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2013 GT with worn out clutch? Dealership taking advantage

9K views 67 replies 23 participants last post by  dcottrell6 
#1 ·
My 2013 GT Convertible is in the shop with a transmission issue, and a TPMS sensor is out.

The issue is that the car is very hard to shift, but there is no issue with the actual "holding" of the clutch. In previous cars I and my spouse have had our cars went 6+ years on the OEM clutches. Even my 2005 GTO went 85k on the original clutch and it had all bolt-ons, cam, headers, etc.

What I'm experiencing is that in order to shift cleanly, I'm having to pump up pressure, and that it's nearly impossible to shift still, I have to try with all my might to get it into gear, and the friction point is very low since it seemingly is never fully disengaging.

Holding power is there, I can freely slip in 1st thru 3rd while taking off and there is no slippage, when floored, the clutch never shows any signs of slippage. Instead what I'm seeing points directly at the throwout bearing, and possibly hydraulic, as it improves slightly when pumping the clutch.

Koon's Ford in Silver Spring, MD seemingly is trying to take advantage of me as the service adviser is trying to tell me that it's the clutch that is worn out. If the clutch were worn out, it would be slipping and the car would have issues moving under its own power as there wouldn't be a clutch surface to do it's job. Instead the issue I have is the opposite. It grips fine, but due to a bad slave cylinder or throwout bearing it's not releasing the clutch enough for me to shift it into gear easily.

Instead they just see dollar signs, and an opportunity to make a lot of money on a "silly stupid girl that doesn't know anything."

First of all, they want to charge me $1,800 in parts alone to replace the clutch. I looked online and I could buy all the parts required from that very same dealership for $611.23 instead of the $1800 they are asking. When I mean "buy all the parts" I mean going as far as replacing the slave cylinder, the pilot bearing and the clutch master cylinder. They say that the flywheel would be under warranty.

Second, they said they could get my TPMS sensor replaced partially under warranty. That I would be responsible for $300, and they would cover $40, bringing that total to $340. Again, I can get that sensor from their parts department for under $50, so something doesn't feel right. That is under the 3/36,000 warranty, but the car has 36,040 miles on it.

The reason i'm upset is that i feel that I'm being lied to and taken advantage of because I'm female. What they don't know is that I used to be ASE certified about a decade ago, and that I fully understand the issue with my car, and it is NOT the clutch, but rather the throwout bearing, which is less than a $150 part, but would be covered under the 5/60,000 warranty.

I have left PMs with Deysha on multiple Mustang Forums to see if they can intervene, but I feel like this is crap.

In the 36,000 miles on it, it hasn't been raced, modded or abused, heck it's on the original tires. I think anything nearing a burnout has happened once, and that was like taking off hard from a light on the first day.

Any other suggestions? I love this car.

 
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#3 ·
That is such low mileage to be having that kind of problem. :sosad If it's the throw out bearing, the transmission has to be dropped and if you're going to drop the transmission it's a really good idea to replace the clutch plate anyway. See if you can buy the parts from your preferred parts dealer and find someone that will do the labor (the dealership may or may not if you provide the parts).
 
#6 ·
Hey Danielle, welcome!
It does seem like they are not being honest with you and I'm no expert but it does not sound like a clutch problem.

I would definitely take it to another dealer for a second opinion.
 
#9 ·
Sorry to hear about your issues. Make sure to see what Deysha says before proceeding. Did they advise you before hand that they were intending to charge a diagnostic fee?
 
#18 ·
Not if its warranty work.
 
G
#12 ·
Contact Ford Customer directly:

Ford and Mercury United States

1-800-392-3673
1-800-232-5952 (TDD for the Hearing Impaired)
Monday-Friday, 8:00 a.m.- 8:00 p.m. Eastern Time
Saturday, 9:00 a.m.- 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time
 
#14 ·
Yup, sounds a lot like the issue I had when my pressure plate bolts backed out. It started out hard to shift, until it became impossible to shift. Dealership fixed it under warranty no questions asked.
 
#15 ·
After hearing that the parts cost ALONE would be $1800, I would have driven immediately to another place. The fact that your are ASE certified and knew somewhat what the problems could have been, but didn't tell them, was your ace in the hole. If they could have just given you a written estimate that you could have taken as an example to send to a Ford District manager, found out the true scope, reason, and cost of the actual repairs, you could have filed a complaint. Now that it's apart at that scumbag dealership, and if it is slightly out of warranty, it would have been better to take it to a Mustang specialty shop with a Spec2 clutch (or even a stocker). The TPS known-TSB was just icing on the cake to show that they are unscrupulous. If you don't already have a video or the old parts, I would start asking more questions and get the old parts (presumably they will give you the ones that actdually came out of your car, but I would want to witness that) . In fact, keep pretending you are just a dumb girl to see how much they try to bend you over EVEN more. Get it on the video that a friend can take in the background while you talk to the service manager/service advisor. People should get fired for this BS. If you REALLY want to show them something, call your local TV station that has one of those consumer editors that hunts down and proves that businesses are ripping you off. You can pretend to be dumb, the camera crew can come in, then you can start spouting off about the slave cylinder, throw out bearing, hydraulic pressure, and known bolt problems for the Mustang while smiling for the camera , and watch them back-peddle and sweat.... I can't stand business people "bordering on thieves" that take advantage of the elderly or the uninformed.
 
