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Classic Mustangs Tech Forum

Technical discussions specific to 1964-1967, 1968-1970, and 1971-1973 Classic Mustang. Discuss all tech related to in-line six cylinder and V8 powered Vintage Mustangs here.

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Unread 09-22-2010   #16 (permalink)
zhlange is offline Apprentice

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Thank so much. When you 'massage' what exactly do you mean? Is that something that I can do myself?
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Unread 09-22-2010   #17 (permalink)
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He failed to mention that you will need to install a clutch pedal, cable or master cylinder for the clutch, and small things like the pilot bearing, driveline length?, flywheel, and bellhousing?

"massaging" the support means beating it up out of the way to clear the transmission. Depending on ow far it has to be moved it can be a little job or a big one.
The cheapest and easiest thing you can do is keep the transmission that you have now or replace the transmission with a new one of the same style and type.
Talk about costs and mods:
.....C4 $850 new rebuild built for 500HP / 500 Ft Lbs
.....Converter (higher stall) $150
Total $1000

From American Powertrain website:
.....T5 $2795 (500HP)
.....Bellhousing $468
.....Reverse wiring harness $24
.....Clutch disc (organic) $89
Total $3376
.....add to this the cost of clutch pressure plate, driveline mods (if necessary), and clutch pedal and linkage.
Now the Kit will likely save you some money but it will still be well over the $1000 for a new C4 and converter that will bolt in without mods where your old one came out.
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No racing - just a fun car built by and for me.
Project in process
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Unread 09-23-2010   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS View Post
He failed to mention that you will need to install a clutch pedal, cable or master cylinder for the clutch, and small things like the pilot bearing, driveline length?, flywheel, and bellhousing?

"massaging" the support means beating it up out of the way to clear the transmission. Depending on ow far it has to be moved it can be a little job or a big one.
The cheapest and easiest thing you can do is keep the transmission that you have now or replace the transmission with a new one of the same style and type.
Talk about costs and mods:
.....C4 $850 new rebuild built for 500HP / 500 Ft Lbs
.....Converter (higher stall) $150
Total $1000

From American Powertrain website:
.....T5 $2795 (500HP)
.....Bellhousing $468
.....Reverse wiring harness $24
.....Clutch disc (organic) $89
Total $3376
.....add to this the cost of clutch pressure plate, driveline mods (if necessary), and clutch pedal and linkage.
Now the Kit will likely save you some money but it will still be well over the $1000 for a new C4 and converter that will bolt in without mods where your old one came out.

Thank you.

I assumed since his car was an automatic that hanging pedals, linkage etc...was a given to anyone looking into doing the conversion.

As far as "massaging" the rib, yes, flattening it out or simply remove a 6" section of it and replace it with a flat piece of steel like we do.

By the way...a complete conversion kit from automatic to T5 5-speed (includes everything from pedals and linkage, all the way to the driveshaft and everything in between) runs $3700 complete. So yes, it is more than the C4 and convertor you are referring to, but it all depends on if you want to shift gears or go auto.

A complete auto to TKO 5-speed will run you in the $4300 range (give or take $100) and these are brand new with a full 3 year warranty and 2 years to install and activate the warranty as opposed to a rebuilt unit.

The obvious advantage of a 5-speed over a C4 is overdrive. Being able to cruise down the highway to your favorite car show and being able to keep up with the pace of traffic while saving gas and more importantly, wear and tear on your motor is the biggest benefit. Being able to talk to the guy/gal in the passenger seat while cruising down the highway may or may not be a benefit, depending on how you look at it.
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Unread 09-23-2010   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rj8806 View Post
Thank you.

I assumed since his car was an automatic that hanging pedals, linkage etc...was a given to anyone looking into doing the conversion.

As far as "massaging" the rib, yes, flattening it out or simply remove a 6" section of it and replace it with a flat piece of steel like we do.

By the way...a complete conversion kit from automatic to T5 5-speed (includes everything from pedals and linkage, all the way to the driveshaft and everything in between) runs $3700 complete. So yes, it is more than the C4 and convertor you are referring to, but it all depends on if you want to shift gears or go auto.

A complete auto to TKO 5-speed will run you in the $4300 range (give or take $100) and these are brand new with a full 3 year warranty and 2 years to install and activate the warranty as opposed to a rebuilt unit.

The obvious advantage of a 5-speed over a C4 is overdrive. Being able to cruise down the highway to your favorite car show and being able to keep up with the pace of traffic while saving gas and more importantly, wear and tear on your motor is the biggest benefit. Being able to talk to the guy/gal in the passenger seat while cruising down the highway may or may not be a benefit, depending on how you look at it.
Rj,
thanks for the prices and the comparison. I know that when going from C4 to AOD The .6 overdrive requires steeper gears with carbureted engines. The gears needed for the AOD are in the 3.89 - 4.11 range to kep the engine out of the idle and off-idle circuits at freeway speeds. Not dealing much with manual transmissions what are the OD ratios on the T5s and others? How much gear change (in the rear end) is required to keep the carb in the cruise circuit at 60-70 mph?
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rebuilt, rewired, modified for slalom and hill climb
No racing - just a fun car built by and for me.
Project in process
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Unread 09-23-2010   #20 (permalink)
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I installed a T5 into my 66 and did it myself. The 66 was a 3 speed manual so that helped. Keep in mind that the prices below were bargain basement and I was fortunate to find a T5 in really good condition.
Used 1989 T5 WC transmission $350
Used T5 bell housing $ 25
10 1/2 inch clutch $200
28oz 157 tooth flywheel for 10 1/2 $130
Hydraulic clutch $230
cross member $135
New bushing/seal/steel retainer $ 30
Shift handle $ 25
ARP bolts $ 30

About 1100 and change. More info on my webpage
Good Luck and BE Safe
Ron
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Unread 09-24-2010   #21 (permalink)
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I found a t5 from a 1994 (non cobra) with 82K miles for $425 and a complete 351W engine from a E250 for $500. Are these prices too high? Thanks.
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