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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
"The upper control arm is what cinched it for me. I did the LCAs first, like you, and it helped a little. The UCA completely eliminated the wheel hop for me. You've got to figure that there's only one UCA and it controls axle rotation." STLWagon


When y'all talk about axle hop, are you referring to what happens when you hit a bump (maybe if you're changing lanes) and it throws your car kind of side ways? If so, I'd like to stop my car from doing this. Would the UCA's be the fix?
Thanks!
 

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"The upper control arm is what cinched it for me. I did the LCAs first, like you, and it helped a little. The UCA completely eliminated the wheel hop for me. You've got to figure that there's only one UCA and it controls axle rotation." STLWagon


When y'all talk about axle hop, are you referring to what happens when you hit a bump (maybe if you're changing lanes) and it throws your car kind of side ways? If so, I'd like to stop my car from doing this. Would the UCA's be the fix?
Thanks!
Actually I think that is bumpsteer(someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Axle hop is when the car alternates between obtaining and losing traction. Axle hop is when you get on it at the track and the rear wheels spin and the axle starts to hop violently because either the car doesn't have good torsional control of the axle(which is what LCA/UCAs improve), or poor shock dampening.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Actually I think that is bumpsteer(someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Axle hop is when the car alternates between obtaining and losing traction. Axle hop is when you get on it at the track and the rear wheels spin and the axle starts to hop violently because either the car doesn't have good torsional control of the axle(which is what LCA/UCAs improve), or poor shock dampening.
Alrighty then. I knew it was a good thing to identify the problem by its correct name before launching into how to fix it. :hihi:
I don't go to the track so I'm not having any "track related" issues.

Then it is "bumpsteer" I'd love to get rid of!! Any fixes for that?
Thanks!
 

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This is kind of generic but here is a good page on BUMPSTEER, what causes it and some resolutions, bumpsteer
It is not Mustang specific but will help explain what is happening. Has your Mustang been lowered? There are kits to correct bumpsteer on lowered Mustangs but I'm not sure if they work on stock suspension.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
No, my car is bone stock--not lowered.
The more I search the internet for "fix bumpsteer," I'm not even sure that's the problem. The definition I just read of it seems to have more to do with the front end. That's not where the problem is.
Let me explain my issue and someone can tell me the name for the problem (then maybe we can get on to how to fix it :hihi::

When going "sideways" (i.e., getting on interstate, changing lanes), if I hit a bump, it throws the rearend of the car sideways.

Anyone else? Anyone know the name for this phenomenon?
Thanks!
 

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I think maybe you're experiencing rear steer, which is the rear of the car steering itself as the suspension flexes negotiating bumps.
 

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What you are describing is a bump steer phenomenon, but it can be made worst by a bunch of other factors regarding wheel alignment and even rear axle placement/adjustment.

Axle hop in our version of this car is much better than the IRS Cobras and much more curable. A CHE UCA and some imitation FR500 LCAs from the aftermarket completely eliminated hard acceleration axle hop from my car. My '03 Terminator had every IRS aftermarket cure on there and it still hopped. A lot of the New Edge IRS guys swap out for a live axle because of that. IMHO, we are fortunate to have a 3 link live axle as it is more pliable for the demands of road racing than either the New Edge IRS or live axle. Just $.02.
 

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I know exactly what your talking about, it happens to me on the freeway when I change lanes over the bumps while turning. I don't think its considered "bumpsteer" and the "wheel hop" that most Mustang drivers talk about happens while the wheels are spinning under acceleration(burning out). SO what is this phenomena called? I got some 20" AR Razors and America Tire insisted I get 245\30 tires, big mistake, it feels like the rear of my car jump over a few feet when hitting those lane markers while turning. I'm not sure there is a solution for this. Can anybody with LCAs tell us if the LCAs help with this issue?
 

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I know exactly what your talking about, it happens to me on the freeway when I change lanes over the bumps while turning. I don't think its considered "bumpsteer" and the "wheel hop" that most Mustang drivers talk about happens while the wheels are spinning under acceleration(burning out). SO what is this phenomena called? I got some 20" AR Razors and America Tire insisted I get 245\30 tires, big mistake, it feels like the rear of my car jump over a few feet when hitting those lane markers while turning. I'm not sure there is a solution for this. Can anybody with LCAs tell us if the LCAs help with this issue?
See this what I'm trying to figure out as well. I believe this problem is related to bumpsteer, but it's not necessarily called bumpsteer. What is being experience is an oversteer condition, that has many factors. Speed, tires, surface, lateral force, body roll. Bumpsteer can induce oversteer as well.

