Wieght gain a big negative? - Page 5 - Ford Mustang Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Apprentice
 
akwal07's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: milpitas
Posts: 104
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radioguy View Post
And it looks like the Camaro designers "get it." Stiffer and lighter.....sounds like the right formula!
2016 Chevrolet Camaro Spied with Far Less Camouflage – News – Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog
if the camaro loses weight, gains power, and keeps a similar look to the current model...what chance does the s550 even have? europeans deciding to buy it at a premium to have a novelty car, which they dont have the money to put fuel in? Because tell me how many brits and germans with money for a sports car and gas that are going to choose a mustang over m3/m4?

I really don't think that ford thought this through. I think the majority of people who like the design also like german or asian cars and still wont crossover to mustang.

akwal07 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Apprentice
 
14MustangV6's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Location: Essex County
Posts: 154
 
To be fair, I would be pretty shocked if Ford didn't leave plenty on the table knowing that a new Camaro is coming soon. I don't think we'll see a 100 horsepower increase like we did with the 5.0, but I'm sure there will be significant improvements in the years to come.


Current: 2014 V6 Mustang Premium, Automatic Transmission, Oxford White, Safety & Security Package.

Previous: 2006 Chevrolet Cobalt LS, bone-stock except for automatic transmission.
14MustangV6 is offline  
Rookie
 
Hamidar05's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2014
Location: Castle Rock
Posts: 13
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by akwal07 View Post
if the camaro loses weight, gains power, and keeps a similar look to the current model...what chance does the s550 even have? europeans deciding to buy it at a premium to have a novelty car, which they dont have the money to put fuel in? Because tell me how many brits and germans with money for a sports car and gas that are going to choose a mustang over m3/m4?

I really don't think that ford thought this through. I think the majority of people who like the design also like german or asian cars and still wont crossover to mustang.
Thanks for posting.. FORD is hosed
Hamidar05 is offline  
 
Apprentice
 
akwal07's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: milpitas
Posts: 104
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamidar05 View Post
Thanks for posting.. FORD is hosed
My uncle came over from England and thought my car 11stang was bumblebee....that's about how much Europeans care about mustangs
akwal07 is offline  
Apprentice
 
KC3333's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Location: midwest
Posts: 246
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexArmageddon View Post
Whatcha talkin bout willis.. That has Scion TC all over it..

lol. I just the Camaro shouldn't be exempt from the same attack.


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

2012 Boss Yellow Blaze, Recaros/Torsen, Cover/Mats
2012 MCA PP Sterling/Lava
KC3333 is offline  
Rookie
 
TexArmageddon's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Dallas
Posts: 34
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by akwal07 View Post
if the camaro loses weight, gains power, and keeps a similar look to the current model...what chance does the s550 even have? europeans deciding to buy it at a premium to have a novelty car, which they dont have the money to put fuel in? Because tell me how many brits and germans with money for a sports car and gas that are going to choose a mustang over m3/m4?

I really don't think that ford thought this through. I think the majority of people who like the design also like german or asian cars and still wont crossover to mustang.
Lol.. You know what.. I'm sure everyone said the same thing about my beloved SN-95.. Gained weight, Looked ugly, and not much more power... Camaro has it in the bag.. Flopped and disappeared for a number of years.

For the record, I find the 05-09 Mustangs to be some the ugliest mustangs to date. 10-12 have the best front ends, but horrible looking rear ends. 13-14 have the best rear ends, but ugly fronts.

End of the day.. if the 2015 mustang surpasses the Camaro throughout the Year of it's release.. I highly doubt the 2016 Camaro will surpass it with similar Design cues.. Everyone has an opinion on what looks good and what doesn't..
Yet, we all know the s197 isn't gonna beat the Camaro in sales. hence making another Retro theme stang is out the question.
TexArmageddon is offline  
GT Member
 
Radioguy's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Saint Louis
Posts: 1,569
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexArmageddon View Post
Lol.. You know what.. I'm sure everyone said the same thing about my beloved SN-95.. Gained weight, Looked ugly, and not much more power... Camaro has it in the bag.. Flopped and disappeared for a number of years.

For the record, I find the 05-09 Mustangs to be some the ugliest mustangs to date. 10-12 have the best front ends, but horrible looking rear ends. 13-14 have the best rear ends, but ugly fronts.

