Thinking of reverting back to the stock tune - Ford Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018 Thread Starter
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Thinking of reverting back to the stock tune

My new to me 2012 GT with 40k miles came with a BAMA hand held tuner the previous owner was kind enough to have supplied.

My previous 2011 5.0 was bone stock other than roush exhaust, whereas my 2012 has a roush exhaust, plus an air-raid CAI and currently an 89 performance tune. I tried loading the 91 race tune when I first got the 2012 a few months back and for some reason it didn't work. I didn't really feel like paying BAMA $150 for another 91 tune either when the 89 tune was just fine.

Theres both pros and cons with the tune really.

I absolutely LOVE the tune above 40 mph. The cars an auto, and it really makes it a performance car at highway speeds or above. It shifts later, shifts firmer, downshifts in a split second when I floor it, and holds the RPMS longer when I let off.

What I don't like is its near impossible to launch from a stop without fishtailing. Even if I baby the throttle at launch, once I get to about 4000 rpms in 1st gear it breaks loose again and sends me straight towards the nearest curb/wall.
The only way to combat this is being so delicate with the throttle that it makes slower than a stock launch anyway. I'm turning traction and advance trac fully off (6 seconds) like I did when I launched in the 2011.

Another drawback with the tune is more of a silly one. ( Again with trac and advance trac fully off) whenever making right turns in my stock 2011, if I floored it mid turn it would make a lazy, predictable, but impressive sideways drift. Every time. Super easy to control and know when to counter steer. When I do that now in the tuned 2012 its terrifying and sends me straight to the wall.

The last straw tonight was a Ford focus RS pulling up to me at a red-light, bone stock, and completely spanking me. I went sideways and had to let off moments after launching. I distinctly remember back in the 2011 having a perfect launch and beating the RS the whole way to 50 mph, and then completely leaving him behind.

What do you guys thing? Should I revert to stock? Find another tuner? Am I just not launching how I should be?


2001 Mustang GT - Crashed (Other person's fault) Stock.
2003 Mustang GT - Sold
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2005 Mustang GT - Traded in
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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I never turn it off - even at the strip I put it in Sport mode (brake light lit and double click the button) mine is stock but still dangerous with traction fully off. I don't know about the GT but my 12 Performance pkg V6 traction control was very invasive - as in nearly breaking my nose on the steering wheel cuz it would just pull all the throttle out sometimes - the 14 is no where near as harsh when it steps in, especially in sport mode.
I have read bad reviews about Bama but have no personal experience. Having said that I will be going with a Lund tune on my 14.
At the end of the day it is your car so you should do what makes you most comfortable with it. I understand that the stock tune really makes the auto lazy and slow. On the upside if you don't like it you can always reinstall the Bama tune you've got.

Scott


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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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Don't beat yourself up too badly. The guy in the first Focus RS that you waxed was probably the bad driver. On street tires it's a rare mustang that will take a hot hatch in the early going. They go about 4.5 sec 0-60 and with the AWD it doesn't matter much if the road is good or bad. They just go. It's a rare mustang that beats that by much on dusty, crappy city streets.

Congrats on being man enough to admit you got done in by a Focus. I have never until now, inspired by your example, admitted that I took a similar bad beat. My daughter was driving my winter STi Subaru and gave me a lesson to remember one day. Absolute win for her up until well into third or maybe even 4th. God, it feels good to finally get that off my chest.

Wondering if maybe you are looking at more of a tire problem than a tune issue? If it's great everywhere else but just too powerful off the line and at slow speeds well....that just doesn't sound like a bad thing. Just needs more traction. Suspension and tires. Or only go the RS's from a decent roll. (Not that anyone should do this on the street, naturally. Closed course, professional driver and all that....) Not loving the sound of it wanting to go sideways all the time, though.

Good luck with it and hope it works out for you.

All the best.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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It sounds like the issue with the tune is that the throttle response is extremely exaggerated. I think they do that on purpose to fool us into thinking we are getting a lot more performance from the engine; I think that's where most of the "it's like night and day" comments come from.

Before you can go back to the factory tune, you have to make sure that your intake is the same diameter as stock. I think Air-Raid does offer a "no tune required" model but I don't know which one you have. If the MAF metering section is bigger than stock, then the tune MUST be adjusted or the computer's math will be wrong, it won't command enough fuel for the air that is coming in, and the car will run lean.

Another option would be to work with a different tuner, such as Lito. I am not sure how much he charges but I plan to look into it soon for my car. You should be able to work with him to make sure you get nice linear throttle response, rather than the on/off extreme response that you have now.

Then it sounds like tires are in order also . . .

