[Saleen Owner]

I've been listening to the pinheads on TV talking about why the Dems lost this election. They still don't seem to understand what causes them problems. I think it is mainly the arrogant attitude towards the average American the party leadership shows. The idea that they can right off 2/3 of the country and still win a national election. I think they need to start looking hard at America as a whole, not just pandering to urban areas and expecting that to carry them to victory.

If I was a Democrate and seriously wanting to win in '08, I would not be sitting around thinking that the only thing that went wrong was that the Republicans turned out more of their base. The fact Daschle has been defeated gives them a prime opportunity to make a statement about what direction they want to go. Do you make someone like sen. Clinton or Schumer minority leader, and signal more of the same? Or do you look towards a leader that signals a move back to the party's roots?

As for the '08 presidential race, do you look towards another canidate popular mainly with east and west coast urban areas? Or do you go with someone like sen. Evan Bayh, that could really bring the south and south west back into play, and still do very well with urban dems?

[kulak]

Senators in general have a hard time getting elected as Presidents. They have a voting record, they have been on record on many issues already. It is difficult to "change your stance" during a campaign when your voting history shows your stance over the past several years.


I'd look to another governor getting elected in 2008. They tend to have a lot more luck.


Jesse the Body in '08 baby =)

[tomcat101]

SSSHHHH. what do you think you are doing? don't let them know the way to win let them find out them self. LOL

[anglia_stang]

Originally Posted by kulak

Senators in general have a hard time getting elected as Presidents. They have a voting record, they have been on record on many issues already. It is difficult to "change your stance" during a campaign when your voting history shows your stance over the past several years.


I'd look to another governor getting elected in 2008. They tend to have a lot more luck.


Jesse the Body in '08 baby =)

Ummm...I'm pretty sure Jesse the Body is an Independant.

[The Dude]

We should be afraid...be VERY afraid. I still cant believe that fu*king a$$hole got re-elected. Have you seen his resume?? Anyone who voted for this guy should be ashamed of themselves!!


GEORGE W. BUSH
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC 20520

EDUCATION AND EXPERIENCE:

Law Enforcement:
I was arrested in Kennebunkport, Maine, in 1976 for driving under the influence of alcohol. I pled guilty, paid a fine, and had my driver's license suspended for 30 days. My Texas driving record has been "lost" and is not available.

Military:
I joined the Texas Air National Guard and went AWOL. I refused to take a drug test or answer any questions about my drug use. By joining the Texas Air National Guard, I was able to avoid combat duty in Vietnam.

College:
I graduated from Yale University with a low C average. I was a cheerleader.

PAST WORK EXPERIENCE:

I ran for U.S. Congress and lost. I began my career in the oil business in Midland, Texas, in 1975.


I bought an oil company, but couldn't find any oil in Texas. The company went bankrupt shortly after I sold all my stock.

I bought the Texas Rangers baseball team in a sweetheart deal that took land using taxpayer money.

With the help of my father and our friends in the oil industry (including Enron CEO Ken Lay), I was elected governor of Texas.

ACCOMPLISHMENTS AS GOVERNOR OF TEXAS:

I changed Texas pollution laws to favor power and oil companies, making Texas the most polluted state in the Union.

During my tenure, Houston replaced Los Angeles as the most smog-ridden city in America.

I cut taxes and bankrupted the Texas treasury to the tune of billions in borrowed money.

I set the record for the most executions by any governor in American history.

With the help of my brother, the governor of Florida, and my father's appointments to the Supreme Court, I became President after losing by over 50,000 votes.

ACCOMPLISHMENTS AS PRESIDENT:

I am the first President in U.S. history to enter office with a criminal record.

I invaded and occupied two countries at a continuing cost of over one billion dollars per week.

I spent the U.S. surplus and effectively bankrupted the U.S. Treasury.

I shattered the record for the largest annual deficit in U.S. history.

I set an economic record for most private bankruptcies filed in any 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for most foreclosures in a 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for the biggest drop in the history of the U.S. stock market.

