Odd Situation With the Cops - Page 3 - Ford Mustang Forum
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So the cop intimidated you. So what? He did nothing illegal. I would be stupid to request a one-on-one sit down...what is the point?

You admited yourself that you might have been a little too fast in the parking lot and that your car might be a bit too loud.

Let this die...get over it...move on. And why your "understanding" parents allow you to get such a fast car is beyond me.

I have two teenagers, ages 16 & 19 and it would be stupid of me to help them get such a car...We all know how you really do drive it...I too was your age, a teen/young person...I guess your parents forget how things were when they were your age.

I would not be surprised if your parents even side with you about how you got "vitimized" by the police....no wonder the MTV generations is going to hell in a hand basket. Get into your studies, stop your snivlin, and grow up.

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I WOULD NOT discuss this event with a Police Supervisor or even the COP himself. This will only help to "piss him off" and really add fuel to the fire...

When you are in his area, you must drive by the law and make sure you do not break any rules...

When you are out of his area, drive the way you want...

THIS COP HAS AN ITCH THAT HE CANNOT SCRATCH without giving you ticket after ticket after ticket...

When I drive my Mustang, the police are always watching me and hoping that I'll do something crazy...

When I drive my Jeep Grand Cherokee or my wife's Sebring, the police don't even know I'm alive... I can speed, jump curbs, etc!!!

It's all about the car and not the driver...

Being a younger driver, the COP is trying to make an example out of you...

I'm 55 years old but look younger and still drive sensibly when I see a COP...

D

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The cops do profile young drivers in fast cars. My 16 year old son has been followed by cops frequently in his 2006 V6 Mustang, while I never get followed and I drive a Torch Red Mustang GT with stripes. My son was even "escorted" home the other night by a cop in the back and another cop in front of him!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovcom
So the cop intimidated you. So what? He did nothing illegal. I would be stupid to request a one-on-one sit down...what is the point?

You admited yourself that you might have been a little too fast in the parking lot and that your car might be a bit too loud.

Let this die...get over it...move on. And why your "understanding" parents allow you to get such a fast car is beyond me.

I have two teenagers, ages 16 & 19 and it would be stupid of me to help them get such a car...We all know how you really do drive it...I too was your age, a teen/young person...I guess your parents forget how things were when they were your age.

I would not be surprised if your parents even side with you about how you got "vitimized" by the police....no wonder the MTV generations is going to hell in a hand basket. Get into your studies, stop your snivlin, and grow up.
Harassment by the police, regardless of the age of the victim/suspect, is illegal. If the police actually had something on the young driver, then they should have pulled him over immediately. Showing up on the door step to tell the driver that you are looking to give him a ticket is simply harassment and is uncalled for. The police can not arrest someone at their home without a warrant, therfore, here the best the officer could do is a warning. However, there is no legitimate prupose in waiting a significant amount of time before approaching the driver. I grant in California the definiton of exhibition of speed (Vehicle Code 23109) is vague and subjective. But if the officer witnessed the quick acceleration and phycially noticed the sound of the car, he was obligated to make that inquiry immediately. Based on the facts here, the officer either did not witness the event himself, so his information is second hand, or he did not have enough for a legitime traffic stop. In either case, the officer was completely out of line coming to the driver's house later to say I am watching you based on this event. Remember, there is no crime for a guilty mind. The facts given do not support a valid ticket for exhibition of speed. Assuming for a moment that it does rise to that level, the officer waived the infraction by not acting promptly. Using intimidation, especially on a minor, would be grounds for a review and may even be grounds for removal from his position (depending on the facts and circumstances).