End of the day.. if the 2015 mustang surpasses the Camaro throughout the Year of it's release.. I highly doubt the 2016 Camaro will surpass it with similar Design cues.. Everyone has an opinion on what looks good and what doesn't..
Yet, we all know the s197 isn't gonna beat the Camaro in sales. hence making another Retro theme stang is out the question.
If only it was so simple Many people forget that the V6 Mustang out sells the Coyote by 2 to 1 in the USA. The "Mustang market" is actually many different markets (Which still includes many secretaries). Some of those market groups really want a "great interior" with first class electronics and driving features. Many buyers are looking for a car that "stands out" in a crowd of cars. And others really want a "good value" car - price and functionality. Many of those groups don't "haunt" this board. I think the last group will be disappointed with the new Mustang. The price has seriously escalated in the last 5 years - over inflation - and particularly when it comes to the cost of new functionality. It would be very hard to say whether it was exterior style, interior quality, available electronics and features or price escalation that has hurt Mustang sales in the last five years. Only time will tell how these markets respond to the new "Mustang formula."

2013 Mustang GT Premium Convertible
Candy Apple Red, Auto, FRPP Tune, GT500 Axlebacks, KONI Yellow Sport (adjustable dampers), FRPP Front and Rear swaybars, Custom Removable 4 Point Roll-Bar, BOSS 302 Low Expansion Brake Lines, Roush side splitters, GT500 spoiler, Redline Tuning hood struts,18" Ford Chromed Aluminum Wheels (9R3Z-1K007-A), Michelin Pilot Super Sports - 235X50X18
2011 Mustang V6 Premium Convertible - Gone
Radioguy is offline  
Rookie
 
TexArmageddon's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Dallas
Posts: 34
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radioguy View Post
If only it was so simple Many people forget that the V6 Mustang out sells the Coyote by 2 to 1 in the USA. The "Mustang market" is actually many different markets (Which still includes many secretaries). Some of those market groups really want a "great interior" with first class electronics and driving features. Many buyers are looking for a car that "stands out" in a crowd of cars. And others really want a "good value" car - price and functionality. Many of those groups don't "haunt" this board. I think the last group will be disappointed with the new Mustang. The price has seriously escalated in the last 5 years - over inflation - and particularly when it comes to the cost of new functionality. It would be very hard to say whether it was exterior style, interior quality, available electronics and features or price escalation that has hurt Mustang sales in the last five years. Only time will tell how these markets respond to the new "Mustang formula."
Not really sure what you're trying to get at here, but my comment was mostly just pointing out monthly sales figures alone. I don't think too many people would Deny the Mustang had better interior than the Camaro. Yet, it still sold better by a large margin. Likewise, performance was similar, but the Camaro still sold better. Lastly, the mustang was Cheaper, but the Camaro still sold better.

Looking at those alone.. It's pretty easy to narrow down why you can't beat your competitor.

A.) The general public wants something other than the mustang since it was sales leader from 03-08 with no real competition. So to set themselves apart they wanted something different from it.

B.) The mustang was just uglier than the Camaro and Didn't have IRS to boot.
TexArmageddon is offline  
GT Member
 
Radioguy's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Saint Louis
Posts: 1,569
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radioguy View Post
If only it was so simple Many people forget that the V6 Mustang out sells the Coyote by 2 to 1 in the USA. The "Mustang market" is actually many different markets (Which still includes many secretaries). Some of those market groups really want a "great interior" with first class electronics and driving features. Many buyers are looking for a car that "stands out" in a crowd of cars. And others really want a "good value" car - price and functionality. Many of those groups don't "haunt" this board. I think the last group will be disappointed with the new Mustang. The price has seriously escalated in the last 5 years - over inflation - and particularly when it comes to the cost of new functionality. It would be very hard to say whether it was exterior style, interior quality, available electronics and features or price escalation that has hurt Mustang sales in the last five years. Only time will tell how these markets respond to the new "Mustang formula."
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexArmageddon View Post
Not really sure what you're trying to get at here, but my comment was mostly just pointing out monthly sales figures alone. I don't think too many people would Deny the Mustang had better interior than the Camaro. Yet, it still sold better by a large margin. Likewise, performance was similar, but the Camaro still sold better. Lastly, the mustang was Cheaper, but the Camaro still sold better.
Actually, independent comparisons come out a little different then yours AutoTrader says:
"While the Mustang is slightly cheaper than the Camaro at $23,500 compared to the Chevy's $24,500 base price, the Camaro has an advantage in nearly every category. It has more power and it includes standard free maintenance. It offers better safety and more technology. And it's newly updated for 2014 with a new look that helps to set it apart from its Ford rival. As a result, we think the Camaro is a slightly better value, at least for now."
2014 Ford Mustang vs. 2014 Chevrolet Camaro: Which Is Better? - AutoTrader.com

