My 2002 GT has 37k miles on it, and as far as I know it's completely stock.
Yesterday I've noticed a bit of a smell like some piece of rubber or plastic is burning when I'm standing in front of a traffic light. It's not that the smell hits you in the face like a sledge, more something that you notice and know shouldn't be there. Said smell even comes around if the engine itself is still cold. When actually driving the smell isn't there, and when pulling up from a stop it's gone pretty fast too.
Since the car has seen the shop last week where it got a minor maintenance check (the 35k check actually, which includes swapping filters and such), a replacement of the fanbelt (which was squeaking when idling) aswell as a yearly check (government required) to certify the car is still in a proper road-going and safe state, and all was found well (except for one minor thing) I don't really have any reason to doubt the functional status of the car.
The minor issue had to do with one of the front tie rods which has a ball joint that is too loose for regulations. Needs to be replaced, but those parts are not really on the shelf here, so it needs to be ordered, which is currently underway. Not something the garage demands I leave the car for as being unsafe to drive.
I have the suspicion the smell might be caused by the clutch (the car is a manual with the TR3650 tranny), but at the moment I'm pretty uncertain about it being the actual culprit. Moreso since I do not do burnouts and the like and just drive the car (and pretty relaxed at that). The clutch itself is working fine, no problems there.
It's just that I do smell something now and again that is appearantly the result of something seeing more friction that it's supposed to see. I've taken to actually putting the car in neutral when needing to stop this morning, and I did find the smell wasn't as pronounced as it was yesterday. I'm definitly gonna see if using the clutch at traffic lights is showing me increased signs of said smell.
Is there a known issue with the TR3650 gearbox and the clutch that might cause it to have more friction somewhere than is desirable? Could it be that the clutch needs some checkup or replacements on the 37k mile marker? Could it be the previous owner has played with the car in burnouts and such which might cause the clutch to act up a year after I purchased the car? Is there something in the maintenance check that might cause this behaviour (something needing to grind down to proper specifications or something)?
I do intend to check this on short term notice (either myself or let someone with more technical knowledge take a look), but since it's something of the last few days or so, I'm a tad worried about something 'expensive' showing signs of breaking.
Its quite possible the clutch got hot or you burned off some residue. If the car was stored or inactive for an extended period of time, the surface of the friction material of the clutch can absorb water or oil, and this will bake off as the car is driven. Its also normal for this to happen if the car has been driven hard and the clutch surface scored by rough treatment.
Not to point any fingers at your garage, but the lure of the car might have encouraged a mechanic to get a bit exuberant with it while he was "test driving" it.
A clutch can also get hot if you do extended stop and go. The throw-out bearing can also get hot if you hold the clutch in (instead of slipping it into neutral) at long stoplights, etc.
Having said all this, its probably nothing to worry about - the clutch is a pretty tough item and with your low mileage, should last for a long time (100,000 miles would not be unusual).
The smell, by the way, is very similar to the "hot brake" smell. If its your brakes that are the actual source, this would open a different set of checks and comments.
If you find yourself struggling to get the shifter into the correct gear, you might consider an upgrade to a short-throw shifter. Steeda and Pro 5.0 make good ones. Its the single best (and easiest) upgrade I made to my car. No more missed gears.
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Originally Posted by Neko-
My 2002 GT has 37k miles on it, and as far as I know it's completely stock.
Yesterday I've noticed a bit of a smell like some piece of rubber or plastic is burning when I'm standing in front of a traffic light. It's not that the smell hits you in the face like a sledge, more something that you notice and know shouldn't be there. Said smell even comes around if the engine itself is still cold. When actually driving the smell isn't there, and when pulling up from a stop it's gone pretty fast too.
Since the car has seen the shop last week where it got a minor maintenance check (the 35k check actually, which includes swapping filters and such), a replacement of the fanbelt (which was squeaking when idling) aswell as a yearly check (government required) to certify the car is still in a proper road-going and safe state, and all was found well (except for one minor thing) I don't really have any reason to doubt the functional status of the car.
The minor issue had to do with one of the front tie rods which has a ball joint that is too loose for regulations. Needs to be replaced, but those parts are not really on the shelf here, so it needs to be ordered, which is currently underway. Not something the garage demands I leave the car for as being unsafe to drive.
