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Ford Racing has done away with all their 347 stroker crate engines and have replaced them with a 363 stroker Ford Racing Performance Parts. I guess a 363 has the same 3.40 stroke as a 347 but the cylinder bore is 4.125 instead of 4.030. A few months ago I bought a set of Ford Racing M6049Z304DA heads and my plan was to buy a 347 short block from FRPP next spring. Now that its not available I guess ill be going with the 331 or 363. So I was just wondering what are everyones thoughts are on the 363? I know there are better and cheaper options than FRPP but I can get frpp parts at cost from the local Ford dealership my shop does business with. At that price its not really any more expensive than a short block from a different engine builder. So are there any problems associated with a bigger bore? I want to run this motor for quite some time and maybe freshen it up a few times in the future when needed. With a bore that big will there be any room for additional boring if required?
 

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Ford Racing has done away with all their 347 stroker crate engines and have replaced them with a 363 stroker Ford Racing Performance Parts. I guess a 363 has the same 3.40 stroke as a 347 but the cylinder bore is 4.125 instead of 4.030. A few months ago I bought a set of Ford Racing M6049Z304DA heads and my plan was to buy a 347 short block from FRPP next spring. Now that its not available I guess ill be going with the 331 or 363. So I was just wondering what are everyones thoughts are on the 363? I know there are better and cheaper options than FRPP but I can get frpp parts at cost from the local Ford dealership my shop does business with. At that price its not really any more expensive than a short block from a different engine builder. So are there any problems associated with a bigger bore? I want to run this motor for quite some time and maybe freshen it up a few times in the future when needed. With a bore that big will there be any room for additional boring if required?
The block they use is the Block: Boss 302 8.2 deck.

Ford Racing specs have that block as a max 4.125 bore so no, you wouldnt be able to bore it anymore. I believe SHP has a 302 that can be bored to 4.185. Thats just Ford Racings suggestion though how far you decide to bore is up to you. People HAVE bored that block to 4.185 but I dont see the need too those blocks are rated for 1400(?) safe whp so you shouldnt have any issues with the block. I would contact Woody from fordstrokers and find out what he suggests he can guide you better than most of us here. Let us know what you do we all love stroked motors here!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yeah ill have to talk to Woody. I have a .030 over non roller cam 5.0 block wrapped up in my closet that I was originally going to build a 347 with. I may just have fordstrokers build me a short block instead. It going to be a 95% street car so i'm looking for reliability as well as power. With the investment im making id like to be able to run this engine for a long time. So many people warned me against using a stock block to build a big cubic inch stroker that I thought i'd go the assembled short block route instead.
 

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Well I got a friend of mine who has been running a 363 based ford block for 2 years now. It is not daily driven but it is a weekend warrior that does see 16 psi of boost and so far everything is tight. The only thing that did get upgraded was a billet compressor wheel.
 

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I dont get why they are using I beams in the engine....I also wonder if its a 4340 Forged crank or not....most likely not...You can get more power/engine for the money elsewhere.
 

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With ford engines, what you see is what you get. You cant substitute, or make changes. Also keep in mind, ford doesn't build any of these engines, they are just assembly line engines built by a company in texas. Once upon a time, the factory was the only place to get the good stuff, today, ford racing parts are nothing but reboxed crap that says ford racing on it.
 

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Alot of things are made in China but it all comes down to the finishing part which is done by well educated people here stateside.

Just like I had a problem with my eagle rotating assembly which I had a problem with. After calling a few times and getting the run around they tell me that their stuff is made overseas also but finished here. But their quality was just terrible in which my rear main seal kept leaking cause my crank was 0.15 too small.
 

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Alot of things are made in China but it all comes down to the finishing part which is done by well educated people here stateside.

