1966 mustang engine rebuild gone bad? - Ford Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012 Thread Starter
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Question 1966 mustang engine rebuild gone bad?

Hi all,

I have a 1965 mustang that had a worn 6 cyl 200 cid engine in it. Over the winter I had another engine rebuilt by our local engine shop. The rebuilt engine has numbers showing it is a 1966 6 cyl 200. So, Ive been doing the engine swap over the last 2 weeks with a friend of mine. Finally got to the point of starting it up yesterday. It would turn over, but not start. We checked for a good spark and fuel. Spark was good, but fuel seemed not to be there. We decided to put starter fluid down carb to try to start again. It kinda started to try to start, but we had a backfire, so we stopped. We decided to recheck all hookups to see if we had done anything wrong.

Thats when we noticed that we had installed the distributor 180 degrees off. To make things worse we had the spark plug wires wrong too, so firing order was off. After fixing those 2 problems, we tried starting it again. It took a while, but started up rough, then smoothed out pretty good. We had the valve cover off so we could verify that oil was appearing, it was. But then we noticed this "clunking" noise towards the back of the engine, towards the rear of engine/bell housing area but couldnt really nail down where it was coming from. We shifted the transmission thru reverse and park, etc and it seemed fine. Thats when we shut it off.

So, here's my question: Could that backfire I mentioned above have "broken" something? What could be causing the clunk,clunk,clunk noise? Engine shop do something wrong?

BTW, The transmission was refurbished and checked out also just last week during the install.

Thanks in advance.
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gernblan View Post
Hi all,

I have a 1965 mustang that had a worn 6 cyl 200 cid engine in it. Over the winter I had another engine rebuilt by our local engine shop. The rebuilt engine has numbers showing it is a 1966 6 cyl 200. So, Ive been doing the engine swap over the last 2 weeks with a friend of mine. Finally got to the point of starting it up yesterday. It would turn over, but not start. We checked for a good spark and fuel. Spark was good, but fuel seemed not to be there. We decided to put starter fluid down carb to try to start again. It kinda started to try to start, but we had a backfire, so we stopped. We decided to recheck all hookups to see if we had done anything wrong.

Thats when we noticed that we had installed the distributor 180 degrees off. To make things worse we had the spark plug wires wrong too, so firing order was off. After fixing those 2 problems, we tried starting it again. It took a while, but started up rough, then smoothed out pretty good. We had the valve cover off so we could verify that oil was appearing, it was. But then we noticed this "clunking" noise towards the back of the engine, towards the rear of engine/bell housing area but couldnt really nail down where it was coming from. We shifted the transmission thru reverse and park, etc and it seemed fine. Thats when we shut it off.

So, here's my question: Could that backfire I mentioned above have "broken" something? What could be causing the clunk,clunk,clunk noise? Engine shop do something wrong?

BTW, The transmission was refurbished and checked out also just last week during the install.

Thanks in advance.
Hi,
I'd say, a typical carb back fire, would not, as you described it, cause a mechanical failure. You mentioned, you cycled the transmission through a couple of gears, "it seemed fine", you stopped. Why, if it seemed fine, did you stop and not proceed to fine tuning?

Ken
Severna Park, MD
1964 1/2 Poppy Red Cvt Resto-Mod
333 cu.in, dual Webers, CI cam, TW heads,TRI-Ys, 3.55 rear, T5z, TCP susp., real leather seating
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012 Thread Starter
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Hi,
I'd say, a typical carb back fire, would not, as you described it, cause a mechanical failure. You mentioned, you cycled the transmission through a couple of gears, "it seemed fine", you stopped. Why, if it seemed fine, did you stop and not proceed to fine tuning?
Ken,

Thanks for the reply. By "it seemed fine", I meant that the transmission seemed to be ok by feeling it going into different gears. We stopped because the "clunk,clunk,clunk" noise was constant and I dont know what it is yet. Didnt want to do more damage by keeping it running.

