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Engine swap

2K views 21 replies 6 participants last post by  AlloyPony 
#1 ·
Hey guys, posted on a different forum, not getting many responses. I'm thinking of putting in crate motor in 1996 mustang gt. What are some things I'll need to think about switching out? Any motors recommended? Looking to get a lot out of it, around 500-600. Not confident in building current motor up, don't think it could handle all the horsepower. Appreciate opinions. I've heard mixed things about crate motors in the 96.
 
#2 ·
You can build your current motor to handle 600. Forged rods, pistons, PI Heads (maybe), blower/turbo/nitrous....

What power adder are you wanting to go with? What is your budget? Will you be doing the work?

Rockford, ILL?????
 
#3 ·
I had supercharger in mind, and basically get all bolt ons done the right way, but nitrous and turbo seems too much for my skills! Which is why crate engine seemed like a good choice, put s.c. on that and complete exhaust system and that would be looking good. But like I said, I would much rather get input from other mustang guys and see what works and doesn't work. I don't wanna get a different mustang, I like mine, I figured it I was going to out money into soemthing, it would be that and when it's all said and done, it would be like a new car. Thanks for the reply :)
 
#4 ·
Yes, in Rockford, and I can do some work, but not confidently. May be outsourced. And right now, just planning, laying everything out and going to tackle one thing at a time. Budget isn't too bad, but like I said, one thing at a time. I can't drop 10,000 right away! But if that was over the course of a couple years, then sure I could! Just gotta work the OT. ?
 
#8 ·
10k isn't a budget, just a number I threw out there! I've looked at crate motors, but wasn't sure what would work best. Modular motors work best? That article was interesting, 3v always seemed sketchy to me! Supercharger could be after wards down the road.. Like I said, just trying to lay down the grounds work v on ideas and opinions from all you mustang enthusiasts like myself. Thank you for the replies :)
 
#9 ·
I would do a modular for sure, either 2V or 4V depending on what I wanted out of it and cost. For $10grand in parts you could have a pretty sweet 500+ hp 2V engine depending on how much of the work you can do yourself. If you don't touch one bolt and pay someone else to get their hands dirty then that number goes up real quick.

It never ends though. Then it moves on to getting brakes and suspension up to par, or if you're smart you take care of that first.
 
#10 ·
So are you talking about getting short block, sending it out for machining, heads, cams, etc? And then bolt ons, then supercharger? And after engine performance, move onto supension? What about transmission? And at this point, your whole motor is new, not a crate motor, but would have been put together piece by piece to get a 2v or 4v depending on the heads and cams you chose?
 
#11 ·
I think that is about your best option if not the only. I'd probably do the suspension first suspension first if I thought that it'd be awhile until I had the motor torn apart. But I guess it really doesn't matter the order as long as everything is addressed. I do think that I would have the motor rebuilt before buying bolt-ons. That way you know what type of bolt-ons you need to support the power that you're making. Buy fuel injectors when the motor is torn apart. I'd upgrade the transmission when and if the stock one craps out.


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#12 ·
Yeah, I'm sure the transmission will go for sure since they aren't rated for high horsepower, plus it's the orginal after about 137k! But the 3v route looked pretty decent, I've heard good things about the 4v, but read somewhere the svo 2v is the best heads for that motor! But if i got a new engine block and had it machined, would that change the integrity of the parts to follow since the block will not be machined the same? Assuming the bored and such would be bigger, deeper, etc. For more performance rating.
 
#13 ·
Your transmission will last forever. On street tires you are unlikely to break anything. On drag radials, a hard track launch you risk breaking a stock 28 spline axles. On slicks and 31 spline axles, a hard track launch you risk eventually breaking the transmission (probably input shaft). It's really all about how much traction you have and the physically closest weakest link to the tires - with a built rearend and sticky tires the stress put on the driveline gets transferred forward to the transmission.

High rpm powershifting, regardless of power level is hard on the transmission. Particularly the synchronizers. So if you don't want to replace your transmission anytime soon then avoid that and it will outlast a lot of other things on your car.

I wouldn't bother with a 3V. Great engine with lots of potential but due to the platform differences between SN95 and S197 cars there are a lot of other things that would have to be changed out such as the PCM (for starters, our PCM's cannot accomodate for the cam phasers those engines have) and at that point you would begin to encounter some hurdles with interfacing various electronic related things. Leave the 3V for S197 platform cars - there is a reason that nobody swaps those engines into these cars; stick with a 2 or 4V. If you decide on 4V, try to get an entire donor car if at all possible, there are a million little things you will need.

As far as SVO heads for 2V, I really don't know anything about them except that they are long out of production (last anything that had SVO on it was made close to 20 years ago) and as such would be impossible to find and when you did track down a pair I'm guessing that they would be pricey and for the money you would be better off with TF heads.
 
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#14 ·
I came across some crate motors for the 4.6, already loaded with lower end and such. But those motors from seanhylandmotorsports were a lot of money, like 15k! If I buy a good small block, I would need to get all the internals after having it machined out, buying the good quality parts rated for horsepower crank,valves, etc. , and then I would have to buy the top end stuff, all goodies like tf heads, awesome cams, etc. And then the install, I wonder how much this would run me?? I mean, is that the general stuff I would need to do, other than suspension and possible transmission?
 
