302 Cleveland Forge heads - Ford Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016 Thread Starter
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302 Cleveland Forge heads

Anything special about 1970 302 Cleveland iron heads?
"Run O The Mill" or something I should keep if I go to an aluminum head?
I asked a couple of guys and it always turns into a 351 heads on a 302 engine block debate usually fueled by one to many beers.
Thanks.

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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016
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If the heads have 302 cast into them they are nothing special. For example an out of the box Ford X head out flows a ported iron 351W head and costs less in the long run. Go with an aluminum head and don't dump any money in the iron heads.


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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016
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Wait. Are we talking about Cleveland OR Windsor heads here?

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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016 Thread Starter
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There is no "W" on them so I guess the "CF" cast into them means Cleveland along with the "302" designates the engine.
The heads are original to engine as the car was was only driven for a little over six years and then parked for 37 before I got ahold of her.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Makedust View Post
There is no "W" on them so I guess the "CF" cast into them means Cleveland along with the "302" designates the engine.
The heads are original to engine as the car was was only driven for a little over six years and then parked for 37 before I got ahold of her.
Holy crap.

1987 GT 5 speed- BBK 65mm TB & FP reg., 1.6 roller rockers, 31 spline axles, 3.27 gears, Aluminum driveshaft, emissions deleted, FMS headers, B&M starter, Tubular rear control arms.
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2016
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Ok, I had a chance to simmer down. Those are Windsor heads. You can tell because the valves are inline; clevelands use an awesome canted valve design and look WILDLY different than windsors. Hence the mini aneurism I had when you made those last comments.

1987 GT 5 speed- BBK 65mm TB & FP reg., 1.6 roller rockers, 31 spline axles, 3.27 gears, Aluminum driveshaft, emissions deleted, FMS headers, B&M starter, Tubular rear control arms.
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-08-2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Makedust View Post
There is no "W" on them so I guess the "CF" cast into them means Cleveland along with the "302" designates the engine.
Yes, that is correct.

The CF cast into the head says they were made in the Cleveland Foundry. Many people generically call them 'Windsor' heads but more 'Windsor' heads were probably made in the Cleveland foundry than the one in Windsor. All 'Windsor' heads before mid-1966 were from Cleveland since Ford had not yet built a foundry across the river in Windsor, Ontario. From the Windsor foundry the marking was either an 'E' or 'WF'. With Thermactor emission heads there was a big difference between the 'Windsor' heads from Cleveland and Windsor. One had the air injection passages internal to the head (Windsor) and the other (Cleveland) used exterior pipes to route the air.

The '302' is more iffy since Ford put some of that stuff on 289 or 302s interchangeably. You would need to look at more numbers to answer that question. Ford did not build any 289s after early 1968.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-08-2016
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The heads are still not worth putting money into for "performance" like I said in post #2. It might be better to use Cleveland "foundry" as that plant was a casting plant , not a forging plant. Forged parts like connecting rods were often done at companies like Vulcan Forge in Mi.

The casting plant makes virtually no difference ( by itself) on a Ford produced part. They are all made to exacting blueprints . I actually have a few cylinder head blueprints for the '70 Boss 302 head.
Machining is the same way. That is not to say all SBF heads are the same by any means.
Randy

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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-08-2016
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Keep them. you will find someone at a swap who wants to bring their engine back to OEM and are willing to pay for them. A "parts original" engine is worth a lot more than just an OEM put together.

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You will have higher compression with the 70 302 head versus a 351W head, most recommend changing the pistons to move the compression ratio back up. You haven't stated what you are really after, more hp, more torque? The stock camshaft and 2 barrel carbs are the biggest restrictions in the stock engine. My 2 cts. Good Luck.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-10-2016 Thread Starter
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I have the engine stock with the exception of the "Torker" cam.
It's been completely overhauled rings, pistons, timing chain, bearings, honed, etc.
It's got the original 2v intake and carb.
Not looking for that much as far as hp or torque.
She's pretty peppy right now.
Had a late 80's LX long ago.
Had about 220 hp and that was more than enough, especially in a light car.
I would be happy with 260-280 hp.
I'm not going to race her.
I'd like to keep the engine stock but advice always points me to upgrades especially to the old style points ignition.
I will probably leave the block alone and do a set of aluminum heads to better compliment the cam, aluminum 4v intake and carb, and switch to a GM HEI ignition.
This seem to be the norm on owner installed upgrades that can be done fairly easy with average mechanical know how.
I know visually, the upgrades would look really nice under the hood and that's just my personal preference.
If I do swap the iron heads for aluminum I'll keep them just in case it ever went to someone else.
It would have the original parts.
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If I remember correctly the Torker cams are more for the bottom end and not the upper end where the HP is made, so your cam will be negating the heads making them unncessary, and the aluminum intake and 4 barrel will benefit most of the power band, except again the cam is hurting the HP on the upper end. These engines can make 260-280HP without the head changes. My 2 cts. Good Luck.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rex1965 View Post
If I remember correctly the Torker cams are more for the bottom end and not the upper end where the HP is made, so your cam will be negating the heads making them unncessary, and the aluminum intake and 4 barrel will benefit most of the power band, except again the cam is hurting the HP on the upper end. These engines can make 260-280HP without the head changes. My 2 cts. Good Luck.
No. This is a battle I've been doing with people for a long time. Edelbrock's "torker" line of products has nothing to do with "torque". The rpm performance range progression of their products is "performer", then "performer rpm", then "torker", with torker being usually a 2500-6500rpm performance range.
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