#16 · (Edited)
Well i contacted Ford Service today and asked for them to look into it. They stated a regional manager would be contacted.

I was diagnosed with Leukemia just a few months ago and haven't been working. I've been on short term disability, and I just finally got paid today, but only at a partial rate, and that has only covered my car payments to have them up to date.

I've been spending the majority of my time when I'm not home at the Cancer Research Center, at my Oncologist, at my Endocrinologist, at my Therapist and heck even the Dermatologist. So forgive my frustration when this just feels like icing on the cake.

The oddity is that on Tuesday afternoon the service adviser called and said "we took your car apart, the clutch is absolutely worn out, it'll cost $1900+ labor, coming to a total of $2700, and we'll look into getting your TPMS sensor warrantied."

I called back and got another adviser, and he said, they only did basic and visual checks that my car was in no way taken apart, and until they take it apart they are only assuming it's the clutch.

That drew MANY flags.

The original adviser called again today and left a message today with my spouse and said that the clutch face is absolutely worn out, it'll be $1900+ labor for that and Ford will only partially cover the TPMS sensor which is $300.

Problem is that when you look up the parts on Tousley even replacing everything w/ the clutch, bearings, slave, etc. it only comes to around $1000, and at Tousley prices, $600. The TPMS sensor comes to $85, and under $50 w/ Tousley's price.

I can readily get all those parts at like any dealership for those prices. A Spec Stage 2 only costs $20 more than the Tousley price for the OEM clutch.

We then contacted the dealership asking for a Fax, PDF or something of an exacting estimate so we can check it out and see where we stand. My spouse and I do okay, but I don't know anyone that generally just has 3k laying around.

Instead I just got an e-mail from him.

"I am emailing this and will fax it over also.

Clutch disc is worn out
parts and labor to replace $1933.41 plus tax

There is no defects in clutch system it is just worn out.

Sincerely,

Chris Austin
Service Manager
Koons of Silver Spring
301-890-6100 ext 19141
christopher.austin@koons.com"

No actual estimate with breakdown.

My reply was:

"Just looking for exact pricing and hours of labor on stuff, so I can take a look. Already spoke to Dave, and there is no issue with me getting something like a Spec clutch and having it installed than the apparently super fast wearing stock clutch. also wanted to note that the car was not put into service at zero or 1 mile, and was in fact put into service with something like 80 miles on the odometer, so the TPMS should be fully covered under the 3/36 warranty. "

Haven't heard back yet. I just can't believe that my clutch apparently wore out at 36k, yet my GTO went 7 years and 85k, and only needed to be replaced because the slave started to leak. Her Cooper S went 100k and 6 years before it was replaced, and I think for her it was a bearing and a choice was made while it was apart to just replace the clutch too.

Nothing adds up.
 
#17 ·
It's possible that it is worn out, but I would ask them to coordinate a time for you to come down and watch them disassemble and inspect the clutch yourself right there with them.

Find another technical Mustang buddy that knows that a worn out clutch looks like, if you are unsure, and take them with you. If the clutch is worn that quickly, there will usually be signs of abuse (hot spots and such) on the flywheel and pressure plate as well. Their quote likely includes a new flywheel too, not just the clutch disc and pressure plate.

You're right, something doesn't sound right, either something is wrong and wore out prematurely, or you're not being honest with us. We've all seen people on here screaming bloody murder, and then retract and admit to doing something later, then trying to delete posts, but then we have seen plenty of premature clutch problems with these cars as well.

"TheDivaDanielle" = is this the same DivaDanielle that had over 1,500 posts a year ago? Did your old account get deleted or something?
 
#20 ·
you're thinking of TheMustangSource

I can honestly say that I learned my lessons of prior cars (and my 20's) and haven't done any abusing or real modding of this car period. never been to a track strip or anything. all this car ever got was visuals, lowering and borla exhaust.

I also found it curious that they mentioned multiple times that they would cover a new flywheel on the 5/60k warranty.
 
#19 ·
#21 · (Edited)
I would pay a surprise visit on them and demand to see the alleged worn out parts. You have the experience to know what's worn out and what's not. If for some reason they are worn out at such a low mileage, something must have caused it and the root cause of the problem needs to be identified. Obviously it was not your driving skills as it sounds like you are not new to sticks. I'd be hard pressed to put factory parts back in, though if it did wear out that quickly and it was not caused by another problem.
 
#22 ·
Hey Danielle. I have been to that dealership a couple times for minor things, and I go to one service guy every time. David Ledger. He seems like a down to earth guy who is reasonable. Let us know how this ends up going. Not sure of changing service advisors would help much at the moment but hopefully deysha will chime in here soon.

