Engine Fire Won't Start - Page 5 - Ford Mustang Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddysMustang View Post
OOPS, forgot to include them. There is so much going on with this investigation.

I'm not sure what the difference is between "stored" codes and "pending" codes but here they are,

stored codes: P0122, P0223, P02110
pending codes: P0122, P0183, P0223, P0451, P2110

The stored codes all have to do with Throttle Position Sensor call outs. I ran through the troubleshooting guides I found on EasyAutoDiagnostics.com and all tests indicate the TPS is OK. I'm not sure about the pending codes or even what that means.

What was your thought about the injector cleaning? Just as a side note, when I replaced the fuel filter there didn't appear to be any dirt or sludge coming from the input side of the filter. I guess the injectors could be dirty but that is a lot of dirt to keep the engine from starting altogether. Although it would show me if all of the injectors are functional.

Hey, wouldn't this be a nice Father's Day to myself if I could get this car running.

Buddy
Doesn't your son have a 4.0L as well? Try swapping the throttle body with his.

Given the codes you are seeing for Fuel temp sensor, Evap, Throttle position... I'd say you either have a harness or ECM issue. There's no way that all of the sensors are bad at the same time, unless they were burnt to a crisp.

For example, my 2006 has only had the FRPS fail. All of my other sensors, including O2s are functioning properly. 10 years and just shy of 100,000 miles.

Cleaning the injectors is not a bad idea, but I highly doubt that is the issue.


2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-18-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
He does but he won't let me near it to swap parts anymore. lol I already swapped the harness with one I found on the web. The original one was burnt to a crisp in some areas. I also swapped out the computer for one I found on EBAY. They pre-programmed it for my vehicles VIN # and it came with 2 new smart keys. No effect !!!

I cleaned and tested the injectors on a live bench test set-up I made. All looks good. I also took this opportunity to flush the fuel lines from the tank to the fuel rails. Also added fresh premium gas. NO EFFECT !!!!!

The only thing I have left is to swap out the fuse box under the hood. When I purchased the replacement harness I also bought the fuse box just in case.....

The good thing is that I have tried and replaced many things that the dealer will not need to do and charge me for if I get to the point where I let them take a crack at it.

???????????

BuddysMustang is offline  
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddysMustang View Post
He does but he won't let me near it to swap parts anymore. lol I already swapped the harness with one I found on the web. The original one was burnt to a crisp in some areas. I also swapped out the computer for one I found on EBAY. They pre-programmed it for my vehicles VIN # and it came with 2 new smart keys. No effect !!!

I cleaned and tested the injectors on a live bench test set-up I made. All looks good. I also took this opportunity to flush the fuel lines from the tank to the fuel rails. Also added fresh premium gas. NO EFFECT !!!!!

The only thing I have left is to swap out the fuse box under the hood. When I purchased the replacement harness I also bought the fuse box just in case.....

The good thing is that I have tried and replaced many things that the dealer will not need to do and charge me for if I get to the point where I let them take a crack at it.

???????????
I'm kinda stumped here Buddy. Have you asked on any other forums? Most of them will let you link to this forum so you don't have to re-type everything, as long as you don't litter their forum with external links.

I kinda wondering about the eBay ECM. Do you have a link to that so I can take a gander at it?

2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
 
post #64 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-19-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
FS1inc.com ........

I have never seen anything like this and I have worked on a lot of car in my lifetime. I think the thing that hurts the most is the thought that I am unable to find the problem and that this thing has beat me.

I was hopping that Mat would help but it seems like he is overwhelmed with his own commitments.
BuddysMustang is offline  
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddysMustang View Post
FS1inc.com ........

I have never seen anything like this and I have worked on a lot of car in my lifetime. I think the thing that hurts the most is the thought that I am unable to find the problem and that this thing has beat me.

I was hopping that Mat would help but it seems like he is overwhelmed with his own commitments.
Buddy, did a search for FS1inc.com, not much came up, but what did come up was on the negative side. Their website says lifetime warranty, you might want to contact them and have your ecm swapped out. Tell them that you are getting all of those codes along with the stalling and inability to run. Least expensive option.

In the meantime contact you favorite local Ford dealer and ask what it would cost to reprogram the ECU. I'm pretty sure with the VIN and code on the side of the original ECM they can do it. Second least expensive.