In my first year in office, over 2 million Americans lost their jobs and that trend continues every month.

I'm proud that the members of my cabinet are the richest of any Administration in U.S. history. My "poorest millionaire," Condoleeza Rice, has a Chevron oil tanker named after her.

I set the record for most campaign fundraising trips by a U.S. President.

I am the all-time U.S. and world record-holder for receiving the most corporate campaign donations.

My largest lifetime campaign contributor, and one of my best friends, Kenneth Lay, presided over the largest corporate bankruptcy fraud in U.S. History - Enron.

My political party used Enron private jets and corporate attorneys to assure my success with the U.S. Supreme Court during my election decision.

I have protected my friends at Enron and Halliburton against investigation or prosecution.

More time and money was spent investigating the Monica Lewinsky affair than has been spent investigating one of the biggest corporate rip-offs in history.

I presided over the biggest energy crisis in U.S. history and refused to intervene when corruption involving the oil industry was
revealed.

I presided over the highest gasoline prices in U.S. history.

I changed the U.S. policy to allow convicted criminals to be awarded government contracts.

I appointed more convicted criminals to administration than any President in U.S. history.

I created the Ministry of Homeland Security, the largest bureaucracy in the history of the United States government.

I've broken more international treaties than any President in U.S. history.

I am the first President in U.S. history to have the United Nations remove the U.S. from the Human Rights Commission.

I withdrew the U.S. from the World Court of Law.

I refused to allow inspector's access to U.S. "prisoners of war" detainees and thereby have refused to abide by the Geneva Convention.

I am the first President in history to refuse United Nations election inspectors (during the 2002 U.S. election).

I set the record for fewest numbers of press conferences of any President since the advent of television.

I set the all-time record for most days on vacation in any one-year period.

After taking off the entire month of August (2003), I presided over the worst security failure in U.S. history.

I garnered the most sympathy for the U.S. after the World Trade Center attacks and less than a year later made the U.S. the most hated country in the world, the largest failure of diplomacy in world history.

I have set the all-time record for most people worldwide to simultaneously protest me in public venues (15 million people),
shattering the record for protests against any person in the history of mankind. (Also at the Republican Nat'l Convention)

I am the first President in U.S. history to order an unprovoked, pre-emptive attack and the military occupation of a sovereign nation. I did so against the will of the United Nations, the majority of U.S. citizens, and the world community.

I have cut health care benefits for war veterans and support a cut in duty benefits for active duty troops and their families -- in
wartime.

In my State of the Union Address, I lied about our reasons for attacking Iraq and then blamed the lies on our British friends.

I am the first President in history to have a majority of Europeans (71%) view my presidency as the biggest threat to world peace and security.

I am supporting development of a nuclear "Tactical Bunker Buster," a WMD.

I have so far failed to fulfill my pledge to bring Osama Bin Laden [sic] to justice.

I stripped the clean air act last fall and lowered regulations for corporations to comply.

I support eliminating OVERTIME pay and want that voted on by March, 2004. (passed into law August 2004)

Thousands of children and adults are without health insurance and I've done nothing to change that.

I passed a new Medicare law that gives PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES MILLIONS OF DOLLARS GUARANTEED PROFITS. It does not help the elderly.

RECORDS AND REFERENCES:

All records of my tenure as governor of Texas are now in my father's library, sealed and unavailable for public view.

All records of SEC investigations into my insider trading and my bankrupt companies are sealed in secrecy and unavailable for public view.

All records or minutes from meetings that I, or my Vice-President, attended regarding public energy policy are sealed in
secrecy and unavailable for public review.

[kit]

I'm happy that Pres. Bush won. I am in the military right now, and he is very pro-military. While he was in office the first term, we were given more raises than previously, and more well taken care of.

Besides every time I would see Kerry on TV I would get annoyed.

[thunder05]

Originally Posted by kit

I'm happy that Pres. Bush won. I am in the military right now, and he is very pro-military. While he was in office the first term, we were given more raises than previously, and more well taken care of.

