previous 96 Cobra was 3/10ths and 1 mph at the track. There was not 1 case where the person did not go faster - period.
He is correct though, that most of the BUY systems will not work.
It is VERY important to follow the tech article EXACTLY as written. Do not use smaller pipes or corrogated pipes.
Just don't believe everything you read - even if it is well written!
I built nearly the exact same setup when I first got my Mustang. All parts obtained from Lowes. There was in no way any benefit gained from that setup (the one I built). Would you be able to post some dyno results...some before and after track results with time slips? I am sorry but that will be the very first homemade ram air kit EVER to get someone a 3/10ths gain at the track (unless you are running a heavily built motor on a stock air intake with a clogged filter?). What is so different about that setup and the ones you buy? The fact is the air is forced to travel through a long series of bends to get to the filter (there is nothing straight about a ram air kit...so the air is sufferin all kinds of turbulence in the tubing). I am guessing the filter would take out a most of the turbulence but that design is no different than many other homemade kits Ive seen...and built.
Now as far as cold air being denser, that is true...BUT...the air you are introducing into the system is not actually cold. Its cooler than the air under the hood but no cooler than the ambient air outside the car. The whole idea behind a CAI is to keep the intake air from being affected by engine heat. That was the whole point of putting the filter in the fender. Now the FIPK is still considered a CAI because it has a heat shield. I truly think the only reason the FIPK does any better than some other CAI's is because it removes the bend before the MAF which reduces air turbulence before hitting the sensor. I overcame that turbulence caused by putting my filter in the fender by canting my MAF to place the electronics in the smoother air path.
So...facts are, you are not going to FORCE more air in with a RAM air system...it simply doesnt work that way. The air temp would either have to be substantially reduced and its velocity increased as it traveled through the ram air tubes or you would just have to go to forced induction. Only so much air (at any given density) can be fed into an engine. Until you force the induction of the air you will get no benefit. Ram air does not force anything. All it does is introduce the somewhat cooler outside air to the engine. This is a benefit...but no more than a good CAI would do. Now you will say the air is moving faster because of the speed of the car. Keep this in mind, that air is going to be slowed some by it flowpath...that is a lot of bends. Secondly, until the velocity of the car is enough to make the velocity of the incoming air exceed the speed of which the engine actually pulls air in...there is no way possible that there could be any benefit.
The main benefits derived from these systems is not their increased air speed or ram effect...and for that matter the CAI...its mostly the improved filter medium (K&N, or whatever you use) and the straighter inlet tubing going to the TB.
__________________
'97 GT with 80mm C&L MAF, C<rue-Flow CAI, MAC 70mm TB, Superchip, 180 thermo, B&M Ripper, King Cobra Clutch, FRPP aluminum quad/adj cable, MAC O/R H pipe, MIL's, Flows, Granatelli Solid control arms, FRPP 4.10's, FRPP aluminum driveshaft, Fidanza aluminum flywheel, FRPP 9mm wires, TMD aluminum U/D pulleys, Steeda full length SFC's (welded in), and 17" polished aluminum Cobra wheels with Nitto 555 Extremes, Kenwood/Alpine sound. Waiting for install: PI intake.
Last edited by Twokingsracer; 06-06-2004 at 06:22 AM.
Reason: spellzing and clarification
I am going to have to agree with Scott through experience. I swapped off the plain flat hood off my 72 after I read an article in Hot Rod magazine that showed consistent et gains after the swap. Also of note is that the "cooling effect" helped maintain consistency. I found a used Mach 1 hood and bolted it on. The biggest thing I noticed is that my engine didn't cook anymore during long cruises on hotter days and on the highway, the car pulled harder. No more sluggishness from long stop and go drives.
As for the air being no cooler than ambient air, dude your forgetting about a little something called windchill. Trust me, living in Iceland, this is something I am intimately familiar with. Let's say you are standing around in a T-shirt on an incredibly warm spring day here in Canada and it is 12*C. No problem, all is ok. Now let say some friends strap you to the hood of their car and go tearing down the street at 40 miles per hour. You still going to be ok? There is only one answer. Your aassss is going to be frozen cause of the windchill.
Don't let some member of the pencil protector club explain how cars work. You actually have to own one and drive the craap out of it to know what does work and what doesn't, not analyze "the physics" while your eating a granola bar and riding the bus. Any time I read some jag off try to explain why something doesn't work through "fluid thermodynamics" and "physics", I have one thing to say Shut the F*$K up and go read the wonders and mysteries of chemistry with the rest of the math debate team .
There is truth to auto manufacturers trying to "hype" styling to lure buyers. Just look at the gay Pontiac "built for drivers" load of shiit. Who do other car manufacturers build their cars for? For walkers? For bus takers?
In order for somebody to disprove the performance benefit of something, whether it be a cam or head or a rocker or a filter or ram air, they actually have to test it. Not tell me why it can't work by analyzing the fluid dynamics of retro rocket hyper velocity mumbo jumbo bullshiit.