Just like I had a problem with my eagle rotating assembly which I had a problem with. After calling a few times and getting the run around they tell me that their stuff is made overseas also but finished here. But their quality was just terrible in which my rear main seal kept leaking cause my crank was 0.15 too small.
Eagle is garbage, the only reason it is ever used is because of price. If you would have measured the mains and rod journals with a .0001 increment mic you would have seen just how bad they are. Whoever is finishing them here in the states are not very good. There solution is to simply polish the crap out of the journals, which leads to horrendous sizing.
 

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Eagle is garbage, the only reason it is ever used is because of price. If you would have measured the mains and rod journals with a .0001 increment mic you would have seen just how bad they are. Whoever is finishing them here in the states are not very good. There solution is to simply polish the crap out of the journals, which leads to horrendous sizing.
I wish I would have known earlier in the game when I got Eagle H beam rods and pistons for super super cheap. So I bought a new crank and it has been nothing but trouble ever since. They also did nothing to rectify the problem at all.
 

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no matter who does the work or how new the part is, i alway measure everything. i'm kinda anal that way but it helps. :bigthumbsup and yea it is a lot of money for a crate engine, to not have any bore left for future re-builds.
 

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That block will go farther than 4.125, 50% of what ford says is nonsense. I have done 6 or so of those blocks at 4.185 and the cylinders were still .185 thick, the limiting factor on bore size for any 302-351 block is the 4.380 bore spacing. My dart block is 4.205 bore, but this is for naturally aspirated ONLY.
 

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I dont get why they are using I beams in the engine....I also wonder if its a 4340 Forged crank or not....most likely not...You can get more power/engine for the money elsewhere.
Yeah I wondered that too. Thats what I didnt like about it. The only 302 based crate engine they use H beams on is their 331

FordStrokers.com 331-347-408-418-427 Custom Built Small Block Ford Engines - FordStrokers "Liberator" Longblocks - :: FordStrokers DART Liberator Longblock

DART block 363 longblock with TEA ported trickflow twisted wedge FAC 190 heads,FordStrokers Custom HYD Roller Cam,balancer,flywheel,complete fox bottom end package,etc..or upgrade to TFS 205 CNC heads for an extra $500

it's no brainer if you have that kinda money to spend...
Yeah im going to talk to him about building a short block to use with the frpp Z heads I already have. Thanks

I wish I would have known earlier in the game when I got Eagle H beam rods and pistons for super super cheap. So I bought a new crank and it has been nothing but trouble ever since. They also did nothing to rectify the problem at all.
Good to know. I always heard Eagle was the best. Now I know not to buy any of their stuff

That block will go farther than 4.125, 50% of what ford says is nonsense. I have done 6 or so of those blocks at 4.185 and the cylinders were still .185 thick, the limiting factor on bore size for any 302-351 block is the 4.380 bore spacing. My dart block is 4.205 bore, but this is for naturally aspirated ONLY.
Thats what I was worried about. I want something I can rebuild when it gets tired and not have to buy another block.
 

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Yeah im going to talk to him about building a short block to use with the frpp Z heads I already have. Thanks
IM right here, the only 2 things I can guarantee is my engines are one off custom for each customer and my build time is very long, so if you need something tomorrow, I am not the one. I have 50+ engines on order any given day and its been this way for years.

On a side note, do you know which version of the Z head you have? There have been several different versions all the way back to when canfield was supplying them to Ford. Some use offset rockers, some versions do not.

Thats what I was worried about. I want something I can rebuild when it gets tired and not have to buy another block.
The first thing guys need to realize is these aftermarket blocks are made up of iron that is much more dense and stronger than stock blocks. You wont find an aftermarket block with a huge ridge at the top like you find on stock blocks. Then, lets say a piston comes apart and tears up the cylinder, your going to put a sleeve in that hole regardless of bore size. Dont fear the big bore.
 

