I have a question on a flex plate? - Ford Mustang Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
Exclamation I have a question on a flex plate?

Hello to all. I have a 86 5.0 that im instaling in a 67 mustang with a c4 trans. I have the flex plate for the 5.0 which is a 164 tooth 50oz. I also have the tork converter which has a 10.5" bolt patern. I have been traying to find a flex plate that will work with the aplication but with no luck. Any one that might have an input with my problem id apriciate some help. Its the key pece to the instalation of my power plant. Hoping to get the Pony runing before the end of the year.
I will atach some pictures of the parts I have.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0575.jpg
Views:	457
Size:	804.3 KB
ID:	144316   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0576.jpg
Views:	532
Size:	826.2 KB
ID:	144317   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0577.jpg
Views:	264
Size:	775.8 KB
ID:	144318   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0578.jpg
Views:	249
Size:	863.2 KB
ID:	144319   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0580.jpg
Views:	162
Size:	758.6 KB
ID:	144320  

slmdlow is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
Couped Up's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Monroe
Posts: 169
 
Maybe this ill fit.....

Performance Automatic PA26461 Performance Automatic SFI Flexplates

'70 Fastback project

'68 J code, 4 speed
Couped Up is offline  
post #3 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
Thanks for the post couped up. Im not sure if it matters but the flex plate i have is a 164 tooth so im not sure if the 157 tooth one will work.
slmdlow is offline  
post #4 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
GT Member
Classic Member
 
Explorer's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: Raphine
Posts: 1,220
 
Wait for someone to confirm or deny this as I'm going off a feeble memory. I think you will need the 157t flexplate with the 67 C4 Mustang bell housing. I ran into this when I did a V8 Ranger swap a few years ago. I recollect the Mustang bell housing was smaller.

66 Coupe 200ci I6 Stock
66 Bronco half cab 203ci I6, CI aluminum Head and intake, Holley 390cfm 4V, Clifford header, Isky cam, KB pistons 9.7:1 comp, DSII ignition
Explorer is offline  
post #5 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
Banned
 
cindys_sn95's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Gulfport
Posts: 7,991
 
i think you are right richard. the 157t/50oz.
cindys_sn95 is offline  
post #6 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
MACH I Member
Classic Member
5.0L Member
 
The Greek's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 3,184
 
The flexplate that you show in the photo is for use with the AOD or automatic overdrive transmission. The C4's flexplate is smaller in diameter. The flexplate that you need is an aftermarket piece only and was never used on a production Ford vehicle. You'll never find one in the scrap yard, so don't waste your time.

What you need for your C4 is a 10 1/2" (Torque Converter Bolt Pattern), 157 Tooth flexplate with a 50 ounce counterweight. Your torque converter bolt pattern will be correct for the new 50 Oz. flexplate.

There are several sources for them. Our forum has sponsors that can get one for you and probably with a member's discount. Summit Racing and Jegs are two mail order sources. Also any dealer of Ford Racing Performance parts as well as most vendors of Ford performance automatic transmissions will carry them, too.

Don't make the mistake of using a 10 1/2" 157 Tooth flexplate with a 28 ounce counterweight from the parts store. This will bolt right up, but because of having the wrong weight, will cause vibration and engine damage.

To mount the flexplate, I recommend using new mounting bolts, (Specifically for a flexplate. These bolts are shorter than those for a manual trans. flywheel.), bolts of good quality such as bolts from ARP. Use a good thread sealant that has a high resistance to oil and temperature. Always use the circular backing plate that goes between the flexplate and the mounting bolts. This plate helps to spread out the bolt clamping force and prevents flexplate cracking due to vibration or harmonics. If you don't have one, get one. It's important. Ask for one when getting the flexplate or get one from the Ford dealer or NAPA. They don't cost much.

F.Y.I. about your engine. If it still has the original pistons. The 1986 5.0 HO pistons were forged from the factory, but there are no valve reliefs cut in them. This was on the 1986 engine only. If you are changing the cylinder heads, don't forget to check the valve to piston clearance. The 86 only cyl. heads had a unique combustion chamber design which, it's said, isn't very good for performance because of the excessive valve shrouding. It seems that Ford picked 1986 as a design/testing year. This head was dropped from use in 87 on Mustang's 5.0 HO, as Ford went back to a more traditional combustion chamber as could be found on the 85 and then 87 and up 5.0 HO.

I've personally done a 5.0 swap on a 67. Here's something else that may be of interest. The portions of the motor mounts that bolt each side of the engine to the chassis (Pedestals) may need to be swapped out with a set from a late year 66 or 68. The 1967 motor mounts and pedestals are a 67 only design. You may find that your new mounts are listed as being for a 67 plus several other years. That's wrong. The dimensions and angles of the mount make for about 1/4" of difference in the position of the hole for inserting the long through bolt into one or both sides of the engine. The solution is as said above. Change the pedestals and use the actual mount that is supposed to fit. Like that cheap set for a 68. To acquire an actual set of 67 mounts, as best I know, they'll have to be NOS and that means expensive.

If you fight the installation on your 67 and finally get the last through bolt installed by stretching the mount on one side as I did. You will experience a complete failure and separation of the rubber portion of the mount. The mount that failed for me was the driver's side. The engine lifted and the fan caused considerable damage.
The Greek is offline  
post #7 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
SHELBY GT 350 Member
Classic Member
 
Lizer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: Kalamazoo
Posts: 6,124
 
Greek--I have a question on 1 point of clarification. On a say, 85 or 86 block, if you're using the 28 oz balancer then it is okay to use the original 28 oz flexplate, correct?