I agree talking to the officer rone-on-one is a bad idea. But making a formal complaint may not be a bad idea. If the officer gets upset and wants to pull the driver over for every little infraction, he will have an up hill battle showing that minor infractions are valid and not a reprisal issue.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrvandermey
Harassment by the police, regardless of the age of the victim/suspect, is illegal. If the police actually had something on the young driver, then they should have pulled him over immediately. Showing up on the door step to tell the driver that you are looking to give him a ticket is simply harassment and is uncalled for. The police can not arrest someone at their home without a warrant, therfore, here the best the officer could do is a warning. However, there is no legitimate prupose in waiting a significant amount of time before approaching the driver. I grant in California the definiton of exhibition of speed (Vehicle Code 23109) is vague and subjective. But if the officer witnessed the quick acceleration and phycially noticed the sound of the car, he was obligated to make that inquiry immediately. Based on the facts here, the officer either did not witness the event himself, so his information is second hand, or he did not have enough for a legitime traffic stop. In either case, the officer was completely out of line coming to the driver's house later to say I am watching you based on this event. Remember, there is no crime for a guilty mind. The facts given do not support a valid ticket for exhibition of speed. Assuming for a moment that it does rise to that level, the officer waived the infraction by not acting promptly. Using intimidation, especially on a minor, would be grounds for a review and may even be grounds for removal from his position (depending on the facts and circumstances).

I agree talking to the officer rone-on-one is a bad idea. But making a formal complaint may not be a bad idea. If the officer gets upset and wants to pull the driver over for every little infraction, he will have an up hill battle showing that minor infractions are valid and not a reprisal issue.
Mr. V, I cannot argue with you, as I am not an expert on the law. And I am sure what you wrote is all true. However, I am a male, a father, and once a teenager. Regardless of what you wrote, we all know how young males, hell, old males too, can get pretty frisky with our wheels, especially with a car like the Mustang.

Like you, I was not there to know what the young man did or didn't do. But if he is like most normal American teenagers, well, you and I both know how it is.

If I were his father, I would thank the cop for giving my son a harmless warning, a heads up so to speak. It was just one time, and you know as well as I do that it takes two points to make a line, a trend. I'm not saying that the cop did not harrass the boy, but after the first time, I will keep more of an open mind.

No offense Mr. V, but lets face it, many lawyers are out looking for "victims" and it seems in this era everyone is a "victim". The fact that his parents help him get such a car suggest that they might not be very wise parents (maybe), and the fact that they are siding with him, well, what message are they giving him? Do they have to go to the local morgue and see dead young males, killed from street racing or other fooking around with cars?

20 or more years ago, a parent in such a situation would have added their own admonishments to their son after the police did what they did. To often parents idealize their children, and what that does is ruin the kid, not help the kid.

Now if this policeaman shows a pattern of messing with the boy, then maybe there is harrassment going on, but after just one episode, I would just let it drop.

I'm 47 and I have dealt with attorneys most of my life, I know how it works, I know the motivation....I have no reason to think that you are not a great attorney....perhaps you are a great one, and a great father too, but lets not forget human nature, how it is to be 17, male, and 300 hourse power under our hoods.

I have two teenagers and I have the resources to provide them both Shelby Mustangs, but I think it would be stupid of me to give them or help them get even a lowly GT...they're my kids, and I love them, but I am not one of these parents that idealize my children, that will back them up even if they're guilty as is the case too often in our society.

My mother teaches 2nd graders....after trying to deal with an unruly student she is force to call home....these days she gets accussed of "picking on" the son/daughter, or having an axe to grind with him/her by the parents. Often my mother will describe the problems she has with the child, and then the parents will call her a liar...it's really sad that parents these days blindly back their "angelic" children and in the end they wonder why the kids go bad.

If the boy takes to heart the message the cop might have been trying to send, it could be possible that that message might have saved his life.
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Originally Posted by lovcom
Mr. V, I cannot argue with you, as I am not an expert on the law. And I am sure what you wrote is all true. However, I am a male, a father, and once a teenager. Regardless of what you wrote, we all know how young males, hell, old males too, can get pretty frisky with our wheels, especially with a car like the Mustang.

Like you, I was not there to know what the young man did or didn't do. But if he is like most normal American teenagers, well, you and I both know how it is.

If I were his father, I would thank the cop for giving my son a harmless warning, a heads up so to speak. It was just one time, and you know as well as I do that it takes two points to make a line, a trend. I'm not saying that the cop did not harrass the boy, but after the first time, I will keep more of an open mind.