Besides every time I would see Kerry on TV I would get annoyed.

AMEN BROTHER , AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.



HEY THE DUDE YOUR AVITAR MUST BE A SELF PORTRAIT at least your ok with your deformity.Thats nice.

[kulak]

Originally Posted by anglia_stang

Ummm...I'm pretty sure Jesse the Body is an Independant.

So?

You really want Hillary running our country?

I dont.


As for the laundry list of things why Bush is sooo bad... get over it, You can find a laundry list of similar transgressions for just about any president, climb down off your high horse.


Perfect example why democrats are having a hard time, they dont understand that makes him "REAL" to the rest of us. Instead of coming off as some arrogant ***** with more money than any of us will ever dream of and what seems like a forced touchy feely social agenda that is all PC, Bush comes off as a real guy, with real american problems, and real american issues.

How many people can identify with someone that had a drinking problem, quite a few i bet. How many people can identify with someone that has had his fair share of traffic tickets? I know several. How many of us identify with a guy who loves sports, baseball specifically? again many. How many of us have been able to get a leg up in our careers based on our parents, or their friends? I know a lot.


Now ask yourself how many people are going to identify with a guy who testified before the senate when he returned from Vietnam? dont know many. How about a guy that married a woman that has an astrinomical family fortune? dont think i have ever met one. How many people that has earned silver stars and purple hearts? I have never met any.


All the things Kerry has done in his life are very admirable, he is a success story, highly decorated war vet, political activist, succesful politician, and married into a ton of wealth. Its a movie really, his life. That is exactly why I dont think he understands me, or my problems, or my concerns.


Bush, has been in trouble as a kid and young adult, nearly all of us have. He has gone to his parents for help, I dont know many kids that dont. Any one of us that is a sports fan, any fan, that had a chance to buy our favorite team would jump at the chance, any chance to own even a piece of your favorite team.


It makes Bush more seem approachable, more blue collar, makes me feel he knows what it means to make mistakes and work to succeed despite your failures.


If you dont see that, dont understand that, then you will never understand why the democratic party is in trouble right now.


I think democrat, I think of someone that has enough money that they dont care about taxes, a person concerned with social issues only because its the fashionable thing to do, a person that only helps others to make themselves feel better. I dont want your charity, I dont want your handouts, I want to be given a chance to succeed on my own and not have your government make it harder for me to succeed by siphoning my hard earned money into programs that are filled with people who dont want to succeed, they just want handouts.

[anglia_stang]

when are you liberals gonna come up with something new to ***** about, Bush won, just deal with it.

[Saleen Owner]

Originally Posted by kulak

Senators in general have a hard time getting elected as Presidents. They have a voting record, they have been on record on many issues already. It is difficult to "change your stance" during a campaign when your voting history shows your stance over the past several years.

This has been the case historically, but because the canidate was trying to appear to be something they were not, ie Kerry running as a 'family values centrist' with a socially liberal voting record.

I just threw out sen. Bayh because I know his stance on issues, being he is my senator. But look at the stats in Indiana, a typical family values, fiscal conservative orientated electorate. President Bush carried the state by 22 points. Republican Govenor-elect Daniels carried a 7 point margin of victory. The only other state wide election was for senator, in this race democrat Evan Bayh carried a 25 point margin of victory. That tells me alot of republicans split their tickets to cast a vote his way.

[Saleen Owner]

Originally Posted by kulak

I think democrat, I think of someone that has enough money that they dont care about taxes, a person concerned with social issues only because its the fashionable thing to do, a person that only helps others to make themselves feel better. I dont want your charity, I dont want your handouts, I want to be given a chance to succeed on my own and not have your government make it harder for me to succeed by siphoning my hard earned money into programs that are filled with people who dont want to succeed, they just want handouts.

Thats what I'm talking about. The attitudes of most people around here are the same, myself included. Even those I know who vote Democrat around here tend to express the same feelings about the party leadership.

