The V6 is better then the GT
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OK, now I just used that subject to catch your attention... but really, after all this time drooling over the GT and all those horses, I finally got to test drive one.
And to be honest, I wasn't really that impressed. I mean, I'll need to try again to feel certain about it, but I drive the manual tranny V6 every day, and in my initial comparison, the GT tranny did not feel as good as I had hoped.
OK, now I know if you race, the shorter throw shifter is for you. And I could definately feel the extra horsies pushin the car. But in first and second gear, without anyone to race, it didn't seem much faster. In all honesty, I didn't have a chance to open it up on the highway.
But speed and power aside, the clutch pedal was very easy- too easy, to push to the floor. There's no feedback at all.
The stick kinda reminded me of some old video game like Spy Hunter. In the V6, I feel the gears meshing together - at least that's what it feels like I'm feeling. In the GT, there's no tension in the shifter, there's no throw, no soft meshing feeling as you hit the spot for the gear. It's just like playing a video game. I've heard it described as notchy, and I'd agree.
The GT engine noise was noticably louder. I'm not talking about exterior exhaust growl, but rather the engine compartment whine. I was hoping the GT would eliminate that sound more then enhance it, since the V6 is filled with all these chains that seem to make it loud and the GT doesn't have those.
Anyway, I'm not decided, but I just thought it was time for all you elitist GT suckers to eat some of your own medice for a change. I'm thinkin' I like my V6 and it's better then your GT, even if you do kick my ass in a race.
Does anyone know WHY I'm feeling these differences? Is there a totally different set of (better) mechanics that goes into the GT tranny? I know it's a different tranny, but I'm wondering what makes the feel so different. Which car is likely to be more mechanically durable in the long run? It's one of my main concerns.
But just to let you know I'm not closed-minded, I'll grudgingly admit, even though I wasn't as impressed as I hoped I'd be, I still have a spark for the ultra-cool GT.
But I'm also a bit happier with my car for now!
And to be honest, I wasn't really that impressed. I mean, I'll need to try again to feel certain about it, but I drive the manual tranny V6 every day, and in my initial comparison, the GT tranny did not feel as good as I had hoped.
OK, now I know if you race, the shorter throw shifter is for you. And I could definately feel the extra horsies pushin the car. But in first and second gear, without anyone to race, it didn't seem much faster. In all honesty, I didn't have a chance to open it up on the highway.
But speed and power aside, the clutch pedal was very easy- too easy, to push to the floor. There's no feedback at all.
The stick kinda reminded me of some old video game like Spy Hunter. In the V6, I feel the gears meshing together - at least that's what it feels like I'm feeling. In the GT, there's no tension in the shifter, there's no throw, no soft meshing feeling as you hit the spot for the gear. It's just like playing a video game. I've heard it described as notchy, and I'd agree.
The GT engine noise was noticably louder. I'm not talking about exterior exhaust growl, but rather the engine compartment whine. I was hoping the GT would eliminate that sound more then enhance it, since the V6 is filled with all these chains that seem to make it loud and the GT doesn't have those.
Anyway, I'm not decided, but I just thought it was time for all you elitist GT suckers to eat some of your own medice for a change. I'm thinkin' I like my V6 and it's better then your GT, even if you do kick my ass in a race.
Does anyone know WHY I'm feeling these differences? Is there a totally different set of (better) mechanics that goes into the GT tranny? I know it's a different tranny, but I'm wondering what makes the feel so different. Which car is likely to be more mechanically durable in the long run? It's one of my main concerns.
But just to let you know I'm not closed-minded, I'll grudgingly admit, even though I wasn't as impressed as I hoped I'd be, I still have a spark for the ultra-cool GT.
But I'm also a bit happier with my car for now!
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Awww man! You're just askin for it!
It's the computer program on the new V6 AND GT's that limit the torque in low gears to preserve the drivetrain for 200,000 miles.
GT drivers generally abuse the drivetrain more so it's more active in limiting the torque.
I noticed it too.
It's the computer program on the new V6 AND GT's that limit the torque in low gears to preserve the drivetrain for 200,000 miles.
GT drivers generally abuse the drivetrain more so it's more active in limiting the torque.
I noticed it too.
ssoss said:
Someone just walked into the saloon lookin' for a fight. There's a gonna be a shoot out. :gringreen
Do we really have to stoop to their level?
This war is so unnecessary!!!
:laughlitt
This war is so unnecessary!!!
:laughlitt
Boglin said:
It sounds like you're old school, and/or over 50? :wavey
I too have the V6 and here is what it wrong with the V6:
Shifter throw way too long.
Feel of stick is too notchy, giving the feeling of obstructions in the movement.
The clutch is easy as it should be.
The gas pedel is too numb feeling, to vague, vertually no feedback.
At the end of the day, our V6 & V8 Mustangs are not refined, not polished up like other brands. Is anyone man enough to agree on this, or will you be blinded by brand-loyalty? Well, I knew all this before I bought the v6, so why did I buy it? I love the body, the retro-interior/exterior, and it is fun to drive, but lets all be honest....it's a great car but it is not very refined as it should be....and to think otherwise explains why both Ford and Chevy are eating kaka and doing the lay-off thing...it's this old school mantality that keeps the foreign makes ahead in refinement, and quality.
I love my V6 but I have no dillusions, nor will I lie to myself....I hope none of you do either. :winks
For straight line racing the v8 is great fun. Straight line with auto-tranny is sissy racing...sorry guys but it takes little skill to wait for the green light to smack the pedel to the floor...big deal :sleeping:
For the "genre" of car that the Mustang is, the v8 is better then the v6, and this coming from a v6 owner.
