LCA relocation bracket questions - Ford Mustang Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-16-2011 Thread Starter
BOSS Member
S197 Member
 
randeez11's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Windsor
Posts: 4,842
 
LCA relocation bracket questions

I have been reading as much as possible about using LCA relocation brackets to get rid of wheel hop. Does anyone have them on a stock height car ? Are there any downsides to handling, braking etc when the car is stock and not lowered with relocation brackets installed ? Also, if anyone has these brackets on a stock height car , what brand do you have and which hole are you using ?
I have Steeda billet LCA's with urethane bushings and I am trying to avoid changing the upper control arm if the relocation brackets will do the job and stop the wheel hop.


2011 GT. Grabber Blue. Procharged. 3:73 manual.Billit LCA's. Corsa Extremes. GT 500 wheels. Racemaster DR's. T-56 Tremec. Dynotech DS . Centerforce DF. American Racing headers/high flow cats 560 rwhp.Donny Walsh tuned

2012 Pony Package. Race Red.3:31 automatic.BBK longtubes and catted X.FRPP Sport axlebacks. BBK throttle body. Dynotech DS. Brembo wheels and tires. Strut tower brace. Airraid CAI. Bama tuned.
randeez11 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-16-2011
PONY Member
 
cshiznitzj's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 548
 
Why do you want to avoid changing the upper? It is not a very difficult install.


Ford Racing K-springs & dampeners. UPR Street adjustable UCA. UMI LCA & bolt in relocation brackets. Comp Eng. panhard.
cshiznitzj is offline  
post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-16-2011
Apprentice
 
Kingcrabb's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 135
 
Send a message via AIM to Kingcrabb
I have UMI brackets with UMI adjustable rod end LCAs.
I know have ZERO wheel hop. The only thing i have noticed is top end stability is slightly decreased.

2011 5.0 400a Brembo.
12.7 @ 113 Stock
12.5 @ 116 Bama Tune
2001 Focus Built Boosted to the moon.
15.6 @ 86 Stock
11.8 @ 117....not stock....
Kingcrabb is offline  
 
post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-16-2011 Thread Starter
BOSS Member
S197 Member
 
randeez11's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Windsor
Posts: 4,842
 
WellI figured changing the upper control arm was a lot harder than putting brackets on the LCA's ,as the rear seat has to come out etc. Also the brackets are a lot less money if they will do the same job.

2011 GT. Grabber Blue. Procharged. 3:73 manual.Billit LCA's. Corsa Extremes. GT 500 wheels. Racemaster DR's. T-56 Tremec. Dynotech DS . Centerforce DF. American Racing headers/high flow cats 560 rwhp.Donny Walsh tuned

2012 Pony Package. Race Red.3:31 automatic.BBK longtubes and catted X.FRPP Sport axlebacks. BBK throttle body. Dynotech DS. Brembo wheels and tires. Strut tower brace. Airraid CAI. Bama tuned.
randeez11 is offline  
post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-16-2011
PONY Member
 
68DARKHORSE's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 570
 
I have noticed no ill effects. I use the lower setting all the time.
Traction is MUCH improved. Car doesn't squat on launch anymore. It uses that energy to plant the tires now.

'73 Mach 1 - Boss 351 clone in progress
68DARKHORSE is offline  
post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011 Thread Starter
BOSS Member
S197 Member
 
randeez11's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Windsor
Posts: 4,842
 
Thanks guys. So are your cars at stock height ? If so, I like what I hear. I think those UMI relocation brackets will be going on my car.

2011 GT. Grabber Blue. Procharged. 3:73 manual.Billit LCA's. Corsa Extremes. GT 500 wheels. Racemaster DR's. T-56 Tremec. Dynotech DS . Centerforce DF. American Racing headers/high flow cats 560 rwhp.Donny Walsh tuned

2012 Pony Package. Race Red.3:31 automatic.BBK longtubes and catted X.FRPP Sport axlebacks. BBK throttle body. Dynotech DS. Brembo wheels and tires. Strut tower brace. Airraid CAI. Bama tuned.
randeez11 is offline  
post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011
PONY Member
 
cshiznitzj's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 548
 
Mine is not stock height. I have the UMIs with it set at the lowest setting and the rake (Angle) of the LCA is not very aggressive.

