1/4 Mile MPT tune vs. Bama - Page 2 - Ford Mustang Forum
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post #16 of 86 (permalink) Old 09-27-2013 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by AMDanBailer View Post
This is really cool! I always love a good friendly competition. I'm confident that you have two great tunes right now and that the track times are going to be similar. It's hard to compare sometimes because of the time of the run, temperature of the car, traction, shifting etc.. However, I think you should still be able to get some pretty good runs in with both tunes!

If you'd like us to write you another tune that is a little more aggressive and strictly for the track, we can do that for you as well! Just let Don know and he'll definitely get you squared away.

Enjoy your time a the track it's a real blast taking your Mustang down the track! I look forward to seeing the results, let me know if you have any questions or need some assistance.

-Dan
Yup, I contacted you and Shane initially after going to the track with my non-datalogged bama tune when I ran a 13.872. Don's been awesome since then, and the last time I spoke to him I told him that I would let you all know how my car ran with the datalogged tune.

Right now I have no doubt in my mind that bama has the theoretical upper hand here, since they have logs of how my car actually runs and I've been in contact for a while now with my concerns.


Current Mods: 19x8.5 Charcoal AMR Rims, Bama Tune 93H, Airaid CAI, FRPP Sport Axle Backs, FRPP 3.73 gears, Boss/CS/GT500 Rear Diffuser, GT500 Rear Spoiler, GT500 Mud Guards, Raxiom Reverse/License LED Lights, OEM Take off Black Charcoal Leather, GT500 Steering Wheel, Auto Headlights, Chrome 3.7 Badges, Quarter Window Louvers, Dark Matter Tint

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I think quite a few people have posted some sort of results of the tune differences. Myself included. Mine wasnt same night changes. But I had been running Bama tunes for 2 years to a Halo run of 13.883 @100.5. Ordered the MPT tune and with no other changes it dropped down to 13.58 @ 102.5. I suppose same night/same track is what everyone is looking for, but I have 2 years of same track with my Bama tune. 45 passes averaging between 13.9-14.1. 6 passes with MPT averaging 13.6. No seat time improvements. Its an automatic. And i've been geared, tuned, and had an intake since 1200miles (now at 62k) Either tune though has yet to see any DA sub 1000. Maybe I'll try both again in optimal weather.

I also had to go through numerous sessions of datalogging and tune revisions with bama just to average 13.9. MPT got it down to a 13.6 on the first shot. I dont understand why it takes soooo many tune revisions for customers to be satisfied with Bama. I've read on here that people are up to 5,6,7 tune revisions. Yet when they switch to Lund, steeda, or MPT, they get it right within 1 or 2 shots. I got frustrated when I was so far off of the times Bama ran in their project car.


Grabber Blue 2011 V6 Premium A6 Coupe Mods: MPT 93 Tune, FRPP 3.73 Gears, BBK Longtube Headers w/ O/R Xpipe, Steeda CAI, Dynomax 2.5" Ultra Flo Catback, Boss302 STB, J&M LCA, Whiteline Relocation Brackets, Eibach Sportlines, 18x9/10 '10 GT500 rims 255/45, 285/40/18 Nitto555 Next: BBK 73mm TB, Ported Intake Manifold, DSS Al Driveshaft, . Styling: 15% Tint, Black Spoiler, Decklid Panel, & Grille Surround. Chin Spoiler, Hood Spears

Best to Date - 13.212 @ 105.79 - Uncorrected
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My bama race tune has random shift issues.. Like i will come to a stop and the car never shifts from 3rd-1st. So I start out in 3rd gear then it quickly lunges and shifts 3-2-1 really quick. It doesnt do it on any of my other bama tunes, Not to mention the performance and shifting is bad on all of them. This is the second set I got from them. I just ordered my MPT tune last night as im not going to sit here and datalog and email back and forth. You shouldn't have to get new tunes from a company because they screw up the first one. It should be because you added new things to the car that require a tune. Sorry Bama but you lost me as a customer.

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You guys are talking some serious stuff about these MPT Tunes. If I hear that you lost .3sec on the MPT on the same track same night I'll order mine tomorrow!

I have been right on target with my Bama tune according to their project builds. I ran a 14.1 (stock) my first go, tuned it then ran a 13.7 (stock, Race tune). That's .4 off and a big difference for daily driving.

