Harmonic balancer marks off?? - Ford Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-13-2017 Thread Starter
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Harmonic balancer marks off??

This is a on a 85 volvo 240 wagon with a 302 HO swapped in by the previous owner....


Quick and stupid question regarding the mark on the harmonic balancer. This might be engines 101 truthfully. On the 302 im working on which is a 5.0 HO motor.
I did the heads and pulled the distributor. The previous owner was messing around with the timing so I figured start from scratch. When going to TDC on compression stroke I noticed that the notch on the harmonic balancer was off by about 3 inches from the timing pointer mark give or take. Both valves were shut as the valve cover was off and I stuck a screwdriver in the cylinder to verify it was at TDC after checking it for the compression stroke.

Now im not super close to starting this thing up as I need a few more parts. However if the harmonic balancer's ring has shifted then im potentially dealing with
excessive motor vibration's.

Im wondering am I over thinking this mark or is there a legit issue?


88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe-P.I.M.P stand alone ECU, 3" DP, Walbro 255 HP..never ending project
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post #2 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-14-2017
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianb View Post
This is a on a 85 volvo 240 wagon with a 302 HO swapped in by the previous owner....


Quick and stupid question regarding the mark on the harmonic balancer. This might be engines 101 truthfully. On the 302 im working on which is a 5.0 HO motor.
I did the heads and pulled the distributor. The previous owner was messing around with the timing so I figured start from scratch. When going to TDC on compression stroke I noticed that the notch on the harmonic balancer was off by about 3 inches from the timing pointer mark give or take. Both valves were shut as the valve cover was off and I stuck a screwdriver in the cylinder to verify it was at TDC after checking it for the compression stroke.

Now im not super close to starting this thing up as I need a few more parts. However if the harmonic balancer's ring has shifted then im potentially dealing with
excessive motor vibration's.

Im wondering am I over thinking this mark or is there a legit issue?
I think that this happened to me. The car was backfiring pretty bad when I got it and I think that is what what did it. The woodruff key on the harmonic balancer was chewed up and I didnt need to use a puller to pull the balancer, it fell off in my hand. Needless to say, I have the engine in the shop right now getting a stroker kit. I didnt really have a choice with the crank being chewed up. It was not obvious because the rubber in the balancer did not look bad and it was not coming out very much, but I do think that it spun and the timing marks were off...

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post #3 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-14-2017 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dustin2100 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianb View Post
This is a on a 85 volvo 240 wagon with a 302 HO swapped in by the previous owner....


Quick and stupid question regarding the mark on the harmonic balancer. This might be engines 101 truthfully. On the 302 im working on which is a 5.0 HO motor.
I did the heads and pulled the distributor. The previous owner was messing around with the timing so I figured start from scratch. When going to TDC on compression stroke I noticed that the notch on the harmonic balancer was off by about 3 inches from the timing pointer mark give or take. Both valves were shut as the valve cover was off and I stuck a screwdriver in the cylinder to verify it was at TDC after checking it for the compression stroke.

Now im not super close to starting this thing up as I need a few more parts. However if the harmonic balancer's ring has shifted then im potentially dealing with
excessive motor vibration's.

Im wondering am I over thinking this mark or is there a legit issue?
I think that this happened to me. The car was backfiring pretty bad when I got it and I think that is what what did it. The woodruff key on the harmonic balancer was chewed up and I didnt need to use a puller to pull the balancer, it fell off in my hand. Needless to say, I have the engine in the shop right now getting a stroker kit. I didnt really have a choice with the crank being chewed up. It was not obvious because the rubber in the balancer did not look bad and it was not coming out very much, but I do think that it spun and the timing marks were off...
You bring out a great point especially considering there was a stuck valve. Maybe that somehow contributed to sheared key maybe when cranking over by hand. I'm praying the crank is in okay shape as yanking the motor for a rebuild is not quite in the budget this month.

Looks like the balancer is coming off this weekend.

88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe-P.I.M.P stand alone ECU, 3" DP, Walbro 255 HP..never ending project
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post #4 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-14-2017
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianb View Post
When going to TDC on compression stroke I noticed that the notch on the harmonic balancer was off by about 3 inches from the timing pointer mark give or take.
You might wanna take a closer look at the balancer because the notch youre referring to,cut into the balancer, is NOT the TDC mark (on a oem or oem replacement balancer) The part of the balancer where it gets thinner is where the timing marks are located.The notch is cut into the thicker portion of the balancer.If you view the pictures below,you can see the timing marks stamped into the balancer.

atdc 10 0 10 btdc


When youve got the number 1 piston at tdc on the compression stroke,the balancer mark with the number "0" should be aligned with the timing pointer.Once youve got the crank in that position,with the 0 mark aligned with the pointer,drop the distributer in the block so that the rotor is pointing to the number 1 position on the distributer cap.If youve got the efi system with the upper and lower intake vs a carbed setup,the rotor should be pointed slightly to the left of center/between the front 2 upper intake bolts.
( It should look identical to the rotor position shown in the 3rd picture at the bottom) if youve got the distributer indexed (dropped in the block with the distributer base fully seated)
correctly.
Once youve got the distributer indexed correctly,youll have to start the engine,pull the spout plug (attached to the ignition module wiring harness) ,rotate the distributer til the 10 btdc mark is aligned with the timing pointer,tighten the distributor bolt then reinstall the spout plug.If you fail to remove the spout plug,before adjusting the distributer,the timing will be way too retarded because the computer automatically advances timing another 10 once you plug the spout plug back in.Timing will be retarded by 10,if you fail to remove the spout plug beforehand,which means,instead of it being at 20,which is where the timing runs with your initial setting of 10 plus the 10 of advance added by the computer,it'll be at 10 instead,so youll lose power in all ranges.

The 3rd picture shown below is the direction the rotor should be pointed towards while the 0 mark is still aligned with the timing pointer and the distributer is seated completely (bottomed out on the block surface) with the rotor pointed towards the #1 position on the cap.

The following link details the distributor indexing & timing procedure,if the instructions above are not clear enough.Once you click on the link and the page opens,scroll down to post #2 & #3.Ignore post #1,its used for replacing the pip sensor.
Good luck on the project.



TFI PIP Sensor Replacement Procedure
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my89foxbody likes this.

1991 Mustang lx
D.S.S. 342ci {10.5:1}
TFS 190cc + track heat
Lunati 61011 .549".565"
Pro-M 76mm maf
Jetronic 30lb inj
QA1 Coilovers
17" Weld ProStar XP's

Last edited by wbrockstar; 09-15-2017 at 12:23 PM.
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post #5 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-14-2017
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I put white paint in my marks and then wiped off the excess so it only stayed in the marks. It made them much easier to read with a timing light.
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post #6 of 6 (permalink) Old 09-15-2017
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 85_Ranger4x4 View Post
I put white paint in my marks and then wiped off the excess so it only stayed in the marks. It made them much easier to read with a timing light.
Good idea.Theyre not as bulky compared to not wiping the excess off.Much cleaner line than my method.

1991 Mustang lx
D.S.S. 342ci {10.5:1}
TFS 190cc + track heat
Lunati 61011 .549".565"
Pro-M 76mm maf
Jetronic 30lb inj
QA1 Coilovers
17" Weld ProStar XP's
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