[j-wigg]

I bought a 88 Gt Conv. from a guy on the east coast of FL. I am a up and coming mustang mechanic (lol a beginner, not a pro) I was driving it home to the west coast of FL. The transmission locked up and had to tow home. Put a new (used) t5 trans, new RAM clutch kit (disk, pressureplate, throwout bearing, pilot bearing), resufaced flywheel (with .05 shim), and steeda clutch cable, quadrant, firewall aduster. The trans will not go into gear while the car is running. With the rear end up, I can start the car in gear, with the clutch in, and have the back tires spin. The trans will go into different gear while doing this. The clutch cable is tight. I've adjusted it little by little, until the clutch fork would not go any further (fork is hitting the bell housing when the clutch is depressed) I have gone back to removing and reinstalling everything all the way down to the flywheel 3 times already with this issue. Checked everything possible (So can think). One of the times when removing the trans I kept the bell housing on and pushed the clutch in to watch the pressure plate action (the disk came loose off the flywheel and was able to move around). Throwout bearing is on properly (bigger side faceing the pressure plate). Disk is on properly (flywheel side on the flywheel). Only thing possible that I can be doing wrong and I cant see this being the problem, is I do not have a torque wrench for the pressure plate. I am going by good feel that all the bolts are at 25pds. Any suggestions would be apprieciated. I really need to get this car running as my other car is about to take a crap. Thanks in advance.

The clutch kit did not come with one (although the kit from american muscle said it was suppose to). I picked up napa part b65174 (clutch pilot bearing for 302 motor).

I used the shim to compensate for the material that was machined off in case it was taken down too far.

The different components were installed at different times after failure.
First: Tranny
Second: Clutch
Third: Shim
Forth: Cable

Same fork (Does not look bent at all)

Same bellhousing

Same pivot stud. (did not adjust this at all) Greased when fork was reinstalled.

Throwout bearing that came with the clutch kit.

The big thing that has me is that when I had the tranny out with the clutch, bellhousing and cable still installed and connected, the clutch disk was movable when the clutch pedal was pressed (even with the cable adjuster just snug and not tight). When the pedal was released the pressure plate grabbed again and the disk didnt move. Pressed the pedal again and the disk moved freely. IF the disk was on the input shaft, I would assume it was doing the same thing.

I put the tranny up to the flywheel with everything off to make sure the shafted turned while in the pilot bearing and it does.

I just put everything back together as straight as possible, and still have the same problem. Either something is not getting installed right, or something is seriously gone wrong here.

HELP PLEASE????

[tripleblack]

Sorry for your problems.

Let me ask a few questions first off...

Which year 5.0 is the engine? Is it the original engine for the car? Are you sure it's not a 302 from an earlier model?

You say you can start the car in gear, with the clutch in, and the back tires spin?

Clutch is not releasing. Your problem is probably forward of the transmission, unless... What transmission do you have in there? Is it a T5?

Sounds like you have already tested it semi-assembled, and the clutch works, but it STOPS working when you get everything back together...

Verify that you have the correct parts in there. Something is off, either with the install or the parts.

I would really examine what you did with the flywheel, and make sure the starter is engaging and disengaging properly. If the starter is locking to the flywheel, that's another problem.

If the flywheel was turned down past spec, it needs to go - its not safe running a too-thin flywheel. Make sure the replacement (if needed) is sitting flat and pretty. I'm leary of the shim in this situation in general. Borrow a torque wrench. Lots of part places have loaner tools.

Originally Posted by j-wigg

I bought a 88 Gt Conv. from a guy on the east coast of FL. I am a up and coming mustang mechanic (lol a beginner, not a pro) I was driving it home to the west coast of FL. The transmission locked up and had to tow home. Put a new (used) t5 trans, new RAM clutch kit (disk, pressureplate, throwout bearing, pilot bearing), resufaced flywheel (with .05 shim), and steeda clutch cable, quadrant, firewall aduster. The trans will not go into gear while the car is running. With the rear end up, I can start the car in gear, with the clutch in, and have the back tires spin. The trans will go into different gear while doing this. The clutch cable is tight. I've adjusted it little by little, until the clutch fork would not go any further (fork is hitting the bell housing when the clutch is depressed) I have gone back to removing and reinstalling everything all the way down to the flywheel 3 times already with this issue. Checked everything possible (So can think). One of the times when removing the trans I kept the bell housing on and pushed the clutch in to watch the pressure plate action (the disk came loose off the flywheel and was able to move around). Throwout bearing is on properly (bigger side faceing the pressure plate). Disk is on properly (flywheel side on the flywheel). Only thing possible that I can be doing wrong and I cant see this being the problem, is I do not have a torque wrench for the pressure plate. I am going by good feel that all the bolts are at 25pds. Any suggestions would be apprieciated. I really need to get this car running as my other car is about to take a crap. Thanks in advance.

The clutch kit did not come with one (although the kit from american muscle said it was suppose to). I picked up napa part b65174 (clutch pilot bearing for 302 motor).

I used the shim to compensate for the material that was machined off in case it was taken down too far.

The different components were installed at different times after failure.
First: Tranny
Second: Clutch
Third: Shim
Forth: Cable

Same fork (Does not look bent at all)

Same bellhousing

Same pivot stud. (did not adjust this at all) Greased when fork was reinstalled.

Throwout bearing that came with the clutch kit.