Sway bars may help reduce this problem.

I wish SportPix was here, he's the suspension guru.
 

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I think I know what you are talking about.

I have a patch of repaved area where they dug across my a road near my house, it is very rough patch. When I hit it, the rear of the car hops a bit and feels like it slides a bit one way or the other, particularly if accelerating.

I think it was the TCS system. When traveling over this with TCS off, the effect was almost if not all gone.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I know exactly what your talking about, it happens to me on the freeway when I change lanes over the bumps while turning. I don't think its considered "bumpsteer" and the "wheel hop" that most Mustang drivers talk about happens while the wheels are spinning under acceleration(burning out). SO what is this phenomena called? I got some 20" AR Razors and America Tire insisted I get 245\30 tires, big mistake, it feels like the rear of my car jump over a few feet when hitting those lane markers while turning. I'm not sure there is a solution for this. Can anybody with LCAs tell us if the LCAs help with this issue?
Yes, you are correct, Oh Wise One, that's the problem exactly. :hihi:
"Wheel hop" sounds like an excellent description but I don't know what that term means to the rest of the motoring world.
I still have the factory Pirellis on...

OK, for $1,000,000, who knows the proper term for this phenomenon?!
:gringreen (And more importantly, how to stop it.)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I think I know what you are talking about.

I have a patch of repaved area where they dug across my a road near my house, it is very rough patch. When I hit it, the rear of the car hops a bit and feels like it slides a bit one way or the other, particularly if accelerating.

I think it was the TCS system. When traveling over this with TCS off, the effect was almost if not all gone.
I never drive with the TCS off so I've never experienced it that way.
 

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Oversteer is a very common problem on the S197. Even worse if you run a staggered wheel/tire setup.
 

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I never drive with the TCS off so I've never experienced it that way.

That's what I'm saying... Next time your in an area you know you get this, turn off TCS and see if it improves the issue.

My theory on it is that on a bumpy patch on the road your tires don't bite as well, and with TCS ON, it think your losing traction, and thereby making adjustments to compensate, and in the end giving that sliding feeling, as the axle begins to hop.
 

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What you're describing is exactly what I experienced before I installed a watts link (yes- we're back to THAT again).

What the wats link did as a practical matter is what it's supposed to do in theory too, i.e., allow each side of the axle to move up or down independently of the other side, thus keeping BOTH sides of the axle (and wheels) on the ground where the height of that ground is uneven on one side of the axle ends (e.g., going over a pothole on one side and not the other).

Check out the FAQs and theory discussion on the following site if you want to know more:

FAYS2 Suspension Watts Link
 

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If you want to see a SEVERE case of axle hop, watch the movie BULLITT. The scene where he is chasing the charger (scene 14 on the DVD by the way), takes a turn too wide and then has to back up. He smokes the left rear tire and it hops like mad...yeah it's in reverse, but you'll get the idea.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
That's what I'm saying... Next time your in an area you know you get this, turn off TCS and see if it improves the issue.

My theory on it is that on a bumpy patch on the road your tires don't bite as well, and with TCS ON, it think your losing traction, and thereby making adjustments to compensate, and in the end giving that sliding feeling, as the axle begins to hop.
I will absolutely try that. Thanks!!
 

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...OK, for $1,000,000, who knows the proper term for this phenomenon?!
:gringreen (And more importantly, how to stop it.)
If I understand you correctly I believe you're referring to what I like to call the "solid axle hop". All of my Mustangs have done this (Nova and Chevelle as well). I find it most noticeable crossing train tracks at an angle or hitting a bump mid-turn around a circle or "jug handle". It feels like the rear end is performing a little "hop" to one side. The S197 has been the best behaved of the group but still does it. Unfortunately I do not know a cure. I've always written it off as part of the solid rear axle driving experience. You have the unsprung weight of the axle and drive shaft throwing the tail end of your car around.
 
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