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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You need control arms, a good set of LCA's and the upper. My car with all nannies turned off with destroy the tires if I want to, but it tracks straight. Good tires are also a must as has been stated. If you are concerned about the tune I would go with an AED tune.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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Sounds like a TIRE issue. Get some better rubber out back there and enjoy the tune's power better. ALL Mustangs are under-tired from the factory. I have a tuned 14 auto and I roll into the gas off idle and I'm pretty much unbeatable off the line on the road. 285/35/19s Goodyear F1 Asymmetric all-seasons all round on the stock BBP wheels.
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBert View Post
It sounds like the issue with the tune is that the throttle response is extremely exaggerated. I think they do that on purpose to fool us into thinking we are getting a lot more performance from the engine; I think that's where most of the "it's like night and day" comments come from.

Before you can go back to the factory tune, you have to make sure that your intake is the same diameter as stock. I think Air-Raid does offer a "no tune required" model but I don't know which one you have. If the MAF metering section is bigger than stock, then the tune MUST be adjusted or the computer's math will be wrong, it won't command enough fuel for the air that is coming in, and the car will run lean.

Another option would be to work with a different tuner, such as Lito. I am not sure how much he charges but I plan to look into it soon for my car. You should be able to work with him to make sure you get nice linear throttle response, rather than the on/off extreme response that you have now.

Then it sounds like tires are in order also . . .

I remember years ago, (Ed) Isky was building cams for one of the elite drag racers..... he insisted on getting more tq lower....isky fought him but eventually gave up and gave the team what they wanted....their 1/4 mile times slowed down...they blamed everyone except themselves......several years later they sold the car, the next guy called isky and wanted a cam....he sold them the exact cam that he made for the other team........IIRR, they turned .5 seconds faster ..... all because there was too much tq too low to control......and agree with the TPS being the issue.

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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-27-2018 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDN5.0 View Post
I never turn it off - even at the strip I put it in Sport mode (brake light lit and double click the button) mine is stock but still dangerous with traction fully off. I don't know about the GT but my 12 Performance pkg V6 traction control was very invasive - as in nearly breaking my nose on the steering wheel cuz it would just pull all the throttle out sometimes - the 14 is no where near as harsh when it steps in, especially in sport mode.
I have read bad reviews about Bama but have no personal experience. Having said that I will be going with a Lund tune on my 14.
At the end of the day it is your car so you should do what makes you most comfortable with it. I understand that the stock tune really makes the auto lazy and slow. On the upside if you don't like it you can always reinstall the Bama tune you've got.

Scott
I hit sport mode every time I start her up. I turn everything all the way off when I know I'm about to race. Back in my stock 2011 every single time I started up unless it was raining I would turn all the nannies off and it was always predictable, even if it broke loose. In my tuned 2012 when it breaks loose its a holy $hit moment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UUUd444 View Post
Don't beat yourself up too badly. The guy in the first Focus RS that you waxed was probably the bad driver. On street tires it's a rare mustang that will take a hot hatch in the early going. They go about 4.5 sec 0-60 and with the AWD it doesn't matter much if the road is good or bad. They just go. It's a rare mustang that beats that by much on dusty, crappy city streets.

Congrats on being man enough to admit you got done in by a Focus. I have never until now, inspired by your example, admitted that I took a similar bad beat. My daughter was driving my winter STi Subaru and gave me a lesson to remember one day. Absolute win for her up until well into third or maybe even 4th. God, it feels good to finally get that off my chest.

Wondering if maybe you are looking at more of a tire problem than a tune issue? If it's great everywhere else but just too powerful off the line and at slow speeds well....that just doesn't sound like a bad thing. Just needs more traction. Suspension and tires. Or only go the RS's from a decent roll. (Not that anyone should do this on the street, naturally. Closed course, professional driver and all that....) Not loving the sound of it wanting to go sideways all the time, though.

Good luck with it and hope it works out for you.

All the best.
Hahaha! I'm glad you got that off your chest. This is like a group therapy session.
Yeah unless the situation is ideal, the RS will take the jump due to AWD. I just had the launches in my 2011 down to almost a science. Minimal wheel spin and it just hooooooked the whole way, broke loose a little from 1st to second, and then continued to hook.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JBert View Post
It sounds like the issue with the tune is that the throttle response is extremely exaggerated. I think they do that on purpose to fool us into thinking we are getting a lot more performance from the engine; I think that's where most of the "it's like night and day" comments come from.

Before you can go back to the factory tune, you have to make sure that your intake is the same diameter as stock. I think Air-Raid does offer a "no tune required" model but I don't know which one you have. If the MAF metering section is bigger than stock, then the tune MUST be adjusted or the computer's math will be wrong, it won't command enough fuel for the air that is coming in, and the car will run lean.