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That block will go farther than 4.125, 50% of what ford says is nonsense. I have done 6 or so of those blocks at 4.185 and the cylinders were still .185 thick, the limiting factor on bore size for any 302-351 block is the 4.380 bore spacing. My dart block is 4.205 bore, but this is for naturally aspirated ONLY.
that is good to know, thanks woody
 

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Eagle is garbage, the only reason it is ever used is because of price. If you would have measured the mains and rod journals with a .0001 increment mic you would have seen just how bad they are. Whoever is finishing them here in the states are not very good. There solution is to simply polish the crap out of the journals, which leads to horrendous sizing.
Eagle is not garbage.... however the quality control is not the best. If you purchase a kit, have it balanced locally and done right without having to worry :yup:

We use Scat on most of our stuff and they have MUCH better quality control. We use hundreds of kits a year and never had an issue. We will use Callies or Howards when the customer wants to pop for it :D

Thats what I was worried about. I want something I can rebuild when it gets tired and not have to buy another block.
Cant go wrong with a Dart SHP block to make a big inch small block out of :bigthumbsup
 

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Discussion Starter #17
IM right here, the only 2 things I can guarantee is my engines are one off custom for each customer and my build time is very long, so if you need something tomorrow, I am not the one. I have 50+ engines on order any given day and its been this way for years.

On a side note, do you know which version of the Z head you have? There have been several different versions all the way back to when canfield was supplying them to Ford. Some use offset rockers, some versions do not.
I can give you the part number. It M6049Z304DA. I believe its the newest assembled version. It does require offset rockers. Are you Woody from fordstrokers?
 

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I can give you the part number. It M6049Z304DA. I believe its the newest assembled version. It does require offset rockers. Are you Woody from fordstrokers?
Yes I am woody, the owner. As long as you know it needs an offset rocker, then your alright.

Eagle is not garbage.... however the quality control is not the best. If you purchase a kit, have it balanced locally and done right without having to worry :yup:

We use Scat on most of our stuff and they have MUCH better quality control. We use hundreds of kits a year and never had an issue. We will use Callies or Howards when the customer wants to pop for it :D
Eagle is garbage, it was 20 years ago, and it is today. The forgings are horrendous looking, like a chinese kid with a hammer and chisel, they polish the death out of the journals in an attempt to fix how bad they are finish ground. Noone said anything about balancing, thats not the issue with eagle. If your ok with rod and mains .0005-.0006 out of round and taper, more power to you. I refuse to deliver that garbage to a customer. Most guys that sell kits dont give a ****, because its now the end users problem when he has to cut the crank .010-.010 to make it useable. Eagle could care less, they thrive on people who are shopping price.
 

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Eagle is garbage, it was 20 years ago, and it is today. The forgings are horrendous looking, like a chinese kid with a hammer and chisel, they polish the death out of the journals in an attempt to fix how bad they are finish ground. Noone said anything about balancing, thats not the issue with eagle. If your ok with rod and mains .0005-.0006 out of round and taper, more power to you. I refuse to deliver that garbage to a customer. Most guys that sell kits dont give a ****, because its now the end users problem when he has to cut the crank .010-.010 to make it useable. Eagle could care less, they thrive on people who are shopping price.
So what do you think about Scat?
 

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Scat has there own set of issues, namely there forgings are very old and were designed when bobweights were 1800+ grams, using 500-600 gram pistons, this is why you will see there steel 3.250-3.400 cranks coming now with the counterweights already lathed down so you only need to take 200 grams when balancing to 28 oz instead of 300+

There steel cranks are designed to be 28oz external and if you want to go internal, prepare to spend 600-800 dollars to put in 4-8 pieces of mallory metal.

There 331 cast cranks require 250-300 gram removal from the front and back cweights because the target bobweights are 1800 grams and just about every 331 bobweight will be in the 1550-1580 gram bobweight area.

Finish grind tolerances are much better than eagle, scat barely polishes the cranks after finish grinding, which is fine as I polish them. Overall scat is far better than eagle. Eagle is like a box of chocolates, they look the same until you bite into it.
 
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