The UCA does take a bit more effort than LCA and relocation brackets, but it isn't really any harder. Back seat comes out with push of two tabs, literally 20 seconds when you know where the tabs are located. Remove the H-back exhaust and UCA has 4 bolts and it is out.

Ford Racing K-springs & dampeners. UPR Street adjustable UCA. UMI LCA & bolt in relocation brackets. Comp Eng. panhard.
cshiznitzj is offline  
post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011
Guest
 
Back@itagain's Avatar
 
Posts: n/a
Most, if not all, relocations brackets require welding. Bolts are only supposed to be temporary. I had mine installed to correct the LCA angle after lowering the car. They difinetly make a big difference but I doubt they are necessary on stock ride height. I would suggest going with a good adjustable upper control arm.
post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011
PONY Member
 
68DARKHORSE's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 570
 
Mine is stock height.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I doubt they are necessary on stock ride height.
On launch, the differential tries to rotate in the opposite direction of the tires. Draw an imaginary line through the LCA to the front of the car. That’s where the energy wants to go. With a horizontal LCA, the rotation in the diff causes the car to squat. Squat is a waste of energy that lowers the contact pressure of the tires. Now lower the rear pivot of the LCA, and draw that line again. The backward rotation of the diff is now pushing upward (slightly) through the LCA. The brackets work like liftbars/Southside bars. By lowering the rear of the LCA, the rotating diff tries to lift the car. The lifting action increases the downward pressure on the tires.

In their words:
2005-2011 Ford Mustang Rear Control Arm Relocation Brackets- Bolt In [1060] - $109.99 : UMI Performance, Inc.

"The UMI Performance control arm relocation brackets are designed to change the instant center point of the vehicle and plant the rear end harder into the ground. By changing the intersecting point of the control arms it allows better weight transfer and forces the rear end into the ground while lifting the body. This technique has been used for many years and has been proven to work over and over again on all types of applications. Relocation brackets are also recommended for lowered vehicles to correct lost suspension geometry caused from height altering."

" Brackets installed on a non-lowered Mustang can provide a .10 or better 60-foot reduction and an increase in track consistency."

'73 Mach 1 - Boss 351 clone in progress
68DARKHORSE is offline  
PONY Member
 
68DARKHORSE's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 570
 
This is a great book on suspension and chassis mods. Mustang Performance Handbook 2 by William R. Mathis.
This was written pre-2005 but, the theories still apply. Maybe someone knows of something more recent.

'73 Mach 1 - Boss 351 clone in progress
68DARKHORSE is offline  
Apprentice
 
dewyrussler's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2011
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 146
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 68DARKHORSE View Post
Mine is stock height.



On launch, the differential tries to rotate in the opposite direction of the tires. Draw an imaginary line through the LCA to the front of the car. Thatís where the energy wants to go. With a horizontal LCA, the rotation in the diff causes the car to squat. Squat is a waste of energy that lowers the contact pressure of the tires. Now lower the rear pivot of the LCA, and draw that line again. The backward rotation of the diff is now pushing upward (slightly) through the LCA. The brackets work like liftbars/Southside bars. By lowering the rear of the LCA, the rotating diff tries to lift the car. The lifting action increases the downward pressure on the tires.
That is a very good explanation. I've always 'kinda' understood what they did...but this painted a clear picture of exactly what they do. Thanks!

-1983 5.0 GT Red/Black.5MT.3:73.FMS Lowering Springs
-2011 5.0 GT Prem.Kona Blue.6MT.19" Nickel Wheels.3:73.Comf Pack. Blk/Cshmr Int
dewyrussler is offline  
PONY Member
 
68DARKHORSE's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 570
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewyrussler View Post
That is a very good explanation. I've always 'kinda' understood what they did...but this painted a clear picture of exactly what they do. Thanks!

Thanks. I was hoping it made sense. The book I mentioned goes more into detail and shows how to fabricate a lot of parts including torque arms, front control arms, and rollcages.

'73 Mach 1 - Boss 351 clone in progress
68DARKHORSE is offline  
post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-17-2011 Thread Starter
BOSS Member
S197 Member
 
randeez11's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Windsor
Posts: 4,842
 
Thanks 68 Darkhorse. I am going to get the brackets. Even if I have to change the UCA later, I still think the brackets are worth putting on.