I have the suspicion the smell might be caused by the clutch (the car is a manual with the TR3650 tranny), but at the moment I'm pretty uncertain about it being the actual culprit. Moreso since I do not do burnouts and the like and just drive the car (and pretty relaxed at that). The clutch itself is working fine, no problems there.
It's just that I do smell something now and again that is appearantly the result of something seeing more friction that it's supposed to see. I've taken to actually putting the car in neutral when needing to stop this morning, and I did find the smell wasn't as pronounced as it was yesterday. I'm definitly gonna see if using the clutch at traffic lights is showing me increased signs of said smell.
Is there a known issue with the TR3650 gearbox and the clutch that might cause it to have more friction somewhere than is desirable? Could it be that the clutch needs some checkup or replacements on the 37k mile marker? Could it be the previous owner has played with the car in burnouts and such which might cause the clutch to act up a year after I purchased the car? Is there something in the maintenance check that might cause this behaviour (something needing to grind down to proper specifications or something)?
I do intend to check this on short term notice (either myself or let someone with more technical knowledge take a look), but since it's something of the last few days or so, I'm a tad worried about something 'expensive' showing signs of breaking.
Any thoughts would be appreciated
__________________
tripleblack
"You can never be free until you let yourself go."
Check and see what kind of belt they used, if it was Motorcraft then it might be the belt. I went through two of them, they both smelled like burning rubber as soon as I installed them. Brought each one back and got a Goodyear from Autozone, smell gone
Its quite possible the clutch got hot or you burned off some residue. If the car was stored or inactive for an extended period of time, the surface of the friction material of the clutch can absorb water or oil, and this will bake off as the car is driven. Its also normal for this to happen if the car has been driven hard and the clutch surface scored by rough treatment.
I've driven the car regularly the last year. If that'd was the case it'd have happened sooner. Prior to that it's been stationary for about 6 to 8 months as far as I can gather.
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Not to point any fingers at your garage, but the lure of the car might have encouraged a mechanic to get a bit exuberant with it while he was "test driving" it.
With 0.6 miles on the counter added while at the garage, I serious doubt it saw much testdriving... And yes, I checked that. It's something special over here, so I wanna make sure it doesn't get abused excessivly
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A clutch can also get hot if you do extended stop and go. The throw-out bearing can also get hot if you hold the clutch in (instead of slipping it into neutral) at long stoplights, etc.
Since I'm in a rather busy part of the country (you can almost say I can only do city-driving) that may be the case. But then it wouldn't really get hot after driving about a mile with a cold engine in the morning and then already start smelling, right?
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Having said all this, its probably nothing to worry about - the clutch is a pretty tough item and with your low mileage, should last for a long time (100,000 miles would not be unusual).
Good to hear that
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The smell, by the way, is very similar to the "hot brake" smell. If its your brakes that are the actual source, this would open a different set of checks and comments.
Not sure, but that is something 'checkable'.
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If you find yourself struggling to get the shifter into the correct gear, you might consider an upgrade to a short-throw shifter. Steeda and Pro 5.0 make good ones. Its the single best (and easiest) upgrade I made to my car. No more missed gears.
No issues with that. It has the clonky feeling to it when cold which is the synchro problem with the TR3650 I suppose, but I was assured the TSB had already been installed in the car during it's warrenty period. Frankly, I've learned to live with it. It hasn't jumped out of gear on any occassion yet, so I'm pretty safe there.
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Check and see what kind of belt they used, if it was Motorcraft then it might be the belt. I went through two of them, they both smelled like burning rubber as soon as I installed them. Brought each one back and got a Goodyear from Autozone, smell gone
Now THAT might be something quick and easy to check... Not that I'll have time to do su until the weekend, unless I take it tomorrow during lunch-break, but thanks for that suggestion.
It could just be that the belt is new, although I've never experienced any smell from a new belt. Just keep an eye on it, you will know if it's going bad. Also check under the hood for anything that may be touching the motor (especially headers) and melting.