No offense Mr. V, but lets face it, many lawyers are out looking for "victims" and it seems in this era everyone is a "victim". The fact that his parents help him get such a car suggest that they might not be very wise parents (maybe), and the fact that they are siding with him, well, what message are they giving him? Do they have to go to the local morgue and see dead young males, killed from street racing or other fooking around with cars?

20 or more years ago, a parent in such a situation would have added their own admonishments to their son after the police did what they did. To often parents idealize their children, and what that does is ruin the kid, not help the kid.

Now if this policeaman shows a pattern of messing with the boy, then maybe there is harrassment going on, but after just one episode, I would just let it drop.

I'm 47 and I have dealt with attorneys most of my life, I know how it works, I know the motivation....I have no reason to think that you are not a great attorney....perhaps you are a great one, and a great father too, but lets not forget human nature, how it is to be 17, male, and 300 hourse power under our hoods.

I have two teenagers and I have the resources to provide them both Shelby Mustangs, but I think it would be stupid of me to give them or help them get even a lowly GT...they're my kids, and I love them, but I am not one of these parents that idealize my children, that will back them up even if they're guilty as is the case too often in our society.

My mother teaches 2nd graders....after trying to deal with an unruly student she is force to call home....these days she gets accussed of "picking on" the son/daughter, or having an axe to grind with him/her by the parents. Often my mother will describe the problems she has with the child, and then the parents will call her a liar...it's really sad that parents these days blindly back their "angelic" children and in the end they wonder why the kids go bad.

If the boy takes to heart the message the cop might have been trying to send, it could be possible that that message might have saved his life.
Point taken. I too am a father of a teenage boy, and I will be the first to admit, as an attorney clients rarely tell you the whole story. I do believe the officer was out of line, but as I mentioned, even complianing about it will likely result in nothing. My concern is the remark the officer made about he is watching this young driver and the fact the officer waited so long to give the warning. Now, I base that opinion on the facts given.

Remember, I am a government attorney, I am not seeking to take on a client. I do believe that for the most part, this young driver should just take the warning as just that. However, be aware that the officer may have more than a legitimate interest in this driver. If that is the case, the officer should be held accountable for his actions. With one incident, I say get thicker skins, and move on.

To be honest, I do not believe the driver is completely innocent in this matter. But based on the facts given, the officer is pushing the envelope between public safety and harassment. The question becomes, if this offier starts pulling this driver over for minor infractions (day less than 5 mph over the limit, to just verify license/registration/insurance, or constantly followign him looking for an infraction/violation). Onthe other hand, maybe this young driver will be more aware of where he is and of his driving habits.

By the way, I do remember how I drove when I was a young buck. Yes, even older folks do stupid things from time to time. But I do recognize that occassionally police officers who are supposed to servie and protect the public overstep their authority. In this case, the only way toknow for sure is to see what follows from here.
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HMM.... I know that if i leave a light with tires schreaching etc and a officer sees it then he can nail me with an unsafe start. I have heard of people getting nailed for leaving a light too fast, personally it has never happened to me.
I was on my way to work a few weeks ago and pulled up next to a officer at a red light. I was sitting there and felt like someone was staring a hole into me. The officer was looking directly at me with his window down, so when i looked over I politely waved and he waved back. The light went green and I took off ( no tires breaking loose) bjut took it up to 5k and shifted into 2nd and took it up to 4500 and hit 55 mph( the posted speed limit ) and shut her down. The cop pulled rigt behind me and rode my butt for a good 8 miles, I guess waiting for me to screw up. i did one more time with him behind me. He didnt pull me over but I definetly got his attention and I think he was waiting for me to try and speed.


If it was a one time deal I wouldnt worry about it. If it becomes a repeat process then i would do something about, via legal action.

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Maybe he just likes Mustangs.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovcom
Mr. V, I cannot argue with you, as I am not an expert on the law. And I am sure what you wrote is all true. However, I am a male, a father, and once a teenager. Regardless of what you wrote, we all know how young males, hell, old males too, can get pretty frisky with our wheels, especially with a car like the Mustang.

Like you, I was not there to know what the young man did or didn't do. But if he is like most normal American teenagers, well, you and I both know how it is.

