need some help on what it would take to make 500rwhp - Page 2 - Ford Mustang Forum
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Actualy I don't no any motor that is in a production car that put out about 600hp at the crank with out F/I.
Off the lot 100% stock n/a 2008 8.4L Viper has 600 crank.



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Originally Posted by forensicsteve View Post
Off the lot 100% stock n/a 2008 8.4L Viper has 600 crank.
They covered this, 8.4 = Big as Sh*t with plenty of HP per Cube


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They covered this, 8.4 = Big as Sh*t with plenty of HP per Cube
Yep that's exactly what I want. Except it comes in the V8 big block form and comes from Ford :hihi:

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Quote:
Originally Posted by scupking View Post
Its not an under powered motor. Not to many motors out that can do 500rwhp N/A (thats around 590 crank hp). Actualy I don't no any motor that is in a production car that put out about 600hp at the crank with out F/I.
The 4.6 has a 90.2mm bore and a 90mm stroke (almost exactly “square”).
The 5.4 has a 90.2mm bore and a 105.8mm stroke (“undersquare”)

“Oversquare” motors like to rev because of their shortish (by comparison to bore) stroke and the bore allows for larger valves. Motorcycle and F1 engines are very, very oversquare.

“Undersquare” motors have a longer stroke than bore and are better for making flat torque curves and are not the best candidate for “performance” motors. That being said the 5.4L 4v motors do a decent impression of a performance motor despite being designed for truck applications. That being said they would rip like mad if you “flipped” the bore and stroke so it was oversquare.

It’s too bad Ford didn’t set the Mod motor bore spacing at 108mm (its 100mm). At 108mm the block/motor would only need to be 24mm (about 1”) longer, obviously not a packaging issue with the Mustangs and trucks. With a 108mm bore spacing the cylinder bores could be as large as 106.2mm with the same block thickness they have now. With a 106.2mm bore and a 99mm stroke they would be a touch over 7.1L and should have no issue making 500rwhp with the intake and exhaust “uncorked”. And it would still rev great because it is oversquare. Aaaaaaaaaaand, because the bore was increased the valve diameters could go up 4mm (about 10%) and the cam lift could go up quite a bit because the pistons would need to be dished to keep the compression down. Aaaaaaand, the dished pistons would create a very hemispherical combustion chamber which would be more efficient than what they have now. That could turn into a 600rwhp motor real fast!

But, we are stuck with “smallblocks” just because Ford shorted us 8mm (24mm overall). Damn Ford!


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Originally Posted by scord View Post
^-- this post made me lol
You do realize that a z06 corvette has 500hp with a stock block and can easily produce 500rwhp with full exhaust and a good set of NA cams...
Quote:
Originally Posted by forensicsteve View Post
Off the lot 100% stock n/a 2008 8.4L Viper has 600 crank.

When you factor in displacement the 4.6 3v actually stacks up quite well though. Assuming that a new LS7 with exhaust and a CAI makes about 460-465rwhp (I just looked a bunch up) at 7.0L the 4.6 is pretty stout. Again assuming (yeah, I know A$$ Out You And Me) that a 4.6 3v makes about 300rwhp with the same mods they are making almost exactly the same HP/cu.in. Not too shabby. Too bad you can’t bore and stroke the 4.6 out to 7.0L!

And the HP/cu.in is better on the 4.6 3v than the Viper. Hard to argue with 8.4L though.

To the OP:

I’d bet you can make 500rwhp out of a 3v 4.6L if you threw the ENTIRE book at it but like everyone else said it would be cost prohibitive.

I would like to see someone build a 3v with a nice strong lightweight bottom end, about 10.5:1 compression and just the right set of cams. I don’t see why if the motor is set up to rev to 8,500rpm that it couldn’t make 500rwhp. I know of a NA 4.6L with
10:1
Hot Rod cams (yuck)
FRPP CNC heads with 1mm over valves
FRPP intake
FRPP TB
Big exhaust

…and all the other associated goodies that is making about 430 to the tires through an auto and it only spins to 7200rpm.

Getting another 70hp with 1300rpm more, more compression and cams that are ground correctly really isn’t a big deal. That being said it would cost BIG money and it would never make the torque a FI motor would. I’m guessing that a motor like that could set you back 16K easy. And for about 16K you could be making 600/600 at the tires with a FI setup.

It sure would be a roit to drive though!

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Sqidd...this is your big chance to get someone to order a John Kasse engine and live vicariously through them. Make it happen.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SheizaSoSay View Post
Sqidd...this is your big chance to get someone to order a John Kasse engine and live vicariously through them. Make it happen.

Maybe he would even let me drive it!:laughlitt:kooky:

Waiting on 2019 GT500

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This is not an underpowered motor. Making 420rwhp N/A with a 4.6. That is impressive, great motor if you want that power just get nitrous or get a C16 tune with an aggressive high compression build and you will make some nice power not 500 but still nice.

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You got a bunch of E85 gas stations around your house?
post #24 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-30-2010 Thread Starter
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welll thats was alot of information lol thanks guys for all of that im only 18 so i wana know the right way to go and do it once and do it right ... so if i go twin turbo or singal what cams can i run or is it better off if i just buy a creat motor for the same price
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcfrisch View Post
500HP N/A with the current block would be impossible.
Agree! You need to call Guiness World Record if you achieve it.
Here's an option... Put a 200 hp electric motor in the back. 300 hp stock engine plus 200 hp electric engine equals 500 hp. :nogrinner

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Quote:
Originally Posted by flew by you View Post
welll thats was alot of information lol thanks guys for all of that im only 18 so i wana know the right way to go and do it once and do it right ... so if i go twin turbo or singal what cams can i run or is it better off if i just buy a creat motor for the same price
What type of job does an 18 year old have that can afford twin turbos just curious. For a quality kit your looking at 9k, and you will still need to replace just about every other part on your car. If you just want a nice ride find your self a nice whipple kit or procharger kit and call it a day with other supporting mods.

You can get allot of great info as well by using the search button these questions have been asked a million times.

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Quote:
What type of job does an 18 year old have that can afford twin turbos just curious

18???

Even if you can afford the build, what about the insurance? 18 + 600 hp, not a combo welcomed by insurance companies....lol.


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Just join the military for the Insurance USAA is a life saver on $$$ I think I pay 126 for full coverage for my Explorer, Galant and Mustang and they will cover up to 20k of my mods.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by flew by you View Post
welll thats was alot of information lol thanks guys for all of that im only 18 so i wana know the right way to go and do it once and do it right ... so if i go twin turbo or singal what cams can i run or is it better off if i just buy a creat motor for the same price

lol kids getting in way over their head everywhere
you won't want cams if you're on the stock engine

a crate motor is going to be alot more money than F/I

definitely sounds like you don't know what you're doing
much like a few kids around here.
They were gonna get a crazy cool twin turbo set up and blah blee bloo blah
then realized it costs money

Do some reading on how engines work
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Yeah the price of mods to support that insane set ups as well and labor. I think if it wasn't for the help of sponsors I would of all ready doubled the cost of the car just in mods and labor.

but I remember I was at that level back in the day. Dreaming of having a low 10 second car with only a supercharger bolted on.


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