Will do... Did pay special attention when driving tonight, but didn't really notice it anymore. Then again, I did mostly highway, so it could just be it never reached me before the wind got a hold of it...
Thanks for all the advice tho. It's appreciated!!!
Well... It might be nothing but it does have me slightly worried... I doubt it's the clutch, so that's good news.
Smell is still there occassionally, and today I took it home from Amsterdam. About 20 miles of 75 MPH driving. As I turned the last few corners to home I noticed a whiff of smoke coming from the right front wheel side, wafting over the hood. Not much, and it wasn't black either (more blue-ish/white), but enough for me to want to know what it was specifically.
Stopped not 30 seconds after that on the parking place, popped the hood under a minute after seeing the smoke... Nothing really smoking under the hood. Yes, it was warm, but all that is to be expected. Nothing smelling bad, just normal.
Ducked down to the right front wheel, and everything looked okay on sight. No smoke either. But there I did notice a bit of a smell like something burned a bit. As I was braking at the time I noticed the smoke, I am a bit concerned it may be the brake-shoes that have some issue. I see no specific wear/tear markings on the brake-disc tho.
Now the right front wheel has had a new ballbearing fitted mid february, but I doubt that is the cause of things. The bearing needed replacing to get it through the periodic check. Since the issue did arrive after the diagnosis of the need for a new bearing (February 16th), and the actual swap of the item wasn't until the 26th, I can't be sure they loosened it or something to check it, or if they checked it on the car.
Now I'm a bit concerned with what that might have been. Since she's only done this once, and the whole issue started after the check it had at the shop mid februari, I'm afraid they may have caused something bad over there, and I'm really hoping it's not related to the brakes. And if it doesn't repeat, I doubt going to the shop again is gonna help much other then result in me getting billed for time.
Based on the above... Anything anyone can think of that might be the case? Something I can check myself? Some info to hand the shop to see if they did something wrong?
__________________
2002 GT Ford Mustang V8 4.6L Satin Silver
... Pony far away from home ...
next time you brake, take your hands off the wheel cautiously and brake. if the car continues to go straight, then your brakes are most likely fine. another thing to check is your exhaust system. maybe you drove over a plastic bag or something when the exhaust was hot, and it got stuck to your muffler, or cats. that would cause a burning smell and would go away as you drive and come back when you stop.
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Sr. Master Ford nerd.
saludos caballeros del ovalo azul
Replacing the wheel bearing as part of a safety inspection is a bit unusual - its not something that typically gets checked, unless its squealing (which would be a bad sign indeed, of course).
If the clutch were overheating (probably from slipping, given the type of driving you were doing), you'd have a strong "friction material frying" smell, and would of course experience the "more rpm's but no more speed" phenomenon.
You might try jacking up the suspect wheel and examining the hub yourself. This would involve scotching the rear tire (a few bricks would work fine). I'd try spinning the wheel slowly by hand. The brake pads should make only the slightest whisper of contact (if at all), and the wheel should spin smoothly. If it doesn't, that would be cause to have it checked out.
Now grasp the wheel at 12 and 6 o'clock, and try to rock it in and out. You should not be able to detect any movement at all. If the wheel DOES more in and out, this is a sign the bearing is either too loose or bad.
If this initial test is OK, I'd still remove the wheel and examine the hub. If you have a regular screwdriver, its easy to remove the cap (there's a small area along the edge that is raised enough to receive a screwdriver's tip). Insert the tip of the screwdriver and rotate it until you see the cap lifting, move the screwdriver over a bit, and repeat until you have the cap off.
The wheel bearing should be covered with clean grease (since they just did the work, it should be very fresh and light amber color if not white). The large castellated nut should be firmly seated and held in place with an item that looks like a large bobby pin.
When you spin the wheel, the bearing should move freely.
To replace the hub (a few raps with the handle of the screwdriver or a rubber hammer if you have one is a good idea.
Note: When traveling you can encounter unusual compounds in rain puddles and on roadways. Anything like oil, grease, wax or solvents (any of which can spill our on roads) that splashes up on your brakes or engine can cause some smoke. The engine, exhaust and brakes all get hot enough to cook these things and smoke. This is a normal (if annoying) aspect of motoring. Various detailing items, particularly spray-on waxes and tire treatments, can get on brakes and, as they bake off, cause an odor and smoke.