The big thing that has me is that when I had the tranny out with the clutch, bellhousing and cable still installed and connected, the clutch disk was movable when the clutch pedal was pressed (even with the cable adjuster just snug and not tight). When the pedal was released the pressure plate grabbed again and the disk didnt move. Pressed the pedal again and the disk moved freely. IF the disk was on the input shaft, I would assume it was doing the same thing.

I put the tranny up to the flywheel with everything off to make sure the shafted turned while in the pilot bearing and it does.

I just put everything back together as straight as possible, and still have the same problem. Either something is not getting installed right, or something is seriously gone wrong here.

HELP PLEASE????

[j-wigg]

I have no idea what year engine it is and if it is original.
q: any way to tell by a serial or code (where is it located)?

Tires do spin when starting in first with the clutch in (rear end up)

T5 trans

How do i check the starter engaging/disengaging.

The guy at the machine shop said he would put a shim in because of how far the flywheel may have been machined down (supposedly he did not have a tool to measure the thickness of it.) I heard that the shim is more necessary for hydrolic clutches instead of mechanical.

[j-wigg]

is there a difference between a 4 cyl trans bellhousing and t5 bellhousing for 8 cyl?

[tripleblack]

Yes, but more than that, T5's come in a lot of different flavors (there are over 200 different casting series, a number of types of bell housings/adapters for variouis cars, and lots of different gear sets).

Presumably you swapped over your old bell housing, but if you did not, you may have something going on there (this includes adapters for various clutch parts, particularly the clutch arm and pivot).

Here are some sites with lots of info, and you might contact them if you need an expert to talk to:

5 Speed Conversions

Modern Driveline - 5 speed Transmission Swap - T5 and TREMEC TKO conversions for Mustang, Falcon, Cougar, HotRod, Cobra

If the starter is not engaging/disengaging properly, you should be able to hear it roaring when the engine cuts in and the rpms rise. I suspect this is not happening else you would have noticed it (just trying to think through the usual suspects - probably shouldn't have mentioned the starter really).

If you think you have the wrong bellhousing on the transmission, one way to tell would be to measure your old one and compare it to the one you just installed. They should be the same length.

[j-wigg]

When the trans was first replaced, my uncle was here. He has and races a 5.0. He noticed that the old trans casing didnt look right (possible from a 4 cyl motor). When i bought the car it, i was driving it from the east coast of FL to the West coast. I made it about 1 hour before the tranny broke and the rear wheels locked up. I was sent a new trans from the guy that i bought the car from to install which looked more like a t5.

The bellhousing is the same, this was not replaced. I'll trying finding the specs on the bellhousing size differences. I looked yesterday but i guess not hard enough for a 4cyl bellhousing.

I am going to have everything back out today and take everything down. Going to try it out without the shim in the flywheel. I didnt try this yet with the new cable.

Anything else i should check???

[tripleblack]

There are a lot of potential "what ifs" in this...

Call or contact some of those folks I linked for you. They are very knowledgeable about these transmissions and the problems with various swaps.

Verify that you have the correct clutch for your application. Call AM and discuss this with the tech - you might need a different clutch, either because you ordered the wrong one, or they sent you the wrong one. You can't just go by the model year of the car unless you have verified the OE engine and transmission were in the car. LOTS of these cars have been heavily modified, with mixtures of old and new parts thrown together.

Does your engine retain the original serpentine layout and smog equipment? Can you take a pic and post it of the various parts involved (engine, tranny, etc)?

At this point go back through your parts and question all the pieces. The transmission should have a series of numbers cast into it, and also might have a tag with further data on that (there are so many different iterations of the T5 for various applications).

Compare the length of the input shafts between the old and new transmissions.

Did the old tranny shift ok into all 5 gears (before failing)?

[j-wigg]

I dont have the old trans to compare with unfortunately. The car drove in all gears before it failed. the clutch was a little sticky when going down.

I will take pictures and get numbers off of what i can find today. (as long as it doesnt rain)

I'll see about getting the depth of the bellhousing.

[j-wigg]

Ok, got it figured out. Will at moderndriveline confirmed that the trans is for a 94-98 3.8 v6. FANTASTIC.

Well how would this affect the performance of the cars possibilities?
How well and long will it work

[tripleblack]

Originally Posted by j-wigg

Ok, got it figured out. Will at moderndriveline confirmed that the trans is for a 94-98 3.8 v6. FANTASTIC.

Well how would this affect the performance of the cars possibilities?
How well and long will it work

Glad you got some good news.

That particular T5 is one of the "World Class" trannies, so its a good one, but not a great one (there are a few hard-to-find models that are really desireable that came out of the Cobras toward the end of their use in those cars).

The transmission should live a long life, if its in good shape - all depends on the condition of the transmission (particularly the synchros).

[EagleAutosports]

We also have a transmission expert here, he works at Keisler and can tell you all you need to know about a manual trans.

Ford Mustang Forums - View Profile: rj8806

[rj8806]

Originally Posted by j-wigg

Ok, got it figured out. Will at moderndriveline confirmed that the trans is for a 94-98 3.8 v6. FANTASTIC.

Well how would this affect the performance of the cars possibilities?
How well and long will it work

Received and replied to your PM but am a little confused. The V6 T5 was different from the GT version but if the input shaft was longer, then the tranny wouldn't seat up against the bell housing and it would've been evident during the install.

What you are describing is the clutch not releasing when everything is installed. What am I missing here? It has been a long day so far and my brain is fried right now, so maybe I am not thinking clearly.....



Richard
Tech Support
Tremec TKO, T45 & T56 Transmission Systems