Removing EGR valve - Ford Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019 Thread Starter
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Removing EGR valve

Hi Guys,

1995 GT 5.0

In the process of going with an X pipe without cats.
What should I do with the EGR valve? I removed the tube, but what should I do near the engine? Just plug the hole?
Will that give me a check engine?

Cheers

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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019
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I guess the question is why?

1. Removing the cats will really not gain much power.
2. Even though you are exempt from inspections, you are not exempt from therequirement to have them- even US Fish & Game Wardens carry a manual thatidentifies each vehicle and the required smog equipment, illegal engineschanges, etc with pics of how to ID.
3. Any law enforcement officer (including fish & game), EPA inspector, etc.can impound the vehicle and cite it as a gross polluter
4. Once cited, a judge will decide if the vehicle is to be scrapped or returnedto the owner- and you do not have any opportunity to speak in court- justrequired to sit & listen.
5. If the vehicle is returned- guess what, now you have to repair and take thevehicle to a federal referee station for the rest of "its life" for asmog inspection & test.

IMHO, it's not worth the risk versus the little gain.

Here's a link to a "Real Test" that verifies....on a 700+ hpengine......no gain or loss of with or without the cats!

http://www.kennebell.net/KBWebsite/Common/pdfs/header_cat_xpipe_exhaust_tests.pdf


Under federal regs………up to $2,500 for modifying any emissioncontrol device….and lets face it, for the few hp (if any) you will gain byswitching to “high Flow Cats”, that $2,500 can buy a lot of real performance! Straight from the EPA's page and the Federal law trumps statelaws, it might pass or you may not even have emissions testing but ever get a cop with “wanting a reason” forpulling you over.


Let's talk about the X pipe for a minute....




An X-pipe will increase HP if itis installed at the "area of confusion"- but that area is identifiedby painting a small strip on the exhaust pipes about 1/2 way between the engineand the axle- the area of confusion will cause increased heat and blister/burnthe paint at that location- that's where the H or X pipe would be installed-and eliminates the air flow disturbance by sending alternating pulses in thatlocation which acts as a "vacuum" if you will to push & scavengethe remaining and incoming air out.

Now let me talk just for a minuteof the issue of defeating the downstream O2 sensors- is just well, not smart! Letme explain to you...


Production calibrations have an “inferredcatalyst temperature protection model” which constantly calculatesthe temperature in the hottest part of the hottest catalyst. This calculatedtemperature is based on many PCM parameters, such asengine speed, load, ingested air mass, time, inlet air temperature, EGR flowrate and many others.When the catalyst model calculates that the catalysttemperature is about to exceed a level that is safe for the catalyst (generallyaround 1650 deg F), the PCM will richen the A/F mixture as necessary to lowerthe exhaust gas temperature and cool the catalyst. This richened A/F ratio willdecrease power output, but is absolutely necessary to keep the catalyst frombeing permanently damaged and without the downstream sensors, the PCM caneasily, consistently and once too many times over or under richen the A/Fmix...making what a software engineer would call, "An erroneous conclusion"...


Ya see, there is also a"model" for oxygen sensor protection and exhaust valve protection that when not takeninto account can cause internal damage to both the exhaust valves (causing"Tuliping over time- resulting in catestrophic engine damage any machinistcan explain this to you) and remaining O2 sensors....and yes, this does pull HPaway from the engine only for component safeguarding.
None of this happensimmediately.......but the damage is very expensive.


As far as the EGR valve goes, it has no impact on performance, MPG, etc.







