I feel your pain bubbamace. I have removed my engine, and it is on a stand now for cleaning, re-assembly of new gaskets. I don't have an oil slinger so I am going to concentrate on getting the balancer centered, and hope this is sufficient. I am using an original timing chain cover with the seal installed from the inside. I should know how it looks by Sunday or Monday night.
Keep us informed. I know that the seal has to go in just right. I bought a seal driver to make sure I get the seal in straight. It was cheap insurance since I didn't have a socket that large. Of course, I've never had a leak between the seal and the cover, just between the seal and the Harmonic Balancer. Good luck with that. It should be a lot easier on the stand and with the oil pan off. If it wasn't so much trouble, I'd pull the engine also.
Well, I just installed the timing chain cover. I started the timing chain cover bolts and then installed the harmonic balancer. I tried to center up the timing chain cover, but there wasn't much movement once the harmonic balancer was in there. I also couldn't see much with the balancer in there as far as getting it centered so we will see what happens this time.
Good luck. Do you have the timing cover with the seal that goes in from inside or outside? The old cover that I'm going to try and use next has the seal that is installed inside. I had to cut off the ramp inside and grind the cover flat so that my gear drive will fit. I hope this works also.
I had an original cover with the seal installed from the inside. I had removed my engine to go through it, and it is just now completely reassembled so I should be installing it back into the car this week. I will let you guys know if the leak is gone.
I had an original cover with the seal installed from the inside. I had removed my engine to go through it, and it is just now completely reassembled so I should be installing it back into the car this week. I will let you guys know if the leak is gone.
Let us know. I'm going to the auto parts store tomorrow and buying a new gasket set for the old timing cover and will hope this works. Is that your Bulldog or just a picture? My son has one and she is one cool dog.
That is not my bulldog; just a cool picture I found online. I always wanted a bulldog, but they are very expensive. Whenever I have $1800 it goes into the car long before I get another animal. They are cool though and I would still like to have one some day.
As for the question of the locating dowel provisions that are cast into the cover. There must have been an alignment problem using them as the factory service manual states to use the balancer or Ford's special tool for centering the seal.
I bought a special tool from Jeg's a while back to rotate the crankshaft. It slips over the end of the crank snout (Without the balancer installed) and has a groove cut in it for the keyway. The end has a square 1/2" hole in it so that a 1/2" breaker bar can be used to rotate the engine. It just so happens that the outside diameter is the same as the balancer. Even though nothing was mentioned with the tool, it works perfectly for centering the cover. It looks similar to Ford's special tool.
Unless the tool has gone through a redesign, (Which is probably unlikely), it is still available from Jeg's. It is made by Milidon and the part number and price is as follows:
P/N 778-66900 $17.99 www.jegs.com
If you find that something is making slight contact with the timing cover, use two gaskets. Before final installation, apply a light coating of gasket sealant between them.
Now THAT could be useful. What I did was put the balancer on about halfway, right as it started gripping the crank, and adjusted it from there. When I get it installed all the way, it's difficult to catch a glimpse of the seal, much less try to get things aligned.
I thought I was the only one who had a gear drive I agree, they just make sense. There's simply no way in hell those gears will stretch or hop a tooth. When I got my timing chain cover, the machine shop ground the ramp off as well.
Bubbamace, what you might do is give Pete Jackson a call and see what they have to say.
Also, post pictures of what you guys are finding/doing. You never know who's going to end up carousing these forums later and how it might help them.
What would be really useful is if someone were to cut the stem off a harmonic balancer, and used that to align the timing chain cover. It would make things a lot easier, because then one would be able see exactly what they're doing....
Now THAT could be useful. What I did was put the balancer on about halfway, right as it started gripping the crank, and adjusted it from there. When I get it installed all the way, it's difficult to catch a glimpse of the seal, much less try to get things aligned.
I thought I was the only one who had a gear drive I agree, they just make sense. There's simply no way in hell those gears will stretch or hop a tooth. When I got my timing chain cover, the machine shop ground the ramp off as well.
Bubbamace, what you might do is give Pete Jackson a call and see what they have to say.
Also, post pictures of what you guys are finding/doing. You never know who's going to end up carousing these forums later and how it might help them.
