[js2007gt]

ok so I have a bassani midpipe which was expensive so I feel im married to it, with that being said...ive been researching shorty headers and in doing that I have heard and according to their website that jbl cat 4ward headers put out similar gains as long tubes do, is this true or just hogwash? or should I just buy long tubes and modify that x pipe I have? opinions will be very appreciated........2007 gt/cs

 

[js2007gt]

jba cat 4wrd, misstype

 

[BlackStang73]

I was in the same boat as you and purchased an off-road H-pipe..a year later I had to scrap it for a shorty h-pipe to fit the long tube headers I put on. Not really sure how much shorties add as far as power but can tell you that long tubes def will put you back in the seat a little more and the sound that comes out of the car now with long tubes is simply amazing.

 

[jlee910]

Shorties add next to nothing on the 4.6 3v, and the best long tube headers only add 15-20 horses at the wheels to a stock GT, but they fatten up the whole powerband and can cost a grand or more.

 

[MaDDMaNN]

Here is something that makes some interesting reading. It's not JBA but there is an article floating around the web comparing all shorty headers in a test; they give almost the same results.
Ford Mustang BBK Headers Installation - Mustang Monthly Magazine - View All Page

 

[MaDDMaNN]

http://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/content/exhshoot3-1.htm

 

[spinnerator]

I'm curious, and I'm not trolling just looking for some opinions. All that I've read on the internet so far is that shorties give minimal gain and aren't worth the money. But my local Ford dealer has a Speed Shop section and all they sell are shorties. Does Ford have an issue with long tube headers? It's seems odd that Ford Engineers endorse (assuming the dealer wouldn't sell them otherwise) shorties but not long tubes.

 

[Bullitt95]

Does Ford have an issue with long tube headers? It's seems odd that Ford Engineers endorse (assuming the dealer wouldn't sell them otherwise) shorties but not long tubes.

I suspect the reason is that long tube headers aren't emissions legal in some states. As far as HP gains go, it's roughly 3-5rwhp from shorties but that's without any other changes. Long tubes yield 15-17rwhp but roughly half of that gain is due to the offroad midpipe that goes with them. If you get a catted midpipe with long tubes, the gain is more like 12-13rwhp. Not much gain when you consider that the combined cost of LT headers/catted midpipe is at least $1200. By the time you add the cost of O2 sensor wire extenders, a revised tune, and labor, the total outlay would be close to $2000.
IMO, forget the idea of swapping in headers and put the money towards a turbo kit instead.

 

[Blue_Streak]

I suspect the reason is that long tube headers aren't emissions legal in some states. As far as HP gains go, it's roughly 3-5rwhp from shorties but that's without any other changes. Long tubes yield 15-17rwhp but roughly half of that gain is due to the offroad midpipe that goes with them. If you get a catted midpipe with long tubes, the gain is more like 12-13rwhp. Not much gain when you consider that the combined cost of LT headers/catted midpipe is at least $1200. By the time you add the cost of O2 sensor wire extenders, a revised tune, and labor, the total outlay would be close to $2000.
IMO, forget the idea of swapping in headers and put the money towards a turbo kit instead.

^THIS. ALL DAY.

If I had it to do over again, I would have put my money towards a supercharger or possibly a turbo and skipped the headers. Your estimate on install is scary accurate by the way.

After doing long tubes, I had struggles with getting an appropriate tune for them and whether or not the car will pass emissions is still up in the air at this point...which I'm not happy about.

I will say this as a positive though: the sound with long tubes and Outlaws on the car with a catted X...rock.gif

 

[TWShovel]

I plan to install a set of JBA shorties on my 05 GT. Shorties due offer better low to mid range torque than stock manifolds AND they are CARB certified - a big plus for those of living in CA or other CARB states! There are NO long tube headers approved CARB in my research anyhow.....Move the factory location of Cat's an inch and your hosed relative emissions testing.....

 

[Blue_Streak]

I plan to install a set of JBA shorties on my 05 GT. Shorties due offer better low to mid range torque than stock manifolds AND they are CARB certified - a big plus for those of living in CA or other CARB states! There are NO long tube headers approved CARB in my research anyhow.....Move the factory location of Cat's an inch and your hosed relative emissions testing.....

While you are correct that none are CARB certified, if you have a good tune you will pass the sniffer test. And most inspectors don't know a long tube header from a peanut butter sandwich. Now, if you get a knowledgeable inspector AND he does a strict visual, that's when you reach into your pocket, pull out a $20, and say, "You know, it's not really cars that's hurting the atmosphere. It's those coal refineries...."

If you still get a "Sorry, can't help you" then slap a $100 and say "Final offer". Works 9/10 times. :grin:

Honestly, in this part of Texas we have emissions testing but all they really care about is that you don't have any lights on on the dash. They don't do the sniffer test, just an OBDII test and "visual"....which here pretty much means yeah, that looks like a car.

But you are correct at any rate. I just wanted to offer some options for those that decide to do the long tube route like I did.

 

[TWShovel]

Not so lucky in CA. They do a visual inspection. Anything they see that is not stock on the engine is an automatic trigger and they want to see the CARB approval sticker/plate. I bought a Zex NOS kit....later returned as it is not CARB approved. Called my Smog station that has "helped me out" on occasion.....he said if they see the injector/NOS adapter....automatic failure. So I would have to pull all the evidence and return to stock.....same for long tubes. My tech will look the other way on somethings, but anything obvious that could cost him his license he would call me on it....Our CHP has also been known to catch any glaring SMOG violations if they have any mechanical inclination at all, which opens a can of worms let me tell you!! So in my case, I will have to be content with shorty headers....they, in conjunction with other bolt on's and a tune I created based on my own Diablo 93 octane tune nets pretty decent power......can't wait to get the shorties in this winter and a new cat-back exhaust system, CMDP's, twin blade 62mm throttle body and see what I can do with the new parts!

 

[jlee910]

I wonder if a hellion turbo system would pass since it keeps the factory cats in place?

 

[Blue_Streak]

It was only AFTER I posted that I realized you are in California. Sorry about that. You have my sympathies because I know how hard those laws are on you guys and gals out there.

I went the shorty route in my '99 GT and I can tell you that, despite what some may say, there's still gains to be had. And with the right supporting mods, you'll have a blast with the car! Best of luck to you.

 

[TWShovel]

Thanks Blue Streak, it is a pain out here. If only I lived in Amador County right next door to El Dorado County. Because Amador does not have the traffic we do, and lower traffic density, they are exempt from the more stringent tests I am....and all because we have US 50 (one of the main routes to South Lake Tahoe, CA!!)...truly sucks!!

Relative to FI, if CARB has approved a turbo or super charger system, you dont get any grief!!! Unfortunately I don't have the spare $6K to get one!