2011 GT. Grabber Blue. Procharged. 3:73 manual.Billit LCA's. Corsa Extremes. GT 500 wheels. Racemaster DR's. T-56 Tremec. Dynotech DS . Centerforce DF. American Racing headers/high flow cats 560 rwhp.Donny Walsh tuned

2012 Pony Package. Race Red.3:31 automatic.BBK longtubes and catted X.FRPP Sport axlebacks. BBK throttle body. Dynotech DS. Brembo wheels and tires. Strut tower brace. Airraid CAI. Bama tuned.
randeez11 is offline  
Guest
 
Back@itagain's Avatar
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by 68DARKHORSE View Post
Mine is stock height.



On launch, the differential tries to rotate in the opposite direction of the tires. Draw an imaginary line through the LCA to the front of the car. Thatís where the energy wants to go. With a horizontal LCA, the rotation in the diff causes the car to squat. Squat is a waste of energy that lowers the contact pressure of the tires. Now lower the rear pivot of the LCA, and draw that line again. The backward rotation of the diff is now pushing upward (slightly) through the LCA. The brackets work like liftbars/Southside bars. By lowering the rear of the LCA, the rotating diff tries to lift the car. The lifting action increases the downward pressure on the tires.

In their words:
2005-2011 Ford Mustang Rear Control Arm Relocation Brackets- Bolt In [1060] - $109.99 : UMI Performance, Inc.

"The UMI Performance control arm relocation brackets are designed to change the instant center point of the vehicle and plant the rear end harder into the ground. By changing the intersecting point of the control arms it allows better weight transfer and forces the rear end into the ground while lifting the body. This technique has been used for many years and has been proven to work over and over again on all types of applications. Relocation brackets are also recommended for lowered vehicles to correct lost suspension geometry caused from height altering."

" Brackets installed on a non-lowered Mustang can provide a .10 or better 60-foot reduction and an increase in track consistency."

For some reason my response didn't post...so for the condensed version.

To address the OPs concern regarding wheel hop. Relocation brackets will probably make wheel hop even worse due to any increased traction. The axle housing will want to rotate even harder putting more stress on the suspension parts until they snap the housing back to its original position. This happens over and over and is why you get wheel hop. Weak OEM stamped steel parts and rubber bushings should be replaced to limit the axles ability to do this first. Increasing traction at this point will only increase the stress on the suspension.

Yes the relocation brakets will work on stock ride height since they further increase the "positive" angle on the LCA's but I still believe they are not needed. Especially at this point. At stock ride height, my car had no problems with squating. It wasn't until I lowered the car and had a "negative" angle which allowed the rear axle to float rather than plant. Thats when I had my relocation brackets welded in.

If you are worried about 60' times you should already be running a taller D/R or wrinkle-wall slick which alone will increase the angle, not to mention different springs, shocks and so on. There are plenty of mustangs at the track running w/o relocation brackets and posting very quick times.
PONY Member
 
68DARKHORSE's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 570
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
To address the OPs concern regarding wheel hop. Relocation brackets will probably make wheel hop even worse due to any increased traction. The axle housing will want to rotate even harder putting more stress on the suspension parts until they snap the housing back to its original position. This happens over and over and is why you get wheel hop. Weak OEM stamped steel parts and rubber bushings should be replaced to limit the axles ability to do this first. Increasing traction at this point will only increase the stress on the suspension.
The OP stated that he already has billet LCAs. It will be good to change the UCA but, it doesn't flex nearly as much as the stock LCAs do.


Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
If you are worried about 60' times you should already be running a taller D/R or wrinkle-wall slick which alone will increase the angle, not to mention different springs, shocks and so on. There are plenty of mustangs at the track running w/o relocation brackets and posting very quick times.
The brackets are MUCH cheaper then a set of wheels and tires. UMI claims they dropped .3sec off their 60' with LCAs and relocation brackets. Maybe they learned how to drive the car(IDK) but, I do know my traction has improved.


Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
If you are worried about 60' times you should already be running a taller D/R or wrinkle-wall slick which alone will increase the angle,
A taller tire does not change the suspension geometry. The intersecting lines between the upper and lower arms are what changes the instant center.


'73 Mach 1 - Boss 351 clone in progress
68DARKHORSE is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Mustang Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a VALID email address for yourself, otherwise you will not receive the necessary confirmation email needed to confirm, validate and activate your new AFM member account.

Failure to provide a VALID email address, will result in the cancellation of your new AFM member account registration.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 


Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1