Reach out to one of the tuning companies, like Bama. I believe they could do it too and you could get a custom performance tune. When I ordered my tunes for the 2006, all they needed was the code on the ECU and possibly the VIN, along with a description of any performance parts I had installed. Might run you $500 or so.

I'm thinking it has to be the computer. You replaced the harness with a like year, correct?

2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
post #66 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-20-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
Hey G-Man,

Yes the replacement harness was a direct replacement with all the same options. I checked the part numbers with my local dealer and they confirmed that the harness was a direct crossover for my VIN. Also when I installed it all of the connectors matched perfectly.

I have already returned the first ECU they sent me for reprogramming and the same unit was returned but the same symptoms were present. I guess it is possible that they got it wrong twice but if you include my original computer that makes 3 programs that didn't work which seems less likely.

I checked out BAMA and it sounds interesting. This is where my knowledge of the new computer controlled cars is weak. I am a recently retired Electrical Engineer from the NAVY so I shouldn't have a problem coming up to speed with this stuff but I just wanted to get the car running not create a new hobby for myself. God knows that I have to many as it is. lol

If I wanted to do the tuner thing myself do you suggest a low cost tuner box for a beginner? If I rely on my dealer for multiple tunes it seems like it could easily surpass the start-up cost for the tuner hardware.
BuddysMustang is offline  
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddysMustang View Post
Hey G-Man,

Yes the replacement harness was a direct replacement with all the same options. I checked the part numbers with my local dealer and they confirmed that the harness was a direct crossover for my VIN. Also when I installed it all of the connectors matched perfectly.

I have already returned the first ECU they sent me for reprogramming and the same unit was returned but the same symptoms were present. I guess it is possible that they got it wrong twice but if you include my original computer that makes 3 programs that didn't work which seems less likely.

I checked out BAMA and it sounds interesting. This is where my knowledge of the new computer controlled cars is weak. I am a recently retired Electrical Engineer from the NAVY so I shouldn't have a problem coming up to speed with this stuff but I just wanted to get the car running not create a new hobby for myself. God knows that I have to many as it is. lol

If I wanted to do the tuner thing myself do you suggest a low cost tuner box for a beginner? If I rely on my dealer for multiple tunes it seems like it could easily surpass the start-up cost for the tuner hardware.
I wouldn't go to the dealer for a tune. Talk to Bama and tell them your situation. See if they think the can get you running again. The good part is the tunes for life. They will modify the tune if you make changes or its not to your liking. Plus you'll be able to change your shift points etc with an automatic tranny.

2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
post #68 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-20-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
I just purchased a Noid Light IAC Tester Set from Harbor Freight. I didn't test the function of the Fuel Injectors while installed in the vehicle and the Noid Light should tell me if the compute is at least sending the turn-on signal to the injectors while I am cranking the engine. YES ?
BuddysMustang is offline  
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuddysMustang View Post
I just purchased a Noid Light IAC Tester Set from Harbor Freight. I didn't test the function of the Fuel Injectors while installed in the vehicle and the Noid Light should tell me if the compute is at least sending the turn-on signal to the injectors while I am cranking the engine. YES ?
Not a bad idea

2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
Rookie
 
twotyred's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2
 
Buddy...Swearing in stereo! Sister-in-law's '05 V6 Mustang is in my diveway. When her car quit her she had it towed to a local auto repair shop. $300 worth of diagonistics later, 'fuel pump & fuel pump control module required'...another $300+ she couldn't afford. Towed car to my driveway, easy fix, right! Engine start but dies. Replaced items plus new fuel filter...Guess what, engine starts for 1-4 seconds after setting overnight, sound familiar? Codes after replaced parts: P0123, P0223, P2104, and P2111. Fuel pump primes, pumps during crank, has hot spark, accelerator pedal and throttle body work in unison. Checked air cleaner (near new), cleaned throttle body, MAF, checked fuel flow on both sides of filter. Getting fuel pressure guage tomorrow. I too am getting farther behind on my real hobbies and will continue to follow this post and provide any pertinent information.
twotyred is offline  
post #71 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-22-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
Hey G-Man, I did the Noid test and I am getting a light flash about every second during engine cranking which seems about right. I tested 2 cylinders with identical results and then got frustrated because this doesn't seem to be the problem so I didn't test any more cylinders. I called Bama and they said they probably couldn't help me and suggested I bring the car to a dealer.