Another option would be to work with a different tuner, such as Lito. I am not sure how much he charges but I plan to look into it soon for my car. You should be able to work with him to make sure you get nice linear throttle response, rather than the on/off extreme response that you have now.

Then it sounds like tires are in order also . . .
Completely agree -- it feels like the tune opens up the throttle body all the way too early on in the rpms, it just revs too quick in first gear for there to be any sort of grip.
Thanks for the advise on the intake diameter. Let me know how the tune with Lito goes! You described it perfectly, the throttle response is like on/off now, as opposed to linear. Great at higher speeds, but just no hope of traction at lower ones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott9050 View Post
You need control arms, a good set of LCA's and the upper. My car with all nannies turned off with destroy the tires if I want to, but it tracks straight. Good tires are also a must as has been stated. If you are concerned about the tune I would go with an AED tune.
What control arms do you have on currently?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5LHO View Post
Sounds like a TIRE issue. Get some better rubber out back there and enjoy the tune's power better. ALL Mustangs are under-tired from the factory. I have a tuned 14 auto and I roll into the gas off idle and I'm pretty much unbeatable off the line on the road. 285/35/19s Goodyear F1 Asymmetric all-seasons all round on the stock BBP wheels.
I would love to get wider tires, but I already have Pirelli 245s... I could probably stretch to 255s on my stock 19 by 8.5 wheels, but anything more and I would need to buy all new wheels AND tires, like 19 by 9.5s.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beechkid View Post
I remember years ago, (Ed) Isky was building cams for one of the elite drag racers..... he insisted on getting more tq lower....isky fought him but eventually gave up and gave the team what they wanted....their 1/4 mile times slowed down...they blamed everyone except themselves......several years later they sold the car, the next guy called isky and wanted a cam....he sold them the exact cam that he made for the other team........IIRR, they turned .5 seconds faster ..... all because there was too much tq too low to control......and agree with the TPS being the issue.
Remind me again what TPS stands for?

2001 Mustang GT - Crashed (Other person's fault) Stock.
2003 Mustang GT - Sold
Lowered, Flowmaster catbacks, CAI + Tune, 5% tint all around, American racing wheels.
2005 Mustang GT - Traded in
"Performance" spark plugs and ignition coils, 5% tint on back 3 - 20% on front two, 20 inch silver AMR wheels
2011 Mustang GT - BEAST
5% tint all around. 2014 GT premium wheels. Roush axleback
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 03-28-2018
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Originally Posted by LosAngelesGT View Post
. . . Remind me again what TPS stands for?
Throttle Position Sensor -- part of the throttle controls. Could be the sensor is acting up and/or needs to be recallibrated; or it could be just the tune; or could be something else.

This makes me think -- there is a procedure to recallibrate the throttle that might be worth a try. I think it might be in the owner's manual; I don't remember exactly how it works; but something like pressing the pedal slowly down to full throttle and holding it there (with engine off of course) . . . It is posted on here somewhere, you can probably find it with some searches if you are persistent, or check the manual.

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I know tires can make a huge difference. I put Michelin Pilot SSs on my Cobra. I had to work hard to make them spin and was afraid something important would break if I tried too hard. But they really would launch. Unfortunately they were toast at <10,000 miles. Fun while they lasted though.
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Quote:
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What control arms do you have on currently?



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Scott, did that upper control arm add a lot of noise? (aka "NVH")

that hard joint looks like it would transmit every whine, squeak, rattle, clunk and groan directly into the cabin . . . . the articulation is great for a track car, but just wondering how annoying it is for a street car

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Quote:
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Scott, did that upper control arm add a lot of noise? (aka "NVH")

that hard joint looks like it would transmit every whine, squeak, rattle, clunk and groan directly into the cabin . . . . the articulation is great for a track car, but just wondering how annoying it is for a street car
Haven't really noticed any, but to be fair I have an off road pipe and a bit of hearing loss.

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J I went with the Whiteline upper and their non adjustable lowers with brackets - transformed the car - no hop at all, easy to hook back up if it spins the wheels and I can now induce throttle oversteer, sliding sideways mid corner worry free - it is very easy to pick it back up and straighten - makes me look like Harvick but yes I have 3.73's and torsen diff and I now have the dreaded gear whine while cruising between 90 kmh and 115 kmh (55 to 65 mph for you 'Muricans) I'm going to line the trunk floor and under the back seat with Dynomat to see if that helps cuz I'm never going back to stock - the Whiteline stuff is just too good.

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