Should I run a catch can or breather - major confusion - Ford Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-11-2010 Thread Starter
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Should I run a catch can or breather - major confusion

OK i could not be any more confused on this so any help is greatly appreciated. I recently went turbo, haven't taken it out of the garage to drive it even. I had received advice to put a catch can on the car and have been doing research ever sense. Am i better with a catch can or a breather set up? Some people are running the closed system like the steeda or the customs lowes catch can but i have read that is best for N/A cars. Am I better off with the catch can or a breather set up similar to one of the following links? Why?

JAZ Products 605-375-01 JAZ Mini Breather Tank
Moroso 85465 - Moroso Racing Vacuum Pump Breather Tanks - Overview - SummitRacing.com

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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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OK i could not be any more confused on this so any help is greatly appreciated. I recently went turbo, haven't taken it out of the garage to drive it even. I had received advice to put a catch can on the car and have been doing research ever sense. Am i better with a catch can or a breather set up? Some people are running the closed system like the steeda or the customs lowes catch can but i have read that is best for N/A cars. Am I better off with the catch can or a breather set up similar to one of the following links? Why?

JAZ Products 605-375-01 JAZ Mini Breather Tank
Moroso 85465 - Moroso Racing Vacuum Pump Breather Tanks - Overview - SummitRacing.com
first let me say GO BADGERS this is something i saved in my favorites, this can help, the only downside is oil leakage through the breather.

https://www.allfordmustangs.com/forum...ml#post1738357


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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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The vaccuum created by S/C'd or Turbo'd setups is usually strong enough to pull oil out of the engine, and will put it right back into the intake without a oil seperator / catch can type setup incorporated into the PCV system.
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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I have breathers on mine and no leakage yet.. but then again i havnt been driving it for too long since ive made the change.

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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I have breathers on mine and no leakage yet.. but then again i havnt been driving it for too long since ive made the change.
this is the route i'm going to take, i can replace the breather filters for a better pulling engine

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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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A breather is the best way to go, especially on a FI motor. The bigger the better. It will help out with oil ring seal and less resistance on the back side of the pistons.

The most basic setup is to run breathers in the valve covers. This is not a bad way to go because it will allow a lot of pressure out of the crankcase. The downside is that if the valve cover is not baffled correctly you will have oil mist all over everything and the breather element will get saturated and not flow very well.

Next step is to use a breather tank like you have links too. Those are a good way to go because the oil will fall out of suspension and collect in the tank where it can be drained. The setup is also not very likely to push oil past the breather. The only downside to what I have seen for breather tanks is that the hose/fittings are not big enough. I consider ¾” hose/fittings the minimum size that should be used. That is one per valve cover. If the hose can’t flow enough crankcase pressure you will not see the benefits of having a crankcase breather system. And be sure when you mount the overflows they are above the valve covers so oil that falls out of suspension in the hose runs back into the motor, not the catch can. It is possible to see a slight HP increase with a setup like this.

A little more complex is a breather tank setup like the one above but you run a one way check valve(s) so after an engine pulse it shuts and creates a small vacuum. The bigger the hose and the bigger the tank the better. I run systems like this on my racebikes using 1” hose and as big of a breather “tank” as I can fit. In most cases it is at least a couple liters. This is on a 1L motor (about 20% the size of a 4.6L) and I see a 5-7hp increase after installing the breather system. A very important factor is the one way valve used. I run carbon fiber reed valves similar to what you find in 2 stroke motors. I am in the process of making a breather system like this right now for my motor. I welded two baffled “boxes” to the valve covers (not easy, they are 27% magnesium) that are designed to get as much oil out of suspension as possible before it even gets to the hose. I’m running -12an fittings and hose to a “tank” that I am going to make as large as possible with the space I have available for it. I’m running 2-4 breathers with built in check valves in the top of the tank to create as much vacuum as possible. I’ll calculate how many breathers to use based on pressure seen in the tank. In a perfect world the in tank pressure would never increase when it receives an engine pulse and after the valve(s) shut it will leave a slight vacuum. It’s easy to test, a simple pressure transducer is all that is needed. Here are the breathers with the built in check valves and also some inline check valves. I’ve always had to make these in the past for the bikes. I can’t remember how I stumbled across them. There pretty cool.

http://www.petersonfluidsys.com/engine_breath.html

Top dog is a belt driven vacuum pump that pulls a constant vacuum on the crankcase. A setup like this is a pretty big move for a street car but they are worth a LOT of horsepower when set up correctly. NASCAR motors run some of the highest crankcase vacuum out there (second only to Pro Stock cars). They run in the neighborhood of 20in of vacuum (a little over 28in is “space”). It’s rumored that the NASCAR systems are worth up to 75hp.

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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-12-2010
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The Paxton came with a PCV valve spliced inline with the PCV hose....
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-13-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueLou View Post
The Paxton came with a PCV valve spliced inline with the PCV hose....
A less complex version of a check valve system with a carbon fiber reed valve. Same theory.

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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-20-2010 Thread Starter
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Sqidd, you are definitely one of the experts around here, thanks for the info. I am currently working my way through the 2010 front diffuser install you came up with.

I have been away from the forum for a while but thanks for all the great information. A guy at work bought a catch can with a breather and cant fit it in his car so i bought that off him. Now comes more questions. With my turbo kit, i have a hose that comes from the PCV into a T, one side of the T goes into the intake tube just below the air filter. The other side of the T goes into the passenger side of the car. Now the question is what side of the T should the catch can/breather be on? I blew the dipstick out of the check tube on the short drive to the turner so i know that a breather is needed, now where to put it!
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 03-20-2010 Thread Starter
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The car is at the tuner otherwise i would have taken some pictures.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueLou View Post
The Paxton came with a PCV valve spliced inline with the PCV hose....
I wouldn't use that. It doesn't come close to stopping everything.

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I'm running K&N breathers, which were the recommended way to go. I ran 2 road course events with them last year and didn't have any problems with oil soak. I check them closely after each weekend event and I'm not even picking up any oil residue on hands, yet. I'll be keeping an eye on them, but so far, this was a very good recommendation, better IMO than a catch can setup.

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