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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 69 coupe with an automatic transmission. I definitely want to convert to a manual in the future. Does anybody have experience with this? How should I go about it, what will the costs be around, and how hard is the labor. Is it something possible for someone with no experience and a set of directions to do?
 

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There are no directions on doing this change over. There are just to many variables. There are several threads in the last few months you can find and read. It is not something a novice should do on their own because of many different tasks that need to be done it would be fairly overwhelming. You need to post all the details of your car, engine, current trans, and what you want to put in.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
It has a 302 and C4 automatic transmission. Everything is pretty much stock. I want to put in a T5 5 speed manual trans. Either a new one or out of a late 80s or early 90s mustang. I also wanted to know the advantages of the T5 apposed to the C4. Will I get better gas mileage and will the car be quicker?
 

· Bluefordguy
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There is a TON of info on this swap if you search within the AFM forum...also lots of info through google searches. I just completed this swap last spring and I am still fine tuning everything. I too was running a C4 before the swap. I spent countless hours online reading forum posts and putting parts lists together. My recommendation to you would be to do the same. Make sure you have a good idea of what is entailed with the swap before you start purchasing parts.

My conversion cost about $1,600 complete...I am running a used T5 from an 89 GT. I decided to run the used T5 with no rebuild and see how long it will last. I have not had any problems so far but have not logged many miles. This is the lower HP/TQ rated T5 but I am not cranking out tons of power. The labor is not easy but not impossible for someone with average mechanical skills...

The main advantage, in my opinion, is 5th (overdrive) gear. This allows for a much taller rear gear while still maintaining relatively low RPMs on the highway. If you have a factory gear, 3.0 for instance, your car will be very sluggish in 5th gear. Mileage could go up...depends how hard you drive it.
 

· Bluefordguy
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Christophers 66 Mustang Restoration and Modification

Check out this link. This is from an AFM members '66 restoration. He helped my out a ton on my conversion. Without his help I would have had an extremely difficult time getting everything to work. At the top of the page there are links to different stages of the restoration...click on the T5 link. Its not from a '69 but I would think some of it would still apply to your conversion. He is also running a used, non-rebuilt T5.
 

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I've never understood the reasoning behind doing this swap in the interest of fuel mileage. The T5 could potentially get you better mileage depending on how it's driven, but if MPG is a real concern, why are you driving a car with a 45 year old V8? Will it be faster? You have more control over the engine, so you can flog the engine harder when you want to. But you won't see any horsepower increase.

You'll need to figure out what you want to do with the car. The T5 isn't known for taking tons of power. If you want to keep your 302 stock, it should be fine. But if you plan on going for big power, that T5 will get eaten alive. You'll either need to get it beefed up or find a different transmission. Figure out what you want the car t be, and how it will be used before you start throwing money at it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
haha yeah gas mileage isn't a concern, It would just be a bonus. I have big plans for the car but that's way way down the road. I know you can get brand new T5 that are built to handle a lot more hp than the ones from the fox bodies. I'm still deciding whether I want to just wait a long time and just do a whole engine swap to a more modern engine or upgrade the one I have now. I don't want to waste time doing a ton of stuff to it if I'm just going to get a whole new one in the future. I'm only 16, a sophomore in high school, so this stuff isn't going to happen for a long time. My ultimate goal is to just have one bad ass street car that I can have a ton of fun with. I plan on keeping this car forever
 

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I did the T5 a year ago. Completely changed the nature of the beast. Went with a T5Z transmission deal I got on ebay. Came with bellhousing, flywheel, and aluminum driveshaft(which i just sold) Also went with a Modern Driveline hydraulic clutch kit, and Scott Drake roller bearing kit for the pedals. Smooooooooth. All told it cost me around $3k and I did it with the help of some friends.
 

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Since we share a name, not to mention this Hobby, I figured I'd respond.

Fastback66 sums it up pretty well. I concur with his recommendation of a hydraulic setup. That is not the cheap way, but it is the best way from a usability standpoint. That said, MustangSteve has a nice quadrant kit that is much more affordable. Everyone is different, but IMHO a stick is always more fun than an automatic.

I got my car when I was 17 back in 1987. You mention in your post you plan to keep this car forever. I hope you do since mine has been not only a faithful steed, but also a platform for learning. I was fortunate in that I had a father and grandfather who actively encouraged my entrance into the Hobby. I have redone everything I've ever done to the car at LEAST twice. Shortly I am going to park the car again and rewire the engine harness. For the third time. Each time I do it, I am closer to being satisfied. The current one works fine, but I just don't like it.

The reason I mention this is you need to understand that at 16, you don't know much. Hell, I am 44 and I still don't know much! Don't expect to make a modification to this car that you will never revisit. That is wishful thinking. When you put the T5 in, you will do it wrong. You will then pull it back out and put to use what you learned by doing it wrong. This is the nature of the beast my friend.

My main advice to you is to make it safe. Fast yes (that is a given!) but remember to give yourself every advantage in keeping the shiny side up. I remember at 17 my Dad saying those words to me and in typical 17 year old fashion, I ignored them. I am lucky to have made it out of my teens. They say the wise are those whose screw-ups have not killed them. Far be it from me to claim wisdom, but as of today, my screw-ups have not killed me. There is always tomorrow though.

Just my 2 cents. Or maybe 3 since this post is kinda long.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Since we share a name, not to mention this Hobby, I figured I'd respond.

Fastback66 sums it up pretty well. I concur with his recommendation of a hydraulic setup. That is not the cheap way, but it is the best way from a usability standpoint. That said, MustangSteve has a nice quadrant kit that is much more affordable. Everyone is different, but IMHO a stick is always more fun than an automatic.