I used to make phenolic spacers for 3.8 Mustangs. I made one for myself after reading an article on the net. I noticed a huge drop in upper intake and tb temp and could spin a tire for the first time. At highway speeds, the car still pulled where it used to begin to die off. I posted some pics of it and some other mods and people started to ask me to make some for them.
After I sold about 50 of them to 50 satisfied customers, there was an uproar in the community by all the physicists who NASA couldn't afford because "they were just too good". They explained through "fluid dynamics" and "physics" how they just couldn't work. My temp reduction was dismissed as my hand was "not sensitive enough" to know that it was no longer getting scallded by an incineratingly hot upper intake.
So I got an infrared thermometer and did before and after tests, driving, idling you name it and posted the results. These were dismissed because "fluid dynamics" and "physics" could prove otherwise. So I postulated that they prove this by doing before and after tests from spacers I provided FOR FREE. The reply was that there was no point in even trying because "fluid dynamics" and "physics" told the true story. So I eventually got someone to do dyno runs, which were held out by these same masters of the universe to be the only true indicator of whether or not something worked. Several different sources, some with 40+ runs all showing a noticeable gain but guess what, the results had to be false and concocted cause "fluid dynamics" and " physics" proved otherwise.
You want to make me believe something doesn't work, show me don't tell me. Put up or shut up. I am done ranting now.
I am going to have to agree with Scott through experience. I swapped off the plain flat hood off my 72 after I read an article in Hot Rod magazine that showed consistent et gains after the swap. Also of note is that the "cooling effect" helped maintain consistency. I found a used Mach 1 hood and bolted it on. The biggest thing I noticed is that my engine didn't cook anymore during long cruises on hotter days and on the highway, the car pulled harder. No more sluggishness from long stop and go drives.
As for the air being no cooler than ambient air, dude your forgetting about a little something called windchill. Trust me, living in Iceland, this is something I am intimately familiar with. Let's say you are standing around in a T-shirt on an incredibly warm spring day here in Canada and it is 12*C. No problem, all is ok. Now let say some friends strap you to the hood of their car and go tearing down the street at 40 miles per hour. You still going to be ok? There is only one answer. Your aassss is going to be frozen cause of the windchill.
Don't let some member of the pencil protector club explain how cars work. You actually have to own one and drive the craap out of it to know what does work and what doesn't, not analyze "the physics" while your eating a granola bar and riding the bus. Any time I read some jag off try to explain why something doesn't work through "fluid thermodynamics" and "physics", I have one thing to say Shut the F*$K up and go read the wonders and mysteries of chemistry with the rest of the math debate team .
There is truth to auto manufacturers trying to "hype" styling to lure buyers. Just look at the gay Pontiac "built for drivers" load of shiit. Who do other car manufacturers build their cars for? For walkers? For bus takers?
In order for somebody to disprove the performance benefit of something, whether it be a cam or head or a rocker or a filter or ram air, they actually have to test it. Not tell me why it can't work by analyzing the fluid dynamics of retro rocket hyper velocity mumbo jumbo bullshiit.
I used to make phenolic spacers for 3.8 Mustangs. I made one for myself after reading an article on the net. I noticed a huge drop in upper intake and tb temp and could spin a tire for the first time. At highway speeds, the car still pulled where it used to begin to die off. I posted some pics of it and some other mods and people started to ask me to make some for them.
After I sold about 50 of them to 50 satisfied customers, there was an uproar in the community by all the physicists who NASA couldn't afford because "they were just too good". They explained through "fluid dynamics" and "physics" how they just couldn't work. My temp reduction was dismissed as my hand was "not sensitive enough" to know that it was no longer getting scallded by an incineratingly hot upper intake.
So I got an infrared thermometer and did before and after tests, driving, idling you name it and posted the results. These were dismissed because "fluid dynamics" and "physics" could prove otherwise. So I postulated that they prove this by doing before and after tests from spacers I provided FOR FREE. The reply was that there was no point in even trying because "fluid dynamics" and "physics" told the true story. So I eventually got someone to do dyno runs, which were held out by these same masters of the universe to be the only true indicator of whether or not something worked. Several different sources, some with 40+ runs all showing a noticeable gain but guess what, the results had to be false and concocted cause "fluid dynamics" and " physics" proved otherwise.
You want to make me believe something doesn't work, show me don't tell me. Put up or shut up. I am done ranting now.
Hey Flex:
Don't sugarcoat it like that for those nerds. Tell 'em how you really feel......
Cool, It would be funny to see a trans am driving at Mach 5 speeds. My guess it would disinegrate. Another myth revealed and at the expense of the consumer. If GM would not make their vehicles so ugly I might have considered buying one (the key word is considered).
Ever wonder why they sort of retired the Camero and Trans am? They ran out of old corvete parts. GM really took a dump on the new concept vehicle SSR too (that retro pick-up thing) It was supposed to produce 455Hp but they dropped it below 302Hp. Looks like they found another use for that retired LS1 motor!
not much of a chevy fan, I don't care much for Dodge either but I believe some of their products (with exception of those damn mini-vans) are okay. 
