Hi. I want to swap a straight 6 200 for a hi-po 289. I'm wondering if all classic mustangs from 66 were built equally, that is, is a car with a 200 capable of handling a 289 without any real modifications (were cars built with a 200 built the same as cars built with a 289)?
I was going to get one of the turnkey one for 6,000 or so from proformance. Aside from taking the old engine out, and putting the new one in, what else do I really need to consider changing in order for the very stock 66 to handle the 289. ie. do I need to look at a transmission swap, front suspension change...any help on the subject would be greatly appreciated.
Hi. I want to swap a straight 6 200 for a hi-po 289. I'm wondering if all classic mustangs from 66 were built equally, that is, is a car with a 200 capable of handling a 289 without any real modifications (were cars built with a 200 built the same as cars built with a 289)?
I was going to get one of the turnkey one for 6,000 or so from proformance. Aside from taking the old engine out, and putting the new one in, what else do I really need to consider changing in order for the very stock 66 to handle the 289. ie. do I need to look at a transmission swap, front suspension change...any help on the subject would be greatly appreciated.
The first thing to look at is the front suspension. I believe you will need some V-8 springs. Aside from that, I believe its a pretty straight forward swap. I'm running a C-4, which some six cylinders used. I had it beefed up a little with a shift kit and a few other items. Of course, you will need some different engine mounts, but as far as I know, not much else.
Thanks for the advice! I've been looking at some of the Ford racing crates from Summit. I am wondering if I could get away with putting a 351 in. Could you run a C4 with a 351? Here's the engine I was speaking of:
Do these Ford Racing Crate Engines have a good reputation? It says 250 Horsepower, but if I were to put in a good carb, some headers and dual exhaust, I'd have myself a reasonable muscle car wouldnt I?
The best and cheapest thing to do, especially if you have to pay someone to do the work, is to sell the L6 car and use that money and the money you will spend on the change over and buy a V8 car. Just my two cent worth. My other two cent worth is to build the L6 for better performance .
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1966 Mustang Vert., 200 CID I6, Autolite 1100, Candy Apple Red, black interior with black power top, C4 Auto Trans (was 3 speed manual), Scarebird 4 lug front disc brake conversion, dual MC in process.
1976 Cobra II, 302 CID, C4 auto trans. Blackjack headers, white with blue stripe and blue interior. Restoration and mod in process.
Thanks for the advice! I've been looking at some of the Ford racing crates from Summit. I am wondering if I could get away with putting a 351 in. Could you run a C4 with a 351? Here's the engine I was speaking of:
Do these Ford Racing Crate Engines have a good reputation? It says 250 Horsepower, but if I were to put in a good carb, some headers and dual exhaust, I'd have myself a reasonable muscle car wouldnt I?
As far as I know, a C-4 will bolt up to a 351. That 351 you are speaking about isn't making that much horsepower, so there shouldn't be any problem. I guess with a good carb and headers/exhaust it wouldn't be too bad of a combination. I don't know if you could call it a muscle car, but it would run down the road nice.
Like RagHead said, you could build the six and make some decent horsepower, maybe more than 250. If you get a chance, look at the February issue of Mustang Monthly, page 68 or go to their website at www.mustangmonthly.com and look at their article titled Guide to Six-Cylinder Performance. Thats what I'm talking about. It might convince you to keep that six.
Cheapest way is to sell your car and buy a v8 one.Read this Six Cylinder Upgrade V8 - Mustang & Fords Magazine that 3 grand don't cover the engine or tranny and the stuff to make them work in the car.
Cheapest way is to sell your car and buy a v8 one.Read this Six Cylinder Upgrade V8 - Mustang & Fords Magazine that 3 grand don't cover the engine or tranny and the stuff to make them work in the car.
And who needs the parts list in this article? That swap was done by someone who had no $ restrictions or apparent $ concerns. How about an article done with some cost saving advice instead of "Let's throw as much dough as we can at this" buying $2200 worth of brakes (riDICulous!!), and everything else straight out of a box. Let's try some real world numbers, that's what I'm looking for, how about some information on cross matching parts from other year Mustangs and other Ford/Mercury models. I can't believe old Henry retooled every part for every year and model. There must be other front suspensions that can be donors as well as motor mounts, trannies and mounts, etc. THAT'S the kind of information I would like, and I don't doubt that that goes for alot of other people as well. The advice to "sell the 6 cyl. Mustang and buy an 8" is hardly helpful. What's wrong with finding an engine and trans on Craigslist as long as it is running? How about used suspension parts instead of new? I'm afraid I won't gratiate myself to some on this forum with this kind of post, but in this dismal economy hot rodders and car nuts need to think outside the box, the "CJ Pony Parts" box that is, no disrespect to that company, it's more of a philosophical comment. I too would like to replace my inline 6 with an 8 and I'd like some direction from guys that have done it, in regard to real reasons why the trans won't survive a mild 8 (doesn't NEED to be 300hp), and/or the rear end for that matter. I have driven many v8 cars with drums on the front, is the need to switch to the 5 lug a matter of better braking or an absolute necessity? Does anyone know of a Ford interchangability manual that would be helpful? Sorry if I have ticked anyone off, that's not my intention. My questions may reveal a true "novice" aspect of this current project, but it is where I'm at. I just don't think that everyone who wants an 8 in their classic Mustang wants to pop wheelies or win Autorama shows. There has to be a "happy medium" of guys who just want to drive, who feel that an 8 fits better between the fenders than a 6.
there are some things you should replace for safety sake. yes you can just drop a v-8 in and be done with it but that does not mean that is the right or safe way to do it. as far as buying used absolutely we all do it and some of the parts are not available new anyway.
things you need to change
1. v-8 spindles. 64-66 six cylinder cars used a lighter casting and they are not designed to hold the extra weight. these are not available new so you have to find them used.