Dave
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012
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check the converter nuts.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gernblan View Post
Ken,

Thanks for the reply. By "it seemed fine", I meant that the transmission seemed to be ok by feeling it going into different gears. We stopped because the "clunk,clunk,clunk" noise was constant and I dont know what it is yet. Didnt want to do more damage by keeping it running.

Dave
OK, I understand that. With that valve cover off, did all of the rockers look like they were cycling correctly? Be absolutely sure you have the correct firing order in place. I know with some V8s, with a couple of wires switched the engine will start and run but will after fire through the exhaust and make what appears to be a clinking noise. So, re-visit. Do you have a vac gauge to connect and read the engine's breathing health? It can also be used to adjust your carb's curb idle quality.
Good Luck!

Ken
Severna Park, MD
1964 1/2 Poppy Red Cvt Resto-Mod
333 cu.in, dual Webers, CI cam, TW heads,TRI-Ys, 3.55 rear, T5z, TCP susp., real leather seating
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012
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I'm with cindys, The torque converter could be hitting something if it was not seated properly. A "clunk clunk" sounds like something hitting over and over as it's cycling. Can you try to narrow down where the sound is coming from?
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-30-2012
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Any kind of clunking generally isn't a good thing, but it also doesn't mean that damage was done.
- Is the timing set correctly?
- are the valves adjusted correctly?
You said that it started rough then smoothened out. Did it smooth out on it's own or were you making adjustments to smoothen it out?
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cindys_sn95 View Post
check the converter nuts.
While checking the converter I found the problem. It wasnt the converter. The crank is rubbing the oil pan. I havent determined why yet. Maybe the oil pan got dented during the rebuild or install. Time to crawl under again. :<(
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012
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That will do it!. Knew I had a dented pan, but it was clearing till tranny was removed and rebuilt. Must have gotten dented a little more. Attitude adjustment with hammer and all is well.

66 Coupe 200ci I6 Stock
66 Bronco half cab 203ci I6, CI aluminum Head and intake, Holley 390cfm 4V, Clifford header, Isky cam, KB pistons 9.7:1 comp, DSII ignition
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-02-2012 Thread Starter
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Question oil pan dents photos

Attached are pictures of the oil pan and dents. Do the dents look "big" enough to cause this noise from rubbing the crank?
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Yep, it'll be obvious when you pull the pan. Luckily, not a bad job on these.

66 Coupe 200ci I6 Stock
66 Bronco half cab 203ci I6, CI aluminum Head and intake, Holley 390cfm 4V, Clifford header, Isky cam, KB pistons 9.7:1 comp, DSII ignition
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Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't the oil pick-up more likely to be affected by dents in the bottom of the pan?
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Sump portion of pan would affect pickup. The shallow portion of pan is close to crank.

66 Coupe 200ci I6 Stock
66 Bronco half cab 203ci I6, CI aluminum Head and intake, Holley 390cfm 4V, Clifford header, Isky cam, KB pistons 9.7:1 comp, DSII ignition
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-04-2012 Thread Starter
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Smile 1966 mustang 200 6 cyl engine oil pan problem - solved

Thanks for everyones input on this problem. It turned out to be the dented oil pan causing the crank to hit it.

The fix was: Drain the oil pan. Jack up the front onto blocks. Remove front stabilizer bar. Disconnect 1 auto transmission line at the radiator. Remove the oil pan bolts and pan. I used a block of wood to rest the pan on (where the dent was) so I could use another piece of wood to hammer out the dent from the inside of the pan. The gasket was fine since it was a brand new engine rebuild, so I just added some oil resistant sealant onto the oil pan rim. Carefully place oil pan back in place and start all bolts to hand tight. Tighten to torque specs (7-9 for this engine) starting from center bolts working towards each end of the oil pan. reconnect the auto transmission line. Re-install the stabilizer bar. Lower the car off of the blocks. Add oil back in. Start the car and check for oil leaks and verify the clunk is gone. :<)
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