I got my car when I was 17 back in 1987. You mention in your post you plan to keep this car forever. I hope you do since mine has been not only a faithful steed, but also a platform for learning. I was fortunate in that I had a father and grandfather who actively encouraged my entrance into the Hobby. I have redone everything I've ever done to the car at LEAST twice. Shortly I am going to park the car again and rewire the engine harness. For the third time. Each time I do it, I am closer to being satisfied. The current one works fine, but I just don't like it.

The reason I mention this is you need to understand that at 16, you don't know much. Hell, I am 44 and I still don't know much! Don't expect to make a modification to this car that you will never revisit. That is wishful thinking. When you put the T5 in, you will do it wrong. You will then pull it back out and put to use what you learned by doing it wrong. This is the nature of the beast my friend.

My main advice to you is to make it safe. Fast yes (that is a given!) but remember to give yourself every advantage in keeping the shiny side up. I remember at 17 my Dad saying those words to me and in typical 17 year old fashion, I ignored them. I am lucky to have made it out of my teens. They say the wise are those whose screw-ups have not killed them. Far be it from me to claim wisdom, but as of today, my screw-ups have not killed me. There is always tomorrow though.

Just my 2 cents. Or maybe 3 since this post is kinda long.
Thanks for the advice Bradley! I appreciate it. I think I'm going to get some sort of white board to organize all my ideas I want to do with the car and research each one and figure out what I need for each one just so I don't go into any of this blind.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Also one more thing. Is a T5 swap not something I want to do first in my list of wanted upgrades. I don't know where to start that won't cause a ton of problems.
 

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Christophers 66 Mustang Restoration and Modification

Check out this link. This is from an AFM members '66 restoration. He helped my out a ton on my conversion. Without his help I would have had an extremely difficult time getting everything to work. At the top of the page there are links to different stages of the restoration...click on the T5 link. Its not from a '69 but I would think some of it would still apply to your conversion. He is also running a used, non-rebuilt T5.
Thanks for the kind words Kris. I am glad that I could help you out but you did the hard work.
@ Brad_V8Muscle: If you have any questions I will be more than happy to help with answers from what I learned. We are all here to learn and share!

Side note: The website I set up has had over 200,000 visits! It is amazing that so many people have come by to take a look...

Good luck and be safe
Ron
 

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As far as what to do first, the T5 swap is going to be a challenge for you. That said, the other people who've responded to your post have pointed out that there is a ton of info on this swap so you won't go into it blind.

What are your priorities? Is the C4 you have on its last leg? Is there something else that NEEDS replacing?

As I wrote before, I will always prefer a stick over an auto but there are some other things to consider to. Do you have a dual bowl master cylinder? I believe that is an essential upgrade. It is also relatively easy to do and it won't take you long, unlike the T5 swap. Furthermore, it is downright cheap compared to the T5. This project will force you to learn the art of 'brake bleeding' which is an essential skill.

I was amazed at how much of an improvement in drivability the rack & pinion gave me. With all of the mods I've made, that was the most noticeable in terms of drivability. There are non-power rack kits that won't break the bank and they are relatively easy to install with normal hand tools.

There is an old saying: if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

If your C4 is working fine, you might want to focus on smaller projects first so you can get your feet wet. I don't know you, but if you get frustrated easily, that is more reason to take small bites of the apple first. If you dive in and tackle a big project which is beyond your skill level, you might sour on the whole car!

Here is another old saying: getting there is half the fun.

I know patience is not something high on your list of character attributes to obtain (it certainly wasn't on mine at 17), but don't be in a rush to get everything done at once. Tackle a small project, then drive the car for a few weeks. After that, you'll be ready for the next project. My Dad is working on a 1952 Ford Sedan Delivery and he has not driven it in 8 years. The car is not in a drivable state because he tried to take on too many projects at once. Some guys on this Forum have the patience to do a rotisserie restoration and they are okay with waiting years before they can drive it again. I am not one of them. My point is that if you keep the projects small, you'll be able to drive the car more, and thus be able to ENJOY your hard work during the process.

No matter what mod you do, there will always be someone with a faster car than you. Try to avoid equating an awesome car with a fast car. I have a friend with the ugliest Fox body you'll ever see. It is also the fastest car I've ever been in. The interior is even worse than the exterior. I can't imagine him impressing a date with that car. I guess he is fortunate he is already married then, huh? My point is that you might want to focus on the things that make the car enjoyable to own and drive, rather than just making it fast.

Alright, that is enough preaching for one night.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
haha I really appreciate your input Bradley. You have some very good advise. You're right, I do get caught up in thinking I just want a fast car, when that shouldn't be all I care about. And I am not a patient person so the small projects at a time is probably a good idea. I do have a dual bowl master cylinder already, and not sure about the rack and piston(I'll have to check). My C4 is working fine, and if I do a swap it will probably be pretty far down the road considering I have no experience. I just get so caught up in these forums and youtube videos and whenever I see something someone has done to theirs, I immediately feel like I have to have it hahaha. Currently my car is at the shop getting front disk breaks, power steering, and a couple of other little fixes.
 

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I have a 69 coupe with an automatic transmission. I definitely want to convert to a manual in the future. Does anybody have experience with this? How should I go about it, what will the costs be around, and how hard is the labor. Is it something possible for someone with no experience and a set of directions to do?

Hi,
I did this conversion four, or so, years ago to my early 65 cvt. I've attached a procedure used with a section as to my experience afterwards. It might help.
Good Luck!
 

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Thanks man, I appreciate it!
You are welcome mate. I have a complete parts list, as well, but it's specific to first gen cars. Although, the same parts (different generation) will be needed.
Good Luck with your project.
 
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