Additionally, Kelley Blue Book says the cost of the Mustang is marginally higher then the Camaro at the market purchase price and the 5 year cost..... So, many of the "sub markets" may well see the Camaro as a "better buy" then the Mustang. We will see what happens with the 2015 Mustang formula and the market(s)
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	c1.JPG
Views:	122
Size:	51.0 KB
ID:	385097   Click image for larger version

Name:	C3.JPG
Views:	137
Size:	68.3 KB
ID:	385105  

2013 Mustang GT Premium Convertible
Candy Apple Red, Auto, FRPP Tune, GT500 Axlebacks, KONI Yellow Sport (adjustable dampers), FRPP Front and Rear swaybars, Custom Removable 4 Point Roll-Bar, BOSS 302 Low Expansion Brake Lines, Roush side splitters, GT500 spoiler, Redline Tuning hood struts,18" Ford Chromed Aluminum Wheels (9R3Z-1K007-A), Michelin Pilot Super Sports - 235X50X18
2011 Mustang V6 Premium Convertible - Gone
Radioguy is offline  
Apprentice
 
14MustangV6's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Location: Essex County
Posts: 154
 
Basically every section of that Autotrader article ended in a draw (or at least with them saying the two cars were "similar"), and then all of a sudden at the end the Camaro is better in every category?

For example, power/performance are deemed a "draw" in the Performance and Fuel Economy section, yet power is cited as a reason why the Camaro is better value. That doesn't make any sense. To me, equal performance should favour the Mustang's better fuel economy, but apparently not in this case.

Current: 2014 V6 Mustang Premium, Automatic Transmission, Oxford White, Safety & Security Package.

Previous: 2006 Chevrolet Cobalt LS, bone-stock except for automatic transmission.
14MustangV6 is offline  
PONY Member
 
blkandgud's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Woodbridge
Posts: 813
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexArmageddon View Post
Not really sure what you're trying to get at here, but my comment was mostly just pointing out monthly sales figures alone. I don't think too many people would Deny the Mustang had better interior than the Camaro. Yet, it still sold better by a large margin. Likewise, performance was similar, but the Camaro still sold better. Lastly, the mustang was Cheaper, but the Camaro still sold better.

Looking at those alone.. It's pretty easy to narrow down why you can't beat your competitor.

A.) The general public wants something other than the mustang since it was sales leader from 03-08 with no real competition. So to set themselves apart they wanted something different from it.

B.) The mustang was just uglier than the Camaro and Didn't have IRS to boot.

I think your A and B hit it on the head why the Camaro sold more. But, don't think the general public care about the IRS thing...most people don't know the difference between IRA and SRA.

Also, the Camaro was all over the new Transformer movies. That definitely helped its appeal too.

2012 Mustang GT Premium
BLACK on BLACK 401A. A6, HIDs, Security, Rear Camera+Reverse Sensing, Remote Start, Comfort.
-Roush Axle-backs
(Planning on CAI/Tune then I'll be good)
blkandgud is offline  
PONY Member
 
3.8LMustangV6's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: Yorba Linda
Posts: 391
 
I don't think anyone here understands.
Ford can careless about the Camaro, it isn't trying to compete with or as a pony car anymore. I don't think they ever did tbh. There is a reason why Mustang is 50 years running and all the other muscle cars didn't and that is the ability to adapt and constantly attract new audiences.
They turned the Mustang into a legit sports car that handles very well.
I've sat inside both the 2010+ Maro and the 2010+ Challenger/Charger both interiors inferior to the Mustangs now with a complete redesign of the interior, the Stang is by far the nicer car inside and out.

Yeah it sucks Ford's intentions for the SN-95 were to build a straight line performer (without regard to interior) with a v8 at an affordable price same for the beginning to mid s197, but it's clear where they are trying to go/do.

I mean look at what they are doing with the Shelby a 600hp high revving naturally aspirater V8 that handles WELL. Who else builds those kind of cars? Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche.
They clearly want more respect from European countries.

It's like Ford saying it's a new "me" I guess.
I like it, I want the new 5.0.