If I were his father, I would thank the cop for giving my son a harmless warning, a heads up so to speak. It was just one time, and you know as well as I do that it takes two points to make a line, a trend. I'm not saying that the cop did not harrass the boy, but after the first time, I will keep more of an open mind.

No offense Mr. V, but lets face it, many lawyers are out looking for "victims" and it seems in this era everyone is a "victim". The fact that his parents help him get such a car suggest that they might not be very wise parents (maybe), and the fact that they are siding with him, well, what message are they giving him? Do they have to go to the local morgue and see dead young males, killed from street racing or other fooking around with cars?

20 or more years ago, a parent in such a situation would have added their own admonishments to their son after the police did what they did. To often parents idealize their children, and what that does is ruin the kid, not help the kid.

Now if this policeaman shows a pattern of messing with the boy, then maybe there is harrassment going on, but after just one episode, I would just let it drop.

I'm 47 and I have dealt with attorneys most of my life, I know how it works, I know the motivation....I have no reason to think that you are not a great attorney....perhaps you are a great one, and a great father too, but lets not forget human nature, how it is to be 17, male, and 300 hourse power under our hoods.

I have two teenagers and I have the resources to provide them both Shelby Mustangs, but I think it would be stupid of me to give them or help them get even a lowly GT...they're my kids, and I love them, but I am not one of these parents that idealize my children, that will back them up even if they're guilty as is the case too often in our society.

My mother teaches 2nd graders....after trying to deal with an unruly student she is force to call home....these days she gets accussed of "picking on" the son/daughter, or having an axe to grind with him/her by the parents. Often my mother will describe the problems she has with the child, and then the parents will call her a liar...it's really sad that parents these days blindly back their "angelic" children and in the end they wonder why the kids go bad.

If the boy takes to heart the message the cop might have been trying to send, it could be possible that that message might have saved his life.
Sir while i accept your argument, and the fact that you DISAGREE with the decision that his parents made, you have absolutely no right to critize their judgement without the proper jurisdiction. He is not the only kid to receive a fast car at an early age, and most certainly will not be the last. I encourage you to realize that all parents must make decisions that others might not agree with, but nine times out of ten, they have pretty damn good reasons to back them up.

It is not the car that gets kids to race. If a kid wants to race, then he will regardless of what car it is. Clearly his parents trust him not to be reckless, and dangerous behind the wheel, if they did not trust him then obviously he would not have gotten the car.

So like I said earlier, do not criticize his parents or the parents of others like him, simply disagree in a peaceful and educated manner, so as to keep this forum fun and relaxed: the way it should be.

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Sir while i accept your argument, and the fact that you DISAGREE with the decision that his parents made, you have absolutely no right to critize their judgement without the proper jurisdiction. He is not the only kid to receive a fast car at an early age, and most certainly will not be the last. I encourage you to realize that all parents must make decisions that others might not agree with, but nine times out of ten, they have pretty damn good reasons to back them up.

It is not the car that gets kids to race. If a kid wants to race, then he will regardless of what car it is. Clearly his parents trust him not to be reckless, and dangerous behind the wheel, if they did not trust him then obviously he would not have gotten the car.

So like I said earlier, do not criticize his parents or the parents of others like him, simply disagree in a peaceful and educated manner, so as to keep this forum fun and relaxed: the way it should be.

Thank you someone understands! Now I am not here to defend myself or to offer reasoning behind why I own a 2006 Mustang GT with nearly 300rwhp. That would spark too many circumstancial arguements. However, I understand the reasoning behind the officers actions, he saw a kid in a mustang gt going up a hill with exhaust that is most likely louder than an ambulance. If i was a cop, i would probably give him a warning aswell.

Being a 17 year old in today's culture i understand that stereotyping will be a concern. I do not believe that gives the officer to verbally intimidate me and make a delayed visit to my house. I believe this was out of line, you either pull someone over, or drop it.

I will just say that i have not had a run in with this officer before directly however, i neglected to mention that my friend had been pulled over comming out of the SAME interesection for screeching his tires. The pavement has alot of gravel and he screeched his tires while i was next to him, i was following him and he got pulled over. The cop (same one) asked him about me and my car. My friend got a warning(a written one) and went on his way.

