D Un4given said:I blame the poor sales of Ford, GM and Dodge cause of ugly car design and them banking on people buying suv forever...maybe Detroit should start building cars that American wanna buy.
You and many of my father's generation have this dillusion that American Car Design is better then the imports. What denial. It is this idealizm and romantisism of American goods that pretty much insures the big 3 continue to put out crap. With people like you that continue to appologize for the incompetence of the big 3, continue to buy their crap, and continue to ignore the supremely better design of, for example, the Camry and Accord, your blind patriotism and denial only propagate and insure that the big 3 will continually produce cars people are wanting less and less.bigplayrayr said:I think many of the foreign makes have the benefit as people see those as having better quality, and much is to do with the crapt Detroit put out in the 80's. I think the design of American cars are much better tahn the Japanese. I don't understand how anyone can think the Camry has a gotta have design.
I just wish people would be somewhat Patriotic and at least look at American cars. The union needs to give up alot of ground to help the Big 3 compete, the Japanese do not have the large pensions to hinder them. How much industry do you want to give up?
As Ford was a leader in the Industrial Revolution, it would be very sad to think they might not be around much longer.
Remember if if the Foreign auto companies make cars in the US, the profits are still sent out of the country. The US's huge deficit in trade will one day come to roast
lovcom said:You and many of my father's generation have this dillusion that American Car Design is better then the imports. What denial. It is this idealizm and romantisism of American goods that pretty much insures the big 3 continue to put out crap. With people like you that continue to appologize for the incompetence of the big 3, continue to buy their crap, and continue to ignore the supremely better design of, for example, the Camry and Accord, your blind patriotism and denial only propagate and insure that the big 3 will continually produce cars people are wanting less and less.
LETS TALK ABOUT PATRIOTISM, SHALL WE?
It is UN-AMERICAN to buy [email protected] goods. It is VERY AMERICAN to buy the very best. It is UN-AMERICAN to buy most American cars and trucks. It is VERY American to buy most Japanese models.
So lets start being true and patriotic Americans...lets buy the best, and if that means that we buy Japanese, then so be it, because not to buy the best is NOT AMERICAN.
Lets keep the big three honest and striving by NOT buying most of their [email protected] reward their BS products with purchases is to enable their current slide.
Sure I too have a Mustang, and I love it's looks, and I love it, but lets have dillussions either...it is not refined, and there is ample room for improvement....much more so then in most Japanese cars...lets be happy with our American Mustangs, but lets have no dillussions either.
Are you to suggest that it would be the American people's fault of Ford went under? Did it ever occur to you that it would FORD's FAULT?!?
Why would you expect American's to buy BS products???
So Ford goes under and you blame the American People for not buying their products? What kind of dysfunctional strange logic is that?!?
Waxed'05 GT said:Let's keep in mind that's it's REALLY only the big 2 now. The Chrysler products may be made here, but that is no different than Japanese and Koreans building cars on "our" soil. The Chrysler dollars go overseas too!!!
lovcom said:You and many of my father's generation have this dillusion that American Car Design is better then the imports. What denial. It is this idealizm and romantisism of American goods that pretty much insures the big 3 continue to put out crap. With people like you that continue to appologize for the incompetence of the big 3, continue to buy their crap, and continue to ignore the supremely better design of, for example, the Camry and Accord, your blind patriotism and denial only propagate and insure that the big 3 will continually produce cars people are wanting less and less.
LETS TALK ABOUT PATRIOTISM, SHALL WE?
It is UN-AMERICAN to buy [email protected] goods. It is VERY AMERICAN to buy the very best. It is UN-AMERICAN to buy most American cars and trucks. It is VERY American to buy most Japanese models.
So lets start being true and patriotic Americans...lets buy the best, and if that means that we buy Japanese, then so be it, because not to buy the best is NOT AMERICAN.
Lets keep the big three honest and striving by NOT buying most of their [email protected] reward their BS products with purchases is to enable their current slide.
Sure I too have a Mustang, and I love it's looks, and I love it, but lets have dillussions either...it is not refined, and there is ample room for improvement....much more so then in most Japanese cars...lets be happy with our American Mustangs, but lets have no dillussions either.
Are you to suggest that it would be the American people's fault of Ford went under? Did it ever occur to you that it would FORD's FAULT?!?
Why would you expect American's to buy BS products???
So Ford goes under and you blame the American People for not buying their products? What kind of dysfunctional strange logic is that?!?
sincitystang said:What do you guys think of Ford's job cuts? They are loosing market share to other makes, especially overseas brands, but if you buy american brands, does it really help out american jobs?
For example, my work truck is a toyota tacoma. I bought it because it has a 4 cyl engine, gets good gas mileage, has a high resale value and is one of the most reliable trucks in history. I dont need a large, 8 cyl gas guzzler from Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Toyota or Nissan. This truck is not made in Japan, but is assembled in Fremont, CA by New United Motors, a joint plant by GM and toyota. They actually assemble a GM car that is exported to Japan under a Toyota name. I have a good freind that has been working at that plant since the mid 90's and is still strong despite of the tech sector jobs the bay area has lost in the last few years.
Another Example is the Nissan Altima, its also assembled here in the US in tenn. I belive Honda Accords, Acura TLs are also assembled here in the US that employ US workers.
One big factor of the Big 3 loosing sales is the fact that gas is so expensive and the new trend is comming off Large cars or SUVs to smaller and more fuel efficient cars. VW, Honda, Toyota makes cars that 40+ or more MPG, and in Europe, some VWs get 100+ (diesel engines) and in japan they have Diesel/Electric hybrids and systems that pre heat the diesel fuel for better fuel economy. The Big 3 auto makers need to step it up and make these cars their bread and butter to really compete with the japanese and koreans.
Waxed'05 GT said:I agree that the gov't should impose higher tariffs for the foreign cars. But the big three's biggest problem with "keeping up" has to do with the cost of pensions and unions. My wife belongs to the teacher union (I think it's the largest union) and it does her no good. Unions cost money and make the union leaders rich, and end up costing us all in the end. My wife hates that she has to pay dues for a job that pays the least out of all required Bachelor degree careers. (She is not teaching because of its pay - but she still has to make enough to pay back the $40K she owes from school and to "bring in" something after it's all said and done).
pcfrisch said:I think it is all of the above, I used to work for the UAW but I am no big union fan, one of the biggest problems is they (auto companies) have paid almost 100% of health care costs, and that is a HUGE chunk of change. When things got slow, I had to sweep the floors, can you imagine how much that cost the company for me doing that?, because of union rules, they could not send me home.
As far as quality, that is a cop-out for the most part, I work with people who have never owned nor ever will own a domestic car because of what they heard about them, and not what they experienced. Back in the 80's, yes the quality sucked, but have gotten much better since then.
I am deeply patriotic when it comes to vehicles, I also try to avoid made in China crappola. I never have and never will own a foreign vehicle, you may say that some parts are made in different countries, another cop-out. Ford I believe manufactures and assembles most of the parts here.
I remember bumper stickers back in the 80's that said "hungry? eat your Toyota"
I think we need to support our own country (insert fife music here).