Just an FYI, I do a lot of logging of my statistics when I race, and note all changes in weather, temp, DA, launch, tirespin etc; and one thing I noted was that resetting your quick shift never made a difference for me (less than .1) but running back to back made a big difference (.1 for every run). So ahead of all else make sure your engine temps are the same for the runs.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureSound View Post
You guys are talking some serious stuff about these MPT Tunes. If I hear that you lost .3sec on the MPT on the same track same night I'll order mine tomorrow!

I have been right on target with my Bama tune according to their project builds. I ran a 14.1 (stock) my first go, tuned it then ran a 13.7 (stock, Race tune). That's .4 off and a big difference for daily driving.

Just an FYI, I do a lot of logging of my statistics when I race, and note all changes in weather, temp, DA, launch, tirespin etc; and one thing I noted was that resetting your quick shift never made a difference for me (less than .1) but running back to back made a big difference (.1 for every run). So ahead of all else make sure your engine temps are the same for the runs.
It only helps to have the trans fluid and gear oil warmed up too. That's, likely, another thing helping when hot lapping.
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on my last good day out with the v6 I was running consistent 13.6-13.7's.... I took about an hour break, then I added a gallon of 100 to a little more than an 1/8th of a tank. I ran 13.5's the rest of the night.... on my Bama tune. Just another variable to throw into the mix for ya....
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post #22 of 86 (permalink) Old 09-27-2013 Thread Starter
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Guys, this isn't a thread that should be about bashing one company over the other, so I'd appreciate if we only made mention of the technical aspects. The point is to get the same night information out there and eliminate as many variables as possible. If I did bama one night, then MPT another night, there are a ton of differences that could happen between the days. I'm trying to eliminate DA, temp, track prep, mileage, and driver disposition when comparing these tunes to really get down to the nitty gritty. If I can swap a tune and move .3-.4 seconds off my 1/4 mile, that REALLY says something about the tune itself. Any mods or skill that you guys have that can get better times than me is icing on the cake. I really only care about the difference between the tunes.

The results of this test can only be positive for either company. If bama wins, then it shows that datalogging and contacting the tuner really pays off! If MPT wins, then perhaps bama will try a different approach to tuning our cars that will make the real performance enthusiasts happy, while still maintaining their loyalty.

Either way, I plan on having a phase two of this experiment. I will give both bama and MPT some datalogs of their tunes and see what they can do. Then, I will put them on 100% equal footing and track them same day once more after both tuners had a chance to review datalogs again. If MPT scores a huge advantage without DL's, I can't even imagine how it would run WITH datalogs. We will see.

Current Mods: 19x8.5 Charcoal AMR Rims, Bama Tune 93H, Airaid CAI, FRPP Sport Axle Backs, FRPP 3.73 gears, Boss/CS/GT500 Rear Diffuser, GT500 Rear Spoiler, GT500 Mud Guards, Raxiom Reverse/License LED Lights, OEM Take off Black Charcoal Leather, GT500 Steering Wheel, Auto Headlights, Chrome 3.7 Badges, Quarter Window Louvers, Dark Matter Tint

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasinedward View Post
on my last good day out with the v6 I was running consistent 13.6-13.7's.... I took about an hour break, then I added a gallon of 100 to a little more than an 1/8th of a tank. I ran 13.5's the rest of the night.... on my Bama tune. Just another variable to throw into the mix for ya....
I agree. I wouldn't know where the benefit would stop as in what overall octane number. There's a point on engines where more advance will not make any more power due to negative work from the crank angle peak pressure will arrive (too soon). The pcm does adapt at WOT and does try to advance timing. So, it's possible, like stock, to make more power up to the programmed limit in the pcm using higher octane fuel. That's my basic understanding from speaking with a pro racer package self tuner to get some insight.
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My Bama and MPT tunes were based on the same datalog. MPT is a brute comparatively.

I've noticed that even with traction control on I get a lot more rear end wiggle than I'd like from a standing launch. Yesterday I was afraid I'd swing out sideways but she held it together despite breaking traction and doing the booty shake.