So technically this is the second time the cop has talked to or about me with an associate of mine when i have no commited an infraction of the law.

I do not street race and so i do not agree with everyone who has admitted to doing stupid things when they were my age. Becuase you may have been irresponsible doesnt mean i am. Since when am i guilty by association of my age! My mantra is "with great power comes great responsibility" and i believe i embody the theme of this motto.

I doubt i will persue this officer and his possibly immoral actions. There are a few people in life you just do not want to **** with: the IRS, a loan shark, the mafia, and the COPS! they have too much power unrestricted by motor vehicle laws. Like stated earlier, an "Exhibition of speed" can be defined by the officer at any given time and there is no recorded event of the infraction taking place besides for the officer's testimony.

So unless it continues i think i just better hurry up and put some resonators on my car and do 24mph in the school zones and do all my traffic checks through intersections and be a contributing member of civil society


Thanks for all the responses guys, i just wanted to share my little story, i did not anticipate such a reaction.

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hey like i stated in an earlier post we're in the same boat dude.... just don't let it go to your head

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One reason there are still bullies operating in this world is because people DO NOT stand up for themselves enough. Intimidation cannot be tolerated, especially when it involves someone who has been granted authority over others. That's abuse of power, at the very least.

Who really knows this officer's motives at this point. But, it seems if he were really concerned about this youth's safety and the safety of others, he would have met with the youth and his parent(s) and used the opportunity to teach and intruct them all about the proper way for the youth to use his highly powered vehicle. To come to the door at a later time and intimidate a minor like that should be cause for cocern. And, I still hold to the idea that the parents should file a formal complant with the commanding officer and demand that the issue be discussed. Maybe that would at least get the offending officer moved somewhere else.

I see this type of abuse of authority towards me and my patients frequently working in the ER when the police bring perps in for treatment, and as a nurse I DO NOT SIT BACK and allow the abuse to continue towards the patient or me. I have reported several officers to their CO's, and believe you me, I don't hesitate for a second. I wish more people would stand up for themselves.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gphasagt
Sir while i accept your argument, and the fact that you DISAGREE with the decision that his parents made, you have absolutely no right to critize their judgement without the proper jurisdiction. He is not the only kid to receive a fast car at an early age, and most certainly will not be the last. I encourage you to realize that all parents must make decisions that others might not agree with, but nine times out of ten, they have pretty damn good reasons to back them up.

It is not the car that gets kids to race. If a kid wants to race, then he will regardless of what car it is. Clearly his parents trust him not to be reckless, and dangerous behind the wheel, if they did not trust him then obviously he would not have gotten the car.

So like I said earlier, do not criticize his parents or the parents of others like him, simply disagree in a peaceful and educated manner, so as to keep this forum fun and relaxed: the way it should be.
Tell me something...if you were a fly on the wall at the poster's gym lockerroom, or the locker room of any 17 year old male in America who drives a late model Mustang GT, would kind of talk would you imagine you might hear? Now I realize one should not be found guilty just because they're a certain age, or sex, and agree with this...but it is also safe to say that 90% or more males in that age group that drive a 300 hp car will often play with it, if you know what I mean..ESPECIALLY if their buddies are in the car with them....it's just human nature...this is not to say that these boys are bad or wrong....actually the contrary...they are normal boys that act in normal very predicable ways.

And don't kid yourself for one second, there is only ONE reason a 17 year old boy drives a 300hp late model car...lets not play dumb here ;-)

And I can guarentee you that if a teenaged male drives a 140hp Corolla, that same male will drive a 300 hp Mustang MUCH differently.

One could argue that that cop may well be a very cool dude...it seems he has offered more then one warning. Did you consider that maybe, just maybe this cop is actually cares about young male drivers? I too have been harrassed by cops more then once, so believe me I am not one of these Polly Anny types that think cops are always right....in fact I think most cops are cops because of some sort of phsycological dysfunction.

And also did you consider that this cop may well have another angle to the story.