:hello:
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019 Thread Starter
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The only reason I am removing the cats is that there is a rattling in one of them. I think a piece has broken lousse.
I am removing them so they don't plug.
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019 Thread Starter
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And I have a 95 which is OBD1, so it only has 2 O2 sensors, none located after the cats. SO I don't have a downstream O2 sensor. The car computer should not see any difference.
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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steevensi View Post
And I have a 95 which is OBD1, so it only has 2 O2 sensors, none located after the cats. SO I don't have a downstream O2 sensor. The car computer should not see any difference.
You’ll get a check engine light with the egr unplugged. I’d just leave the EGR intact if it’s working. I had an o/r x on my ‘90 and the egr was left alone. No harm no foul.
My ‘95 GT’s EGR was turned off and it has cats. They haven’t burned up thus far.
I’d get the X pipe in and run with it. Ignore the egr.
*Edit*
You removed the tube from the header? Put it back on. If you want to delete it you’ll have to get a plate to block off the egr, unhook and plug the vac line, and unplug the electric plug in. Google egr delete plates. At the end of the day though you wouldn’t gain anything from the delete and you’ll be riding around with a check engine light.
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2019 Thread Starter
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The tube is gone since I had nothing to plug it into.
The plugs for it were in the cats.

Any way to make the CEL disapear?
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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steevensi View Post
The tube is gone since I had nothing to plug it into.
The plugs for it were in the cats.

Any way to make the CEL disapear?
I thought you were talking about the EGR tube on the header.
You'll need an SCT chip/tune to disable the light I'm afraid.
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2019
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I found this about deleting the EGR and eliminating the CEL. https://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...delete.850404/
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-10-2019
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Are you talking about the smog pump? The one that is driven by the belt and pumps air into the cats, or the EGR valve? Because now that I think about it, I can’t think how the egr realates to the cats. On the 94/95 the EGR is hooked to the intake and the header via that funky looking tube attached to it. It’s not tied into that cats if memeory serves.
If you’re talking smog pump, I’d leave it intact too. It doesn’t weigh that much and you won’t notice any increase in performance without it. I don’t believe you’ll get a check engine light without it though.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 90lxwhite View Post
Are you talking about the smog pump? The one that is driven by the belt and pumps air into the cats, or the EGR valve? Because now that I think about it, I can’t think how the egr realates to the cats. On the 94/95 the EGR is hooked to the intake and the header via that funky looking tube attached to it. It’s not tied into that cats if memeory serves.
If you’re talking smog pump, I’d leave it intact too. It doesn’t weigh that much and you won’t notice any increase in performance without it. I don’t believe you’ll get a check engine light without it though.

It kinda sounds like it doesn't it,about him possibly referring to the tube with the check valve that runs down to the airtube on the h/xpipe??

91 LX 342ci (10.5:1)
TFS 190cc (stage ll)
GT40 (tubular) intake
Lunati 61011(.549"/.565")
QA1 Coilovers
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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 07-11-2019 Thread Starter
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I'm talking about the tube that goes under the car and connects into the 2 cats.

This is not the tube connecting to the ERG valve??
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Smog pump. Leave it hooked up on the engine side and just let it pump air into the air. It'll be ok.
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This diagram should clear things up for you.
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Name:	Thermactor Air System 65%.GIF
Views:	13
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ID:	610609  

91 LX 342ci (10.5:1)
TFS 190cc (stage ll)
GT40 (tubular) intake
Lunati 61011(.549"/.565")
QA1 Coilovers
Weld ProStar XP's
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If you wanna get rid of the thermactor system, but you don't wanna remove any of its components,you can use the following diagram and a 89.5" belt (if youve got stock pulleys) & bypass the smog pump pulley altogether.Cobras, & GT's with underdrive pulleys,may require a different length belt.If you don't wanna buy a new belt,you can remove the vacuum hose at the tab (bypass) valve and plug the hose.This will cut the vacuum supply to the valve,which will dump smog pump air to the atmosphere via silencer ports in the valve.You can also use the method 90lxwhite mentioned in post #12
(i.e.- let the air blow out of the tad,diverter valve) Im not sure if the air coming out of the diverter valve will make any hissing noises or not?? Dumping the air out of the tab silencer ports will NOT.....
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Name:	Smog_pump_delete.JPG
Views:	9
Size:	15.5 KB
ID:	610619  

91 LX 342ci (10.5:1)
TFS 190cc (stage ll)
GT40 (tubular) intake
Lunati 61011(.549"/.565")
QA1 Coilovers
Weld ProStar XP's

Last edited by wbrockstar; 07-11-2019 at 10:52 PM.
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AHSkIRYJI4M

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