Just as an update, the engine will still start for a few seconds then dies and will not start again until it sits for a day or so. It also appears that we have another member with a very similar problem, Sorry to hear that twotyred. I have been at this for a while now and a few dollars out of pocket. I hope you don't have the same experience as I have.

I think I'm out of ideas unless I contact the place where I got the reconditioned ECU.
BuddysMustang is offline  
Site Sponsor
 
AMAlexLazarus's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2014
Location: Malvern
Posts: 1,204
 
Buddy - Sorry to hear about the trouble here but if there's some type of per-existing issue/condition with the car both myself and their team wont suggest having it tuned/modified as it's likely not going to make the problem go away. Sorry we weren't much help on this.

Alex

Alex Lazarus | AmericanMuscle.com
Toll Free: 1-866-363-4591 | M-F 9AM-9PM EST | Sat 9AM-5:30PM EST
Bama Hotline: 888.226.9764 | M-F 9AM-5:30PM EST
Free Same-Day Shipping!
WIN A SUPERCHARGED MUSTANG & 2017 RAPTOR!
AMAlexLazarus is offline  
post #73 of 115 (permalink) Old 06-23-2015 Thread Starter
Apprentice
 
BuddysMustang's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2014
Location: Brick
Posts: 59
 
I understand Alex. It is just that I have tried so many things and I am running out of ideas. I will try just about anything at this point. I am just reluctant to have a dealer do a bunch of testing to end up at the same point that I am at right now and just be out of pocket more money. At least up to now the money I spent has given me new parts or equipment that has not been a total loss. If a dealer can't find the problem after several hours they still want to be paid.
BuddysMustang is offline  
PONY Member
 
gManTexas's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
Location: Austin
Posts: 702
 
Garage
Buddy, I would try a throttle body somehow. If your son doesn't want to let you, then you'll have to find one somewhere. They are around $200 re-manufactured. I realize that its a risk but all of your codes are related to the throttle position or stuck open.

I want to be careful here since this is a costly repair. Shake down everything else that you can before going down that road, including the throttle position relearn procedure. Do a search, but I believe it is Key On Engine Off and press accelerator to floor. Key off. Then try starting.

I also read that electrical noise from the coils could be causing some headaches. Triple check your grounds around the engine compartment. Even if you just stare at your son's car for mental notes of the locations and connections.

2011 Race Red GT vert, 5.0 A6
FRPP ProCal, JLT oil separator, Boss 302 quads w/ Corsa Xtreme axle backs, Koni STR.T (orange), GT500 strut mounts, Steeda Sports, Steeda billet LCAs, Steeda adj UCA, Steeda adj rear swaybar, BMR adj panhard, BMR lca relocation brackets, Boss 302 lower front fascia
gManTexas is offline  
Rookie
 
twotyred's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2
 
No fuel pressure when crank

Buddy, Got fuel pressure test kit from O'R's to day, of course the connector I needed was missing. Anyway, determined the following: (assistant standing by with fire extinguisher) (1) Pressure buildup during initial key on; (2) Enough pressure to fire the engine (run) for 1-3 seconds; (3) Key off, checked for fuel pressuer at connector, just a dribble, not pressurized. Concluded fuel pump not working during crank. (4) Key on, pressure buildup, crank, short run again, left key on, checked for fuel pressure at connector, again just a dribble. Confirmed fuel pump not working during crank and not working after crank with key left in the on position. Conferred with a couple Mustang gurus, one was sure it was the ECM...other had similar experience with his wife's Mustang and it turned out to be the PATS system. "Like sticking a screwdriver in the ignition and turning...the engine will spin but without recognizing the coded chip in the key there's no signal being sent to the pump (ground). Of course dealer is covered but will get me in asap, only Ford can verify system is functioning correctly...I believe it's worth the hour diagnostic fee. Funny, I had a Jetta earlier this year that lost it's security and had to be reset. Will keep you posted. CC

twotyred is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Mustang Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a VALID email address for yourself, otherwise you will not receive the necessary confirmation email needed to confirm, validate and activate your new AFM member account.

Failure to provide a VALID email address, will result in the cancellation of your new AFM member account registration.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 


Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1