#15 ·
Sean Hyland makes good stuff so far as I know, but there's no reason you need to spend $15grand just on the engine, not for your goals and intended purpose anyway. I'm not too familiar with prices off the top of my head, but go look at Modular Motorsports Racing | Home of the Worlds Fastest Modular Engines, I wanna say that depending on options you could buy a fully assembled longblock that will handle some very decent power for around $7grand.

The more work you can do, are willing to invest a little in tools and some books for reference, you can save quite a bit of money. Personally I would opt for an assembled shortblock, put it on a stand and then install the top end myself. And I say that with the full disclosure that at this exact moment in time I know absolutely Jack s**t about assembling an overhead cam engine but I'm pretty confident that I could figure it out; I am not that special so if I can figure it out then there's a good chance you could as well. Putting together the bottom end is the part that scares me a little, which is why I would spend a little extra to have it show up to my door professionally assembled.

All the other stuff that goes on the engine - lower manifold, alt/ps/ac etc accessories, I think you mentioned something about a supercharger..... That crap is all just nuts and bolts, unless you feel like paying somebody to install all that then other than time consuming it's all pretty easy stuff.


Personally, and I don't mean this as any sort of dig - I think you are getting into way too deep of waters with your thinking processes right now. Take your time, do your homework, come up with some reasonable and specific goals for the car and a budget you can not only live with but is also realistic for whatever your financial situation is, and then we can figure out how to help you get there.

In the meantime, work on the foundation of your car is my advice. Suspension, chassis, brakes - get them all up to par for the power you're planning on later. Doing so will give you ample time to think about what and how you're gonna handle that 500 lb hunk of iron under the hood and then then by the time you get around to it you'll have a car that can handle whatever amount of power you want to throw at it. Additionally you will become more familiarized with your car and increase your confidence and skills so that hopefully when you get around to doing stuff with the engine you will be willing and able to do a reasonable amount of it yourself if you so desire.
 
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#16 ·
I'm gonna agree with all of the above. Replace and upgrade all of the high mileage wear items first since they're high mileage wear items anyway. You know stuff like: inner and outer tierods, bj's, brakes, shocks and struts. Then get a set of subframe connectors and rear control arms.
Is this a daily driver or a play toy? If it's a daily driver then you might want to rethink the total power goal and the best way to reach that power. If you're making a butt-ton it will get kinda old driving it around everyday I'd think. Also given the cars' age there will always be something here and there that will need to be repaired.
What was/is your target hp goal, 500-600hp? That's quite a crap-ton and a bit overkill for a 96 gt street car. What are you trying to outrun? Shelby's, Vipers, and Vette's? It can be done but it'll get outré teks expensive pretty quick and at the end of the day you'll have a fast car that's not all that streetable. It'd be an ok pretty day weekend car but all day everyday would probably suck.
A 96 GT making 400 rwhp wouldn't be anything to laugh at and it'd probably be down right violent. My 95 is only making 332 rwhp and its a handful with our chassis and it'll hold its own with just about anything that you'd run into in a street type scenario except the super high end stuff that I seldom see. So If you added 100 or so more hp to the tire it'd probably be "king of the streets" in most areas until you eventually ran across a "super car."
So my question for the 4.6 gurus is how much power does the typical rebuilt PI motor with a cam upgrade and say 6 psi o' boost make? Will a brand new stock bottom end be able to handle 6-8 psi? Surely so.

OP: Just for kicks call a machine shop and get an estimate for them to rebuild your stock bottom end.
 
#18 ·
One of the guys in our group has a ProCharger now pushing I think 8 psi, over-sized intercooler, long tubes, catless midpipe, 3.73s, LCAs, UCAs, upgraded fuel pump, upgraded injectors, additional coolers w/ fan on a toggle switch in front of the radiator, and probably a few things I've forgotten. His did 381 on the dyno after four prior pulls making much less than that and the tuner changing things as he went along. I think 400+ is very expensive to get on these cars, and as mentioned it's really starting to push the limits of the stock bottom end.

Cams get tricky when mixed with forced induction.. you can actually hurt your numbers on the dyno by throwing cams into the mix if you don't know what you're doing.
 
#20 ·
faster than any piece of **** honda that's going to pull up next to you and try to run you

i dont realistically even see the point of owning a daily driver with much more than 400hp. it's fast enough that you don't have to deal with idiots, it has a nice deep growl, you aren't going to wreck your car bad if you decide to get a little stupid etc.

do something stupid in a powerful car and it will be just as awful as your car is (or rather, was) powerful
 
#21 ·
Wow, so much helpful info!! I really had hopes of getting it up in the 500 range, maybe my goal will be 500. My dad back in 2000 built his 1990 convertible from the ground up with crate motor and every goodie he could think of, and Thats kind of where I was heading with this project in mind. Back as a kid, I absolutely loved that car! It does scare me though putting so much money into it and knowing that other than motor and bolt ons, everything is still 20 years old. I would have to replace most of not evetyhing possible to have a "new" reliable car, but even then the frame would still be original. I mean, dreaming big is one thing, but maybe you guys are just being realistic and talking some sense into me!! My over thinking comes from being a cnc precision machinist. I always have to have everything figured out and done perfectly! But again, I'm learning a lot from rvetyonrs input, I really do appreciate it.
 
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