Regarding the motor mounts--I kept the mounts from the 289 that was mounted in my 67 (it was originally a 6 cyl car back in the day) and transferred them to my 302. It is kind of a paint to get it bolted in, but I only chalked that up to nothing being easy in this kind of work. Is this what you were talking about in regards to using the original mounts? I don't want to get any surprises like what you had.
Lizer is offline  
post #8 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
Thank you for the info Greek well put. I have gotten a pair of 68 mottor mouts from a wreked 68 in the salvage yard a few months back. now is their a way to take the balansing of a 28oz 157 tooth flex and put a 50oz on it and have it be right? The link that Couped up posted looks like the right part but for that price I can pick up an AOD from the salvage yard and get the over drive gear and better gas milege.( )
To Lizer I bolive if the internals of the engine are from a 85 or 86 you need to use the 50oz balansing as I think in 81 the balansing changed not an expert but thats how I understod it. I have reed a lot about the subject but every trans place I have gone to has no idea of what im talking about. Thanks to all that have posted on this topic
slmdlow is offline  
post #9 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011
MACH I Member
S197 Member
 
Dave's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Location: Amherst
Posts: 2,635
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizer View Post
Greek--I have a question on 1 point of clarification. On a say, 85 or 86 block, if you're using the 28 oz balancer then it is okay to use the original 28 oz flexplate, correct?
Both the balancer and flexplate have to match the balance of the motor. When Ford went to the 50 oz balance, that was because they changed the balance of the crankshaft, removed weigh and corrected by the balancer and flexplate/flywheel. All three have to match to prevent problems.
Dave

2015 Stage 3 Roush
'66' Ranchero w/almost done 302 T-5 swap
2000 4x4 Ranger
2003 4x2 Ranger
'69' Fairlane Cobra, 428 4-speed waiting for work
Dave is offline  
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
Couped Up's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Monroe
Posts: 169
 
Here's a few more..... that should fit the bill.......

TCI Auto 529610 - TCI Flexplates - Application - SummitRacing.com

http://www.jegs.com/i/Hays/490/12-040/10002/-1

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Speedway...item1e6827a66b

B&M 50239 - B&M Flexplates - Overview - SummitRacing.com


Good luck with your choices, and Happy Holidays....

'70 Fastback project

'68 J code, 4 speed
Couped Up is offline  
post #11 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
Thank you for all the help any one eals that whant to give their input ill apriciate it.:kooky:
slmdlow is offline  
post #12 of 33 (permalink) Old 11-30-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
Duing some more reserch on the parts an prices i came acrros this on a difren site. I also atached some pictures of the 164 tooth flexplate inside the bell housing. Will this work?
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/Pioneer-Flywheel-Automatic-Transmission/1980-Ford-Mustang/_/N-im32nZ6o22f?counter=0&itemIdentifier=55178_0_0_
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0586.jpg
Views:	460
Size:	565.0 KB
ID:	144372   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG0587.jpg
Views:	1739
Size:	976.0 KB
ID:	144373  
slmdlow is offline  
SHELBY GT 350 Member
Classic Member
 
Lizer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: Kalamazoo
Posts: 6,124
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave View Post
Both the balancer and flexplate have to match the balance of the motor. When Ford went to the 50 oz balance, that was because they changed the balance of the crankshaft, removed weigh and corrected by the balancer and flexplate/flywheel. All three have to match to prevent problems.
Dave
I figured as much. In my case, my engine was balanced by the builder who put together the long block. In order for them to balance it, they had me send them my 28 oz balancer and flexplate that came off my 289. I'm therefore under the impression the internals were balanced to the 28 oz balancer though I don't know how this is done. They said it wouldn't be a problem as long as I balanced everything to the balancer and flexplate I'd be using, so that's what I've always stuck with.
Lizer is offline  
post #14 of 33 (permalink) Old 12-02-2011 Thread Starter
Apprentice
Classic Member
 
slmdlow's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Fullerton
Posts: 139
 
any one with an imput on the pictures i posted. wondering if the 164 tooth flex plate will work with the ball housing i have
slmdlow is offline  
GT Member
 
mccance's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2002
Location: atlantic
Posts: 1,299
 
you need a different flex plate to work with your torque converter right? so what you need is to get one of the many conversion flexplates that have already been listed. that way everything will work together. it will have the correct balance, the correct torque converter bolt pattern and will mesh correctly with your starter drive. I am unclear why you are asking if the flex plate you have will work with your bell housing when it will not work with your torque converter. are you planning on getting a different torque converter instead? if you are I would not recommend that. I don't think they make a c-4 torque converter with the bolt pattern to bolt up to your flex plate and even if they did I think you would run into starter issues. I have not done that particular swap but I have always read that you need the 157 tooth flywheel I am assuming it is do to having the proper starter tooth mesh pattern. if you look at the picture you posted of your flexplate inside the bellhousing, and look at the starter bolt holes. the flexplate comes almost all the way to the line connecting the two bolts. it does not look like there is enough room for the starter drive to fit.

65 mustang. supercharged 302 currie 9 inch, 5 speed.

67 mustang built for my daughter

89 convertible lx in progress

click on the house icon to see my garage page with build info.
mccance is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Mustang Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a VALID email address for yourself, otherwise you will not receive the necessary confirmation email needed to confirm, validate and activate your new AFM member account.

Failure to provide a VALID email address, will result in the cancellation of your new AFM member account registration.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Random Question

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome


1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183