I'm at just under 32000 miles. About that clutch problem, mine seems to be doing the same sort of thing as yours, but is far more erratic. It goes from catching at the floor to catching perfectly/effortlessly to catching at a good spot (like around middle travel) but shifts become notchy and rough. Seems like most of my shifts have notchiness involved unless it is working perfectly (1 in maybe 5 or 6 drives where it works perfectly, but after a short while of working perfectly it starts to act up again not long after).

No idea what it could be and there's a couple other things I've wanted to get looked at but I'm afraid of being in your exact position, stuck with a loaner and having the dealership fight back and all that other BS involved. Keep this thread updated PLEASE!!!!!
 
#23 ·
The service advisor, Dave had been good he was the one that I talked to the second time who didn't immediately run to the resolution of me needing a new clutch before it was even looked at. He was the one that corrected the misinformation I got from Chris.

I'm a Chevy girl at heart, and I'm dang glad there is a Chevy dealership next door. It was either this or an Ignition Orange SS vert. Guess I'll be taking a harder look at them again if the Ford cars only go 36k while daily driving, and you can beat the piss out of the Camaro at the dragstrip regularly and that stock clutch will still grip great for nearly 100k.

We can also take the Focus ST off our short list for a new car for my spouse, and look at the STI and JCW Coopers.,
 
#24 ·
So whats your plan of attack on the situation at hand? Are you going to let the dealership go forward with the work? If not, are you going to pay them for the labor that they claim to have done to this point?

One option to keep in mind is Revolution Auto in Baltimore. They have a Stage I MT82 rebuild ($899) which they will do for $425 labor. I would rather get an Exedy clutch and a Rev Auto Stage I for the same price that its going to cost you to have the dealership put in the OEM clutch
 
#25 ·
I was called this morning by a really nice and helpful Manager at Ford, and she's going to look into this further, and asked that I compile any further information that I have regarding other and similar transmission issues and any TSBs I have.

So I'm going to wait and let her do her investigating, and see where we go from here, so if anyone has anything relevant, Ford would be more than happy to look into it.

Rev Auto could do the work instead, but the Mustang is the only car we have, and it's not our racecar, it's just our car, and it's how we both get around, unless we're using the metro.
 
#26 ·
Cool.

Hope you get squared away with minimal cost to you out of pocket. Just for reference though, your car doesnt need to be a race car to benefit from an MT82 rebuild at Rev Auto. Granted, they're a performance shop and it will probably take them longer than the dealership to turn your car around, but 10 out of 10 times I would trust Rev Auto's quality of work over that of Koons Silver Spring.
 
#28 ·
Went and spent some time over the internet finding articles and very long threads regarding various transmission issues and sent them her direction. I do experience notchiness. I do experience stayout when shifting at high RPMs, and needing enough effort to shift, that I have in two years of ownership, never tested the 1/4 mile recorder on track apps. Because I know shifts will either be missed, or the transmission won't allow it.

Keeping hopeful here. I am quite thankful that they gave us a little Hyundai Elantra for a loaner.
 
#32 ·
Danielle,

Please make sure to keep updating the thread with developments/resolution. There are a number of us that are local to you (or at least are in the NCR region). If we can be of any help, please let us know.
 
#30 ·
You are aware of why I was banned right?

There was this jerk that had purposely harassing me for a long time because I pissed him off by calling out his antiquated and sexist ways. It got him so fired up that he was banned. That really struck a chord with him. He proceeded to come at me multiple times for a year and a half. He ended up getting banned from TheMustangSource SEVEN times. He still continued to come at me, including death threats. It turns out we live in the same state, and he actually threatened to find me and kill me. The final straw for me, unfortunately was when he started to update his signature daily quoting posts of mine from there and other forums, and I called him on it to knock it off. The admin @ TheMustangSource decided rather than ban him an eighth time, he was going to ban both of us. You know, get rid of the problem causer and the victim.

He was also banned from MustangForums about two weeks before his banning there for...... harassing me, others, and the moderators. But that's not what this thread is about.
 
#31 · (Edited)
I'm honestly not a huge fan on Koons Ford, I used to take my old Taurus to the one in Annapolis (when I lived down there) and they ripped me off. After that I would go to a dealer out of my way until I ditched the car just because I didn't want to deal with them. I'll stick with the smaller family dealership I frequent now.

I hope it all works out for you!
 
#34 ·
Getting clutch replaced under warranty can be very hard NO matter what vehicle it is car, truck, semi believe me I know. Clutch is what I call secondary damage or progressive damage from clutch not releasing right if this what I'm reading. You was having to pump clutch pedal to get it to release.

Then other side they can say you kepted driving the car with a problem. They don't when just when problem started or how long it has been doing this just your word aka grey area. Dealerships do try to get it fixed under warranty because it's win for them and manufacturer. Why they want you back to buy another vehicle. They can use policy money they get from Ford to cover this if you bought car from them. Most won't use policy money on vehicle you didn't buy from them. You can buy the parts take it to them it will piss parts department off LOL.
 
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