'85 302 Ignition Problem

85VicWagonGuy · 10-21-2002

1985 CV Wagon, 302, 5.0L.
(Yea, it's a Crown Vic... but I need 302 expertise!)

SYMPTOM:
Stalls after 2 - 5 minutes from cold start. Sometimes starts after 5-15 minutes cooldown.

EEC IV Codes (10/21/2002)
=========================
NOTE:
- prior to code test, engine ran very rough for about 2 minutes before stalling. "rotten egg" sulfur smell from exhaust.

HARD FAULTS
23 -> Throttle sensor out of range or throttle set too high
88 -> Electronic ignition - IDM, DPI or spout circuit fault

MEMORY FAULTS
14 -> Ignition pickup was erratic
18 -> Ignition TACH signal erratic [ appeared after replacing ballast resistor w/ fusible link]

PARTS RECENTLY REPLACED:
- coolant temp. sensor
- control module (GP Sorensen)
- distributor + stator
- Autolite plugs (.05 gap) + wires
- throttle position sensor
- replaced failed fusible link (near coil harness)

Any suggestions ???

GTRaptor · 10-21-2002

Definately you have a distributor and TPS problem, check the voltage on the TPS and recheck your Distributor install.

85VicWagonGuy · 10-22-2002

Quote:

Originally posted by GTRaptor
Definitely you have a distributor and TPS problem, check the voltage on the TPS and recheck your Distributor install.

I just bought a voltmeter.

How do I check the TPS voltage?

It's also been suggested that I check the EGR valve.
Could a vacuum leak during cranking cause the computer to stop spark from the coil?

Thanks.

85VicWagonGuy · 10-29-2002

TPS voltage is perfect. No shorts to ground.

I can't find any wire breaks.

All I can think to do is replace the ECC. Everyone says that's probably not the problem, but 3 ignition modules have made no difference.

GhostDog 5.0 · 10-29-2002

have you tried adjusting the timing?

whenever you say it turns on after 15 minutes of cool down, how hard of a start is it compared to when it's cold? after your car dies , have you checked for spark?

fuel filter good? if you disconnect the vacuum from the fuel pressure regulator and plug it, does it make a difference?

how high do your temps get? have any mods (for a vic i dunno) been done?

after it stalls, if you put the key down , then up, can you hear the fuel pump whine ?

i would also check the condition of rotor and cap.

85VicWagonGuy · 10-30-2002

Quote:

have you tried adjusting the timing?

the timing was adjusted by my mechanic.

Quote:

whenever you say it turns on after 15 minutes of cool down, how hard of a start is it compared to when it's cold? after your car dies , have you checked for spark?

Now, it won't restart at all after cooldown. No spark from coil when dead like this.

Quote:

fuel filter good? if you disconnect the vacuum from the fuel pressure regulator and plug it, does it make a difference?

The fuel filter was replaced. Would a vacuum problem stop spark at the coil?

Quote:

how high do your temps get? have any mods (for a vic i dunno) been done?

don't have a temp gauge. no mods.

Quote:

after it stalls, if you put the key down , then up, can you hear the fuel pump whine?

Yes. And I get 1 spark from the coil. Also 1 spark when key is turned off. Just no spark during cranking.

Quote:

i would also check the condition of rotor and cap.

both are brand new and in good condition.

I'm getting codes 23 and 88, and memory code 14. 23 means a problem with the TPS, but I've tested the TPS and it's fine.

I've already tried 3 ignition modules (in case it was an overheating problem).

All that's left is the ECC. I hope to get a new computer this week.

GhostDog 5.0 · 10-30-2002

you can probably find hundreds of those online.

Quote:

Now, it won't restart at all after cooldown. No spark from coil when dead like this

What? You previously wrote on the first thread

Quote:

Stalls after 2 - 5 minutes from cold start. Sometimes starts after 5-15 minutes cooldown

Maybe ignition switch ?

Does it turn off while driving only after 15 minutes or idle too? Sounds like something is cooking.

Since when do vehicles not come with temperature gauges?

C J · 10-30-2002

MEMORY FAULTS
14 -> Ignition pickup was erratic
18 -> Ignition TACH signal erratic [ appeared after replacing ballast resistor w/ fusible link]

the ballast resistor is there for a reason, put a good one back in. it keeps the coil from going out from too much voltage to the primary side.

the module is not the same a the Ignition Pickup...the pickup coil is in the distributor.

and no, a vacuum leak will not cause a no spark condition.

Mad Max · 10-30-2002

Tried replacing the coil?

85VicWagonGuy · 10-31-2002

Quote:

Originally posted by Mad Max
Tried replacing the coil?

Coil was replaced. No effect.

Upon further reflection...
Prior to August vacation:
1) my car started stalling
2) we replaced the original MotorCraft module with a GP Sorensen
3) car ran, but was running rough

I decided to take a rental car on vacation.

Upon returning from vacation:
4a) mechanic replaced TPS to try to fix roughness (no effect)
4b) mechanic found that the #4 plug was bad
5) the car runs smooth now, but stalls.

I'm going to test the TPS voltage more precisely tomorrow. Last week, it tested at 1 volt (no throttle) - 5 volts (full throttle).

85VicWagonGuy · 10-31-2002

Quote:

Originally posted by GhostDog 5.0
Maybe ignition switch ?

Does it turn off while driving only after 15 minutes or idle too? Sounds like something is cooking.

Since when do vehicles not come with temperature gauges? [/b]

Turns off after 2-3 minutes these days.

Mine only has a dummy light for temperature. No gauge.

85VicWagonGuy · 10-31-2002

Also tried a new computer today... no effect.

tmoss · 10-31-2002

I'd replace the pickup coil in the distributor next. Here is a diagram of part of the 81-85 Duraspark ignition wiring...........

85VicWagonGuy · 10-31-2002

I don't think I have the skill to replace the pickup coil. Sounds like it's quite a feat to remove it.

85VicWagonGuy · 10-31-2002

Could a bad O2 sensor make the engine cut off after warm-up?

Where do I find the 02 sensor on a 302?