I hope this helps. I feel like you're a brother 'stanger far from home and at the mercy of ignorant (though doubtless well-meaning) mechanical assitance.
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Originally Posted by Neko-
Well... It might be nothing but it does have me slightly worried... I doubt it's the clutch, so that's good news.
Smell is still there occassionally, and today I took it home from Amsterdam. About 20 miles of 75 MPH driving. As I turned the last few corners to home I noticed a whiff of smoke coming from the right front wheel side, wafting over the hood. Not much, and it wasn't black either (more blue-ish/white), but enough for me to want to know what it was specifically.
Stopped not 30 seconds after that on the parking place, popped the hood under a minute after seeing the smoke... Nothing really smoking under the hood. Yes, it was warm, but all that is to be expected. Nothing smelling bad, just normal.
Ducked down to the right front wheel, and everything looked okay on sight. No smoke either. But there I did notice a bit of a smell like something burned a bit. As I was braking at the time I noticed the smoke, I am a bit concerned it may be the brake-shoes that have some issue. I see no specific wear/tear markings on the brake-disc tho.
Now the right front wheel has had a new ballbearing fitted mid february, but I doubt that is the cause of things. The bearing needed replacing to get it through the periodic check. Since the issue did arrive after the diagnosis of the need for a new bearing (February 16th), and the actual swap of the item wasn't until the 26th, I can't be sure they loosened it or something to check it, or if they checked it on the car.
Now I'm a bit concerned with what that might have been. Since she's only done this once, and the whole issue started after the check it had at the shop mid februari, I'm afraid they may have caused something bad over there, and I'm really hoping it's not related to the brakes. And if it doesn't repeat, I doubt going to the shop again is gonna help much other then result in me getting billed for time.
Based on the above... Anything anyone can think of that might be the case? Something I can check myself? Some info to hand the shop to see if they did something wrong?
__________________
tripleblack
"You can never be free until you let yourself go."
next time you brake, take your hands off the wheel cautiously and brake. if the car continues to go straight, then your brakes are most likely fine. another thing to check is your exhaust system. maybe you drove over a plastic bag or something when the exhaust was hot, and it got stuck to your muffler, or cats. that would cause a burning smell and would go away as you drive and come back when you stop.
LOL, this is correct - it happened to me once. I finally found where the bag welded itself to the exhuast pipe - the logo of the store was still bright and cheerful!
I scraped it off with a scotch pad and some alcohol.
__________________
tripleblack
"You can never be free until you let yourself go."
next time you brake, take your hands off the wheel cautiously and brake. if the car continues to go straight, then your brakes are most likely fine.
Could try that indeed...
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another thing to check is your exhaust system. maybe you drove over a plastic bag or something when the exhaust was hot, and it got stuck to your muffler, or cats. that would cause a burning smell and would go away as you drive and come back when you stop.
The car has been on a bridge to swap out the wheels, and I looked at the underside. There wasn't anything hooked under there to cause the issue. Nevertheless, good idea anyways.
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Replacing the wheel bearing as part of a safety inspection is a bit unusual - its not something that typically gets checked, unless its squealing (which would be a bad sign indeed, of course).
It's not the wheel bearing. It's the ballbearing of the tierod (designed to make sure the car keeps running straight when the steeringwheel is left alone). It had too much slack on the ballbearing, and thus failed it's safety test. It got swapped out, and then passed it's test. This component and then specifically the tie rod end.
If the clutch were overheating (probably from slipping, given the type of driving you were doing), you'd have a strong "friction material frying" smell, and would of course experience the "more rpm's but no more speed" phenomenon.
Not so... So it's not the clutch in my opinion. With just over 38k on it, I'd really be surprised if that was it. Then again, I'm the second owner, and have no clue how the previous owner has handled the car.
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This would involve scotching the rear tire
Right front wheel having the issues. But the whole thing still applies
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When traveling you can encounter unusual compounds in rain puddles and on roadways. Anything like oil, grease, wax or solvents (any of which can spill our on roads) that splashes up on your brakes or engine can cause some smoke.