2001 Mustang V6 4-speed Automatic: Sold
2003 Mustang GT 5-Speed Manual: Current
Appearance Modifications: None Yet
Performance Modifications: None Yet
3.8LMustangV6 is offline  
Rookie
 
TexArmageddon's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Dallas
Posts: 34
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3.8LMustangV6 View Post
I don't think anyone here understands.
Ford can careless about the Camaro, it isn't trying to compete with or as a pony car anymore. I don't think they ever did tbh. There is a reason why Mustang is 50 years running and all the other muscle cars didn't and that is the ability to adapt and constantly attract new audiences.
They turned the Mustang into a legit sports car that handles very well.
I've sat inside both the 2010+ Maro and the 2010+ Challenger/Charger both interiors inferior to the Mustangs now with a complete redesign of the interior, the Stang is by far the nicer car inside and out.

Yeah it sucks Ford's intentions for the SN-95 were to build a straight line performer (without regard to interior) with a v8 at an affordable price same for the beginning to mid s197, but it's clear where they are trying to go/do.

I mean look at what they are doing with the Shelby a 600hp high revving naturally aspirater V8 that handles WELL. Who else builds those kind of cars? Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche.
They clearly want more respect from European countries.

It's like Ford saying it's a new "me" I guess.
I like it, I want the new 5.0.
I for one have never Viewed the mustang as a Muscle/Pony car... Those are nothing more than stupid Monikers... The mustang is and always has been a Sports Coupe car. Hence, like any other company that wants to succeed .. You have to be better than other sport coupes in the price range of your product. Lower tier cars have always had one focus.. Look what we can offer for cheap compared to high price brands such as Ferrari Etc.. The goal has never changed.. never will.
TexArmageddon is offline  
GT Member
 
Radioguy's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Saint Louis
Posts: 1,569
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexArmageddon;6937626[I
]I for one have never Viewed the mustang as a Muscle/Pony car[/i]... Those are nothing more than stupid Monikers... The mustang is and always has been a Sports Coupe car. Hence, like any other company that wants to succeed .. You have to be better than other sport coupes in the price range of your product. Lower tier cars have always had one focus.. Look what we can offer for cheap compared to high price brands such as Ferrari Etc.. The goal has never changed.. never will.
Happily, everyone gets to have their own opinions. But if you are trying to sell a product into the market, then you really need to understand how "the world - including your potential customers" view your product. It certainly appears that "MotorTrend" sees competition between Mustang, Camaro and Challenger
"GM is keeping meaningful details on the sixth-generation 2016 Chevrolet Camaro tightly under wraps, but given the updated Hellcat-powered 2015 Dodge Challenger, and the all-new 2015 Ford Mustang, the Camaro has its work cut out for it if it hopes to retain its pony car sales crown."

2013 Mustang GT Premium Convertible
Candy Apple Red, Auto, FRPP Tune, GT500 Axlebacks, KONI Yellow Sport (adjustable dampers), FRPP Front and Rear swaybars, Custom Removable 4 Point Roll-Bar, BOSS 302 Low Expansion Brake Lines, Roush side splitters, GT500 spoiler, Redline Tuning hood struts,18" Ford Chromed Aluminum Wheels (9R3Z-1K007-A), Michelin Pilot Super Sports - 235X50X18
2011 Mustang V6 Premium Convertible - Gone
Radioguy is offline  
PONY Member
 
dastefster's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Memphis
Posts: 656
 
Not to interrupt the sales debate, but a real owner of a 15 weighed his stock GT (fully optioned) recently and it weighed out to be 3,780lb WITH 3/4 tank of gas. This lines up pretty well with Ford's claims of 3,705lb curb weight....which also means it is only a 80-90lb increase over the previous model...not 200 and other ridiculous numbers people have been throwing around.

Heres the link so you can check out the proof yourself. First 2015 Mustang GT (Fully Optioned) Weighed by Owner | 2015+ Mustang (s550) Forum News Blog – Mustang6G | The Ultimate 6th Generation Mustang (S550) Enthusiast Site

I really don't thing an 80-90lb increase (given the changes) is anything to complain about. But thats my opinion


2015 mustang GT, Performance Pack, Recaro seats, All-weather floor mats.

Ordered: 5/20/14
VIN received: 10/16/14
ETA: 12/11/14
Delivered: 12/10/14
dastefster is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
 

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Mustang Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a VALID email address for yourself, otherwise you will not receive the necessary confirmation email needed to confirm, validate and activate your new AFM member account.

Failure to provide a VALID email address, will result in the cancellation of your new AFM member account registration.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 


Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1