What would be really useful is if someone were to cut the stem off a harmonic balancer, and used that to align the timing chain cover. It would make things a lot easier, because then one would be able see exactly what they're doing....
Just a thought
I just learned another lesson. There are two seals for the timing cover as discussed before. The lesson I learned is the two timing cover seals not only go in differently, but the inside hole diameter is different. Now, I don't know how that could be, but I tried using my Ford alignment tool on the old timing cover seal and it instantly ripped it. Even after I ripped it, I still couldn't get the tool inside the seal where it belongs. I tried using grease and assembly lube. The Harmonic balancer went right in? I just need to put on the water pump pulley and fan (and fluids) and I'll try firing it up. I also noted that the earlier cover requires several different size bolts then the late model cover due to the late model cover being more beefy. What a pain this has been. I don't mind doing this once or twice but this is number 4 and the fifth seal. I think I'll take my Harley out for a ride. At least its dependable. As far as the Bulldog, My son has that dog at the vets, every week regarding some problem, so save your money. They are more expensive than your Mustang, for sure.
What the french toast...two different inside diameters, eh? I'm willing to bet one is for later model versions, and one is for earlier. It wouldn't surprise me; I know they changed the rear main seal. It wouldn't be shocking to find out the front seal changed. Which begs the question are the diameters for the 50 vs 28oz. balancers different? I don't think this would be as problematic if maniacs like me weren't mixing parts from later with earlier model engines
As an update to mine: I finally got the chance to button up the things that needed buttoning and drove it around a bit yesterday for a couple of minutes. I've been starting it up and revving it up real high, without any problems (yet). I'm noticing a droplet or two of something oily spattered on the engine compartment, but it *may* be another issue. Still need to investigate; will let you know when I do. So far, still a success (knock on wood). In either case, it's still a huge improvement over what it was before.
I know what you mean about having a reliable ride. There's nothing better than being able to blow off some steam in the truck after a day of hard work and no progress. All the aggravation will make it all the sweeter when it's done.
great info this thread and its got me rethinking my approach at my build
( 91 block into a 67) so 2 different seals ? maybe that what was in my fel-pro kit? (pic) and i was wondering which one to use
i have a new 50 oz here and i was going to check it against
the 28 oz off the old 302 which is a 68 to see if the diameters are different , hope we can stop these leaks
That cover looks to be (for all intents and purposes) exactly the same as the one I'm using. I used the seal in the bottom right of your picture; the one with the flange, and so far have had remarkable luck. I'm using a 50oz.
Let us know what you find, yes! It would be of great insight. Actually, since you have both of those gaskets readily available, measure the inside diameter if you would and see if you find a difference with those as well
great info this thread and its got me rethinking my approach at my build
( 91 block into a 67) so 2 different seals ? maybe that what was in my fel-pro kit? (pic) and i was wondering which one to use
i have a new 50 oz here and i was going to check it against
the 28 oz off the old 302 which is a 68 to see if the diameters are different , hope we can stop these leaks
This cover is the later version. I can tell because of all the metal around the bolt holes. This cover should take the seal that goes in from the outside of the cover and the 50 oz. balancer. My engine is a little different from most. Its a later 5.0 with a 28 oz. balance. This the way it was machined because the machinist told me it was better to have a lighter balance? It made sense at the time he explained it to me. Anyway, glad to hear you got your car back together and hoping those droplets of oil are not from the timing cover seal. I'm finishing mine tomorrow and will let you know how it does. It would sure be great to work on another part of the car. The motorcycle ride was what I needed, just like your truck.
My engine is still on the stand. I have a lot of cleaning and some welding to to in the engine compartment before it goes back in. I know I don't have to tell you guys, but you are both correct. My opinion for alpha male 67 is to use the seal with the flange on the bottom, which gets installed from the outside. I do not have that timing chain cover. I have an original from a 65 and the seal goes in from the inside. Anyway, I should be steam cleaning, sanding, and painting on Saturday, and reinstalling the engine on Sunday. I will let you know how it goes. Oh yeah, don't worry about the dog; they are cool, but I would rather invest my money in a leaking front seal.
I agree, they just make sense. There's simply no way in hell those gears will stretch or hop a tooth. When I got my timing chain cover, the machine shop ground the ramp off as well. 