2. brakes. for a daily driver or even an occasional driver the brakes in the 6 just aren't going to be safe with the additional weight and horsepower. now again there are used options if you want to look for them. such as the granada versaille monarch swaps. yes there are mustangs running around with drums all around and they work ok. but they are marginal. at the bare minimum a dual master cylinder is I think a necessity.
these areas are necessary for safety. not just for fun or to throw extra money around.
3. differential. yes you can get by for a while with the 7.5 but it again is not designed to handle the extra horsepower and torque. if you are planning on building a v-8 that doesn't have the extra horsepower I personally don't see the point.
as far as the 5 lug conversion. that facilitates better braking, and wheel selection. if you replace the differential with a used 8 or 9 inch you will then have mismatched lugs front to rear.
I also do not believe in the concept of just sell the 6 and buy an 8 but everyone has an opinion. if you don't know the answer yourself, listen to guys who do and take the advise you want to use. just remember we are all just trying to help in the best way we can. just because you do not agree with the advise given does not mean it is not valuable to someone else.
Mccance: Your input is appreciated very much. Please do not assume I am trying to be an ass, or come off as knowing more than anyone else. I was truly frustrated when I wrote that last post, basically with the "sell the 6 car, buy an 8" comment that certainly is not limited to the quote I included in my post. To Andrewmp6 - if my post came across as picking on yours it was not my intent. It is just that your post was in the stream of this particular thread. You are not alone on Mustang forums in your opinion about the "advantages" of not dealing with the 6 to 8 conversion. If I have offended, I apologize.
Mccance, you have touched on many of the issues I have concerns with. I have more questions for those who konw!
Is there any information on the actual braking performance on classic Mustangs with original drums versus disc? I know that the V8 Mustangs used a 10" drum instead of the 9" used on the 6. Just wondering if, in real world terms, the switch to disc is justified?
As to the rear end, I agree an 8" would be an improvement over the 7.5, just thinking that someone could get by with the 7.5 with a stock motor and then replace it if, and when, the engine is built for better performance. That was my thought. I think even a stock 289 or 302 would be a vast improvement over a 120hp inline 6, but would it necessitate a rear end swap? I guess I'm asking if anyone out there has had one blow up on them after changing to a stock 8?
My god, at this rate, our beloved 200s are going to become endangered, or even worse extinct. But, you will have to upgrade engine harnesses, rear end, suspension all around, convert from 4 lug wheels to 5 lug. It would probably be easier (and cheaper) to upgrade your six with the help of classicinlines.com.
I understand your frustration. I am also in the process of swapping a 5.0 into a 6 cylinder car. my reasons are a little different though. I intend to upgrade all of the components to more modern improvements anyway so the starting platform did not make any difference to me, and I came across this 67 coupe that had minimal rust and I got it for 600 bucks. the thing is that while you can cut corners ultimately you want the vehicle to be safe. the disk brake swap is a vast improvement for many reasons. first have you ever had a wheel cylinder leak in a front drum brake. one side grabs and the other doesn't and your in the ditch. so yes drum brakes are ok in the back but I would not want my kids riding in a vehicle with all four drums even though I did it when I was young. the discs are just that much better and safer. second and at least as important is the master cylinder. the spindles and springs are a must for the extra weight.
as far as the rearend sure it will last a while and if you don't hot rod it much but an 8 inch or 9 inch rearend can be bought relatively cheaply and you will be a lot happier. there is a lot involved in the swap.
my advise as I said before is don't let your eagerness to do the swap outpace your common sense. someday more than your life may depend on the quality work you do.
and btw I a appreciate your remarks it helps keep people in the real world. I have been asked on occasion why didn't I do this or that and frequently the answer is I chose to spend my money in other ways. that is ok. thats what we do. do it your way, just be safe.
66Sprint200 - I can sympathize with your concern. My first inclination for my 66 was to restore it as close as I could to original the day it rolled out of the Dearborn factory. The project began to get deeper and deeper the more I looked into it. The car has been in storage for 10 years or so and needs a LOT of work. I decided I didn't want to go with the Tahoe Turquoise color, then I decided I didn't want the aqua interior. The original plan began to slip away. Once determining that the engine would need a complete rebuild I started thinking about going with an 8 instead and totally give up on restoration. So I began looking into it. I knew some suspension mods would be necessary having read posts and articles about it. At this point I'm only researching the idea, I haven't committed to it. I have no problem keeping the 6, if fact today I have been pricing out rebuild kits. The 6 may yet survive.
Mccance - your point is well made and taken. I do understand the value of safety, but I grew up in an age when no one wore helmets when riding bikes, when Ma would kicks us out of the house on Saturday and we wouldn't come back until dinner. Am I a dare devil? No, but I have driven many heavier (than the Mustang) cars with V8s and drum brakes and never felt unsafe. Just where I'm coming from that's all. Still doing research at this point. Thanks for the input!
Is there a way to upload a photo to a post for all to see what I am up against? I saw something about member galleries, if I can't upload to a post I may try that. I'm sure you guys will get a big kick out of the "before" pictures!
Swapping a 200 for a 289 in a 1966 Mustang Coupe? 
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