Clear day, sunny, and nothing really on the road to cause the behaviour. I do intend to keep an eye on it. If it does repeat I'll suspect something is really wrong, and at that point I do intend to contact the shop about it to have it checked out further. The solutions given are pretty solid tho. The car does not feel like it's breaking when I leave it rolling out, nor do I really feel I need to correct the steering, it doesn't bank to the side of the road when the steeringwheel is left alone, so also the tierods seem to be alligned properly.
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I feel like you're a brother 'stanger far from home and at the mercy of ignorant (though doubtless well-meaning) mechanical assitance.
Thanks... The help through here is much appreciated. I'm not that well versed in cars and their workings, other then the basics (I know how an internal combustion engine is supposed to work, that doesn't mean I'm prone to take it apart and tinker with it :P ) but the general thoughts coming from here concerning the technical side of things are helpful and highly appreciated. As to the assistance... they do have access to the technical manuals from Ford I suppose (or so they told me), so I'm assuming they know what they're doing. If they don't I'd rather call them on it, and work with them to correct it so any future maintenance wouldn't suffer under this.
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2002 GT Ford Mustang V8 4.6L Satin Silver
... Pony far away from home ...
OK, the "wheel ball bearing" comment threw me! LOL. As for "scotching" (ie, blocking from rolling) the rear wheel, you do that when you jack up the front of the car (no good trying to block the front wheels from rolling, they are up in the air). Just a safety issue.
Your brakes will get quite hot (normally) as they operate, and anything on them will cook. This will include any grease they might have applied to the new tie rod ends. I've done this job, and if you're not careful, its very easy to get the heavy grease on your hands and then transfer it to whatever else you touch. Part of the job involves manipulating the steering rack back and forth, which usually involves grabbing the front wheels. Even a light coat transferred to the brakes (or near the brakes where their heat tranfers) will make the grease cook. This grease is very thick and resistant to water, so its not easily removed, but I would think that any of it that is on the brakes is pretty much cooked off by now.
Watch your tire wear for the next 10,000k. If your caster isn't good, it will show up there first. These cars have very limited adjustment built into them (hence the popularity of aftermarket caster/camber plates), and the installation of the tie rod ends is a perfect ocassion to get it off a degree or so. If the car is wearing unevely, it needs another trip to be aligned. (This would probably NOT be the source of any smell or smoke, however).
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Originally Posted by Neko-
Could try that indeed...
The car has been on a bridge to swap out the wheels, and I looked at the underside. There wasn't anything hooked under there to cause the issue. Nevertheless, good idea anyways.
It's not the wheel bearing. It's the ballbearing of the tierod (designed to make sure the car keeps running straight when the steeringwheel is left alone). It had too much slack on the ballbearing, and thus failed it's safety test. It got swapped out, and then passed it's test. This component and then specifically the tie rod end.
Not so... So it's not the clutch in my opinion. With just over 38k on it, I'd really be surprised if that was it. Then again, I'm the second owner, and have no clue how the previous owner has handled the car.
Right front wheel having the issues. But the whole thing still applies
Clear day, sunny, and nothing really on the road to cause the behaviour. I do intend to keep an eye on it. If it does repeat I'll suspect something is really wrong, and at that point I do intend to contact the shop about it to have it checked out further. The solutions given are pretty solid tho. The car does not feel like it's breaking when I leave it rolling out, nor do I really feel I need to correct the steering, it doesn't bank to the side of the road when the steeringwheel is left alone, so also the tierods seem to be alligned properly.
Thanks... The help through here is much appreciated. I'm not that well versed in cars and their workings, other then the basics (I know how an internal combustion engine is supposed to work, that doesn't mean I'm prone to take it apart and tinker with it :P ) but the general thoughts coming from here concerning the technical side of things are helpful and highly appreciated. As to the assistance... they do have access to the technical manuals from Ford I suppose (or so they told me), so I'm assuming they know what they're doing. If they don't I'd rather call them on it, and work with them to correct it so any future maintenance wouldn't suffer under this.
__________________
tripleblack
"You can never be free until you let yourself go."
Clutch issue with TR3650 tranny? 