I barely got any side-to-side movement from Bama with traction control on, though I did get some slippage if I launched from idle to 2K RPM, and I'd get a burnout if 3K or higher. MPT roasts the tires much more easily.

All these things are clear indicators to me that the TQ is where it needs to be, at least for how I like to drive.

One thing I'll note: because of a custom side-pipe design I fabricated, my car is approximately 60 lbs lighter than stock in the arse end. I know this contributes. Even so, Bama did not shake up the rear the way MPT does. It also didn't cause straight line slippage (tires breaking loose, almost like they did before the Steeda LCA's) like MPT does.

I suspect that if I were to 1/4 mile the car in its current configuration, I'd probably lose time in the 60ft because of the enhanced traction loss I'm experiencing with these Pirellis. But if I were to get the arse end nailed down again, I've very little doubt I'd knock time off the clock.

But...this isn't about me.

May the competition begin!
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One more thing: aside from Steeda LCA's my suspension is still 100% factory with around 54K miles on it. Another contributing factor to the slippage. The squirrelly sliding back and forth in first with traction control is occurring from a dead stop, with this behaviour kicking in when I get to about 1/2 throttle. I just need more tire and suspension upgrades.
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I thought my Nero zeros were good until I switched to MPT lol. I have a full eibach prokit suspension plus LCAs etc.
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I thought Bama was the most conservative of the tuners, favoring longevity over raw numbers and a lot of people are happy with that. I'd be curious to hear what MPT owners see after multiple thousands of DD miles. Are the MPT tunes more "streetable" than Bama's?
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Is a 5.0 less street able than a 3.7?

I have almost 8,000 miles on my MPT tune. No issues to speak of. Car drives like a dream. My car is a heavy use DD.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uh-oh View Post
I thought Bama was the most conservative of the tuners, favoring longevity over raw numbers and a lot of people are happy with that. I'd be curious to hear what MPT owners see after multiple thousands of DD miles. Are the MPT tunes more "streetable" than Bama's?
Not sure what you mean by more "streetable." If you mean more street race worthy, then yes. Very well suited for that. If you mean easier to putt around in, then no. MPT doesn't like to be grannied.

I imagine if there were a sudden wave of people getting Steeda and Lund tunes we'd see the same questions, concerns and levels of scrutiny. It comes with the territory. We all want to see someone build a better mouse trap and when they do, we question whether it really catches mice. That's just how it goes.

I reckon we'll find out whether my mice will explode in their little cages several thousand miles from now. Only time will tell.
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Bama allowed the tweaking on your tune? Honestly, I haven't checked for it since switching to SCT from Diablo.

I noticed JLP did leave the basic params to tweak. Only non basic is global spark which could be dangerous in the wrong hands, lol. That adds spark "everywhere", even at all part throttle loads/conditions.
Yup they are not the canned DiabloSport Intune tunes on the front page... they are under the "custom tunes" button... This is my first set of tunes emailed to me from Bama that I had to add to the tuner (which required removing the prior custom tunes before I could load them) Maybe it was a mistake and I just got lucky? Not sure but I am very happy that I can adjust things :yelpleased:

BTW I have global and 2 different RPM ranges for adjusting spark advance; cam timing, fuel mix... (not that I am silly enough to go mess around there without being on a dyno and monitoring closely)


Oxford White 2015 Premium GT with 50-Year Pkg | 3.55 Gears | Roush CAI (105mm Velocity tube) | Stainless Works Headers (Jet-Hot ceramic coated), high flow cats, H-Pipe CatBack full 3" with 4" tips| BAMA V2 93 Octane Tune | Baer EradiSpeed-Plus 2-Piece Rotors | JLT 3.0 Oil Separators | FRPP M-20201-M STB | Silver PP Wheels 19x9, 19x9.5 | NITTO G2 255-40-19, 275-40-19 Tires | J&M Jacking Rails & Subframe Alignment Kit | Steeda Subframe Connectors & Bushing Supports | BMR Front Subframe Brace | Cervinis 1232 Functional Ram Air hood | Ford Performance door sills | White Madness Garage Chrome Shifter | Diode Dynamics interior LED conversion stage 1 & XP80 reverse light | 3M Dark Ceramic Tint (25% sides/20% rear) | Lloyds "50 Years" floor and trunk mats...

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