By the way, I have no reason to thing the poster is a bad boy, or anything negative...actually, he comes across very normal...and there in lies the problem...he is a normal male, and that should be reason enough for parents to be mindful before helping their teenagers get into 300hp wheels. I know...I'm a dad, and once upon a time a teenager too.
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Tell me something...if you were a fly on the wall at the poster's gym lockerroom, or the locker room of any 17 year old male in America who drives a late model Mustang GT, would kind of talk would you imagine you might hear? Now I realize one should not be found guilty just because they're a certain age, or sex, and agree with this...but it is also safe to say that 90% or more males in that age group that drive a 300 hp car will often play with it, if you know what I mean..ESPECIALLY if their buddies are in the car with them....it's just human nature...this is not to say that these boys are bad or wrong....actually the contrary...they are normal boys that act in normal very predicable ways.

And don't kid yourself for one second, there is only ONE reason a 17 year old boy drives a 300hp late model car...lets not play dumb here ;-)

And I can guarentee you that if a teenaged male drives a 140hp Corolla, that same male will drive a 300 hp Mustang MUCH differently.

One could argue that that cop may well be a very cool dude...it seems he has offered more then one warning. Did you consider that maybe, just maybe this cop is actually cares about young male drivers? I too have been harrassed by cops more then once, so believe me I am not one of these Polly Anny types that think cops are always right....in fact I think most cops are cops because of some sort of phsycological dysfunction.

And also did you consider that this cop may well have another angle to the story.

By the way, I have no reason to thing the poster is a bad boy, or anything negative...actually, he comes across very normal...and there in lies the problem...he is a normal male, and that should be reason enough for parents to be mindful before helping their teenagers get into 300hp wheels. I know...I'm a dad, and once upon a time a teenager too.
now ya just insultin the kid...there are lots of 17 year olds with their head on straight...so what the kid has a nice car...that point youre making applies to every red blooded american male's locker room if hes 16 or 60...try hanging out at my job and you wouldnt believe what we talk about...what the cop did was damn near horror movie creepy...no way around it...as a cop you see something ...you do something...on the spot not 15 mins later at his house...when noones at home...look kid..you and your family do whatever you have to do so that jacknuts doesnt come back...trust me when i tell ya...there was nothing noble or honorable about his actions...like i said....imagine that was your daughter he followed home under some pretense of caring and bullied his way into the house to "talk" to her...people here say the other cops will come down on you...chances are they'll come down on him

Quote:
Originally Posted by lovcom
Did you consider that maybe, just maybe this cop is actually cares about young male drivers?
i think i'm a lil worried that maybe he "cares" about them too much
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovcom

And don't kid yourself for one second, there is only ONE reason a 17 year old boy drives a 300hp late model car...lets not play dumb here ;-)

And I can guarentee you that if a teenaged male drives a 140hp Corolla, that same male will drive a 300 hp Mustang MUCH differently.

.
ummm... i hate to disagree with you here, but you need something to back those statements up. I am 16 and i can tell you that i have friends in corollas, scions, and civics that drive the pants off their cars much faster and more reckless than me or many others... it is not the car it is the kid that speeds. of course i like to have fun, but do you honestly think i wouldnt do the same thing in a Scion TC?

and for the only reason that a 17 yr old boy would get that car... i have no clue what you were getting at, but i can maybe offer a little insight:
1. The car is fast and sexy
2. Chicks dig dudes in mustangs (heh- trust me on that one :hihi
3. Usually the kid has a thing for cars and intends on keeping the car in tip-top shape and hopefully holding on to it for a while
4. Be the envy of your friends
5. Aim for the "Best Car" award in the High School yearbook

so yea, maybe the reasons are all the same, but stereotyping is just wrong... i enjoy the power cuz i hardly have to gas it to get to the speed limit, and i have enough power to pass and merge and etc. without really getting into the pedal.

Maybe I'm different, but i think you're making a lot of teens on here look bad. And please do not take any of this personally i am simply attempting to prove a point.


2005 Mustang GT - SCT X3 + ROUSH CAI, FRPP Stingers, Silverhorse Blackout Panel, Brushed "Aluminum" Dash Kit, California Special rear bumper, chrome American Racing ROGUE wheels 20x8.5 with 255/35/20 Yokohama S.Drive tires, ROUSH rear springs.... JVC KW-AVX820
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