I have voted Republican all my life, not so much because I'm a die-hard Republican, but because I've never really seen another choice. It would be very refreshing to have an election where I would have a choice between two canidates who actually share some of my core beliefs. It used to be that way, if I was alive at the time, I probably would have voted for JFK over Nixon, it would have been a close call, but it would have been nice to have the chance.

[JUSTNLX]

You want to know why they lost? Well here is a good reason. People are getting tired of sh@t like this. I want to here what you are going to do, not how bad the other guy is. They had no real issues other then "Anyone but Bush"

Originally Posted by The Dude

We should be afraid...be VERY afraid. I still cant believe that fu*king a$$hole got re-elected. Have you seen his resume?? Anyone who voted for this guy should be ashamed of themselves!!


GEORGE W. BUSH
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC 20520

EDUCATION AND EXPERIENCE:

Law Enforcement:
I was arrested in Kennebunkport, Maine, in 1976 for driving under the influence of alcohol. I pled guilty, paid a fine, and had my driver's license suspended for 30 days. My Texas driving record has been "lost" and is not available.

Military:
I joined the Texas Air National Guard and went AWOL. I refused to take a drug test or answer any questions about my drug use. By joining the Texas Air National Guard, I was able to avoid combat duty in Vietnam.

College:
I graduated from Yale University with a low C average. I was a cheerleader.

PAST WORK EXPERIENCE:

I ran for U.S. Congress and lost. I began my career in the oil business in Midland, Texas, in 1975.


I bought an oil company, but couldn't find any oil in Texas. The company went bankrupt shortly after I sold all my stock.

I bought the Texas Rangers baseball team in a sweetheart deal that took land using taxpayer money.

With the help of my father and our friends in the oil industry (including Enron CEO Ken Lay), I was elected governor of Texas.

ACCOMPLISHMENTS AS GOVERNOR OF TEXAS:

I changed Texas pollution laws to favor power and oil companies, making Texas the most polluted state in the Union.

During my tenure, Houston replaced Los Angeles as the most smog-ridden city in America.

I cut taxes and bankrupted the Texas treasury to the tune of billions in borrowed money.

I set the record for the most executions by any governor in American history.

With the help of my brother, the governor of Florida, and my father's appointments to the Supreme Court, I became President after losing by over 50,000 votes.

ACCOMPLISHMENTS AS PRESIDENT:

I am the first President in U.S. history to enter office with a criminal record.

I invaded and occupied two countries at a continuing cost of over one billion dollars per week.

I spent the U.S. surplus and effectively bankrupted the U.S. Treasury.

I shattered the record for the largest annual deficit in U.S. history.

I set an economic record for most private bankruptcies filed in any 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for most foreclosures in a 12-month period.

I set the all-time record for the biggest drop in the history of the U.S. stock market.

In my first year in office, over 2 million Americans lost their jobs and that trend continues every month.

I'm proud that the members of my cabinet are the richest of any Administration in U.S. history. My "poorest millionaire," Condoleeza Rice, has a Chevron oil tanker named after her.

I set the record for most campaign fundraising trips by a U.S. President.

I am the all-time U.S. and world record-holder for receiving the most corporate campaign donations.

My largest lifetime campaign contributor, and one of my best friends, Kenneth Lay, presided over the largest corporate bankruptcy fraud in U.S. History - Enron.

My political party used Enron private jets and corporate attorneys to assure my success with the U.S. Supreme Court during my election decision.

I have protected my friends at Enron and Halliburton against investigation or prosecution.

More time and money was spent investigating the Monica Lewinsky affair than has been spent investigating one of the biggest corporate rip-offs in history.

I presided over the biggest energy crisis in U.S. history and refused to intervene when corruption involving the oil industry was
revealed.

I presided over the highest gasoline prices in U.S. history.

I changed the U.S. policy to allow convicted criminals to be awarded government contracts.

I appointed more convicted criminals to administration than any President in U.S. history.

I created the Ministry of Homeland Security, the largest bureaucracy in the history of the United States government.

