Fuel Pump Opinions - Ford Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015 Thread Starter
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Fuel Pump Opinions

Hey guys, just curious what you all have been using for fuel pump upgrades. Anyone have any experience ? Opinions are welcome !


Lots of parts. Still slow
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015
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I guess the real question is, what specs are you requiring?


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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015 Thread Starter
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Beechkid have you dropped in a pump on a '13/14 ?

Lots of parts. Still slow
 
post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015
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Here's the problem: The fuel system on the Coyote maxes out, controlled by the ECM, at 58 psi so, you won't get significant volume increases out of a big pump when the pressure's capped. This is why almost everybody using the stock fuel system uses a boost a pump or similar voltage booster. It's the only way to get more volume with the pressure cap.

2014 Premium GT, SGM, Brembo, Auto, Tech, Comfort, etc. GT500s, Steeda UCA, VMP auto tune, 100 shot on BBR tune, best et: 11.38 at 120.85

2012 GT, Candy Red, Brembo, 3.73, Tech, Comfort, etc. Procal tune, Roush upper, UMI LCAs, Steeda red bracket, GT500s, 28X10X16 Hoosier slicks, best et: 11.91 at 115.23 RIP
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015 Thread Starter
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Here's the problem: The fuel system on the Coyote maxes out, controlled by the ECM, at 58 psi so, you won't get significant volume increases out of a big pump when the pressure's capped. This is why almost everybody using the stock fuel system uses a boost a pump or similar voltage booster. It's the only way to get more volume with the pressure cap.


Oh wow I didn't know that, thank you for the information ! I was wondering why I was having so much trouble finding out what pump everyone has been swapping over too. Guess I will start doing some background research on different brands of voltage boosters.

Lots of parts. Still slow
post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-29-2015
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hmmmm . . . . don't volume and pressure go together; meaning you can't get more volume unless you push it through with more pressure?

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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-30-2015
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Actually volume and pressure are INVERSELY proportional. More pressure, LESS volume. Think of it this way: When you put your thumb over the end of the garden hose, you raise the pressure but cut the volume hugely. This is why you need to raise the VOLTAGE going to the pump, which increases the pump speed and thus, volume for a given pressure.

2014 Premium GT, SGM, Brembo, Auto, Tech, Comfort, etc. GT500s, Steeda UCA, VMP auto tune, 100 shot on BBR tune, best et: 11.38 at 120.85

2012 GT, Candy Red, Brembo, 3.73, Tech, Comfort, etc. Procal tune, Roush upper, UMI LCAs, Steeda red bracket, GT500s, 28X10X16 Hoosier slicks, best et: 11.91 at 115.23 RIP
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-30-2015
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I am trying to reconcile this with basic fluid mechanics / fluid flow. Any system has a given "resistance" to flow. Pressure is the force that makes the fluid move through the system. If the resistance of the system does not change, the only way to get more flow through it, is to increase the push; meaning the pressure.

In your analogy, you made a change to the system: you put your thumb on the end of the hose; increasing the resistance to flow in the system. That change is the reason why the pressure went up and the flow rate went down.

But let's stick with that, just don't change it again: the thumb on the end of the hose is a restriction in the system, that we are trying to push more fluid through. (like the injectors????) If you want to get more water coming out between your thumb and the hose, the only way you can do that is to increase the pressure in the hose. The pump on the other end of the hose has to provide more pressure; and also be able to keep up with the flow rate, or the pressure will go down.

So apparently there is something else going on in our fuel systems, and that is what I am trying to understand. Maybe the fuel pump is delivering fuel to a reservoir, and then the injectors take it from there; the fuel lines are not a significant restriction; and the problem with the stock pump is that it cannot keep up with the needed flow rate; meaning the injectors are pulling fuel from the reservoir faster than the pump can deliver it?

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Last edited by JBert; 07-30-2015 at 11:22 AM.
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-30-2015
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I don't think you quite see how returnless fuel systems work. Returnless fuel systems need constantly controlled max fuel pressure by a regulator, almost like an old mechanical fuel injection system. This regulator speeds up or slows down the fuel pump speed to keep the mandated dead-head pressure constant, whatever the engine demands are. This is why it doesn't matter how big a pump you put on there; the reg will only allow it to make the mandated pressure, then turn the pump down. A big pump might get there on less voltage but, the end result's the same. This is also why, your tuner needs to change the fuel pump strategy when you go to forced induction and why most demand the installation of a boost a pump or similar.

Why every car has returnless today is because it's safer, heats up the fuel less, creates less vapours for the EVAP to manage and is easier on the system itself, overall. If you look at the lines and rails on this system, they are HUGE compared to a old style return system and can support quite alot of power before they become the choke point. This provides all the volume of fuel the injectors need, at the set pressure, provided the pump can manage to maintain the pressure, which it definitely can, N/A. Generally, when someone adds a boost a pump or similar, they just set the system to run at 17 or 18V constant and nobody reports any issues with doing that so, there is quite a bit of headroom in the stock system.
baggyp and [email protected] like this.

2014 Premium GT, SGM, Brembo, Auto, Tech, Comfort, etc. GT500s, Steeda UCA, VMP auto tune, 100 shot on BBR tune, best et: 11.38 at 120.85

2012 GT, Candy Red, Brembo, 3.73, Tech, Comfort, etc. Procal tune, Roush upper, UMI LCAs, Steeda red bracket, GT500s, 28X10X16 Hoosier slicks, best et: 11.91 at 115.23 RIP
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 07-30-2015 Thread Starter
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^ THIS ! Thank you for the information, very in depth Wish I could like it twice.

Lots of parts. Still slow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
^ THIS ! Thank you for the information, very in depth Wish I could like it twice.
I got ya covered on the second like.

Great breakdown!!

I went with a VMP Voltage booster. I like the idea of a constant voltage rather than a spike in voltage that most of the other boost a pumps do...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Beechkid have you dropped in a pump on a '13/14 ?


My question was more based upon, what is it that he needs to meet the demands that the oem pump won't provide................

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