I've broken more international treaties than any President in U.S. history.

I am the first President in U.S. history to have the United Nations remove the U.S. from the Human Rights Commission.

I withdrew the U.S. from the World Court of Law.

I refused to allow inspector's access to U.S. "prisoners of war" detainees and thereby have refused to abide by the Geneva Convention.

I am the first President in history to refuse United Nations election inspectors (during the 2002 U.S. election).

I set the record for fewest numbers of press conferences of any President since the advent of television.

I set the all-time record for most days on vacation in any one-year period.

After taking off the entire month of August (2003), I presided over the worst security failure in U.S. history.

I garnered the most sympathy for the U.S. after the World Trade Center attacks and less than a year later made the U.S. the most hated country in the world, the largest failure of diplomacy in world history.

I have set the all-time record for most people worldwide to simultaneously protest me in public venues (15 million people),
shattering the record for protests against any person in the history of mankind. (Also at the Republican Nat'l Convention)

I am the first President in U.S. history to order an unprovoked, pre-emptive attack and the military occupation of a sovereign nation. I did so against the will of the United Nations, the majority of U.S. citizens, and the world community.

I have cut health care benefits for war veterans and support a cut in duty benefits for active duty troops and their families -- in
wartime.

In my State of the Union Address, I lied about our reasons for attacking Iraq and then blamed the lies on our British friends.

I am the first President in history to have a majority of Europeans (71%) view my presidency as the biggest threat to world peace and security.

I am supporting development of a nuclear "Tactical Bunker Buster," a WMD.

I have so far failed to fulfill my pledge to bring Osama Bin Laden [sic] to justice.

I stripped the clean air act last fall and lowered regulations for corporations to comply.

I support eliminating OVERTIME pay and want that voted on by March, 2004. (passed into law August 2004)

Thousands of children and adults are without health insurance and I've done nothing to change that.

I passed a new Medicare law that gives PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES MILLIONS OF DOLLARS GUARANTEED PROFITS. It does not help the elderly.

RECORDS AND REFERENCES:

All records of my tenure as governor of Texas are now in my father's library, sealed and unavailable for public view.

All records of SEC investigations into my insider trading and my bankrupt companies are sealed in secrecy and unavailable for public view.

All records or minutes from meetings that I, or my Vice-President, attended regarding public energy policy are sealed in
secrecy and unavailable for public review.

[NoobAStang]

Originally Posted by thunder05

AMEN BROTHER , AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.



HEY THE DUDE YOUR AVITAR MUST BE A SELF PORTRAIT at least your ok with your deformity.Thats nice.

I love it when someone posts a bunch of FACTS and someone still flames.....its like they dont wanna admit that anything is wrong. kind of like the guy in office.

I agree on the topic of the thread in the first place. interesting.

[thunder05]

Originally Posted by NoobAStang

I love it when someone posts a bunch of FACTS and someone still flames.....its like they dont wanna admit that anything is wrong. kind of like the guy in office.

I agree on the topic of the thread in the first place. interesting.

NOOB thank you! I would gladly stand beside our fine and newly elected PRESIDENT. I also see no need to post a list of reasons why carey did'nt get elected because it starts with what he did after vietnam and ends will 20 years of horrible voteing records.

HEY are you the dude in disguise

[NoobAStang]

Originally Posted by thunder05

NOOB thank you! I would gladly stand beside our fine and newly elected PRESIDENT. I also see no need to post a list of reasons why carey did'nt get elected because it starts with what he did after vietnam and ends will 20 years of horrible voteing records.

HEY are you the dude in disguise

His so called "horrible" (which is debatable no hard facts there) voting record, and him being an anti-war activist, are somehow worse than that fine bush resume a few posts above? nope im not in disguise at all. Im not seeing your point. Two debatable opinions versus hundreds of horrible facts about our newly twice elected prez? Hmmm. Denial aint just a river in egypt.

check your spelling on kerry.....yours isnt even close.