Lets all stop idealizing, romantizing, and dissing other brands like we use to do with bikes back in Jr. High School.
For what it is, the Mustang v6 is a great car for it's styling and fun factor, and the V8 especially for it's performance, but that is all.
Ford really did a poor job with quality, dependability, and refinement. Lets all not delude ourselves on that. :wavey
I too have the V6 and here is what it wrong with the V6:
Shifter throw way too long.
Feel of stick is too notchy, giving the feeling of obstructions in the movement.
The clutch is easy as it should be.
The gas pedel is too numb feeling, to vague, vertually no feedback.
At the end of the day, our V6 & V8 Mustangs are not refined, not polished up like other brands. Is anyone man enough to agree on this, or will you be blinded by brand-loyalty? Well, I knew all this before I bought the v6, so why did I buy it? I love the body, the retro-interior/exterior, and it is fun to drive, but lets all be honest....it's a great car but it is not very refined as it should be....and to think otherwise explains why both Ford and Chevy are eating kaka and doing the lay-off thing...it's this old school mantality that keeps the foreign makes ahead in refinement, and quality.
I love my V6 but I have no dillusions, nor will I lie to myself....I hope none of you do either. :winks
For straight line racing the v8 is great fun. Straight line with auto-tranny is sissy racing...sorry guys but it takes little skill to wait for the green light to smack the pedel to the floor...big deal :sleeping:
For the "genre" of car that the Mustang is, the v8 is better then the v6, and this coming from a v6 owner.
Lets all stop idealizing, romantizing, and dissing other brands like we use to do with bikes back in Jr. High School.
For what it is, the Mustang v6 is a great car for it's styling and fun factor, and the V8 especially for it's performance, but that is all.
Ford really did a poor job with quality, dependability, and refinement. Lets all not delude ourselves on that. :wavey
ssoss said:
Oh, God, what did I start?
Old school? Maybe, but I'm only 35.
I think your opinions are over-stated and you should trade your V6 Stang for a Civic and go troll on the Honda forum. I didn't say Fords suck, and I didn't want it to turn into that.
Old school? Maybe, but I'm only 35.
I think your opinions are over-stated and you should trade your V6 Stang for a Civic and go troll on the Honda forum. I didn't say Fords suck, and I didn't want it to turn into that.
lovcom said:
well, I havent gotten to test drive a GT yet(not even the one I waited 3 months for them to smash at delivery), but sitting in it, I gotta admit the shifter felt rubbery to me- comfortable, but didnt have a positive feel at all- might be first ting to upgrade/modify...Hoping engine(not exhaust) sounds better than my wifes windstar v6- I'm more into iron bigblock sound- there is none till you tromp on it...my wifes car scares me to floor it, sounds like its really straining at high rpm...guess that might be the price you pay with an aluminum motor. Clutch felt like the few other hydraulics Ive driven, soft yes, but dont think I'd complain about it.
I did get to test drive a v6 a couple months ago, and gotta say its fine- but I love the sound and (hopefully)smoothness of a V8 over a V6.
BTW, I think both have similar long timing chains with variable timing and what have you...the modular family of engines is just that- length changes, but most components interchange that are the same length( I think), so I would expect engine noise to be at similar levels- but the V8 probably sits back a couple inches closer to the firewall.
The V6 has more than ample power, but power is a highly subjective topic- to many, no such thing as too much...even if it can get you in trouble on the street, might be a blast to go down the track once in a while- enough I'll keep waiting on GT#2 instead of going and getting a V6 today.
I will say though, that for all out fun street only motor, you will never beat the feel of a mild bigblocks effortless torque right off idle. From the size of the 05 engine compartment it wont be long before somebody drops a 429/460 into one somewhere...will ruin the handling for sure, but from stoplight to stoplight, without 'police attracting rpm' its still the ultimate 'kick in the pants' way to go
For 'non racers' I *almost* wish ford offered a longer stroked modular even if it had a 5k redline, just to get say 400 ft/lb at around 3krpm. Not a bigblock torque, but still more 'everyday' fun than a small high revving motor in my opinion.
I think I'll adapt just fine to the 4.6 though...I sure hope no disappointments anyways
I did get to test drive a v6 a couple months ago, and gotta say its fine- but I love the sound and (hopefully)smoothness of a V8 over a V6.
BTW, I think both have similar long timing chains with variable timing and what have you...the modular family of engines is just that- length changes, but most components interchange that are the same length( I think), so I would expect engine noise to be at similar levels- but the V8 probably sits back a couple inches closer to the firewall.
The V6 has more than ample power, but power is a highly subjective topic- to many, no such thing as too much...even if it can get you in trouble on the street, might be a blast to go down the track once in a while- enough I'll keep waiting on GT#2 instead of going and getting a V6 today.
I will say though, that for all out fun street only motor, you will never beat the feel of a mild bigblocks effortless torque right off idle. From the size of the 05 engine compartment it wont be long before somebody drops a 429/460 into one somewhere...will ruin the handling for sure, but from stoplight to stoplight, without 'police attracting rpm' its still the ultimate 'kick in the pants' way to go
For 'non racers' I *almost* wish ford offered a longer stroked modular even if it had a 5k redline, just to get say 400 ft/lb at around 3krpm. Not a bigblock torque, but still more 'everyday' fun than a small high revving motor in my opinion.
I think I'll adapt just fine to the 4.6 though...I sure hope no disappointments anyways
I bet you can pick up that GT for under 26K at a dealership in Georgia. They have several in stock and are charging way less then some others!
Forgot the name of the dealer now but if you need it I can get it for you.
Forgot the name of the dealer now but if you need it I can get it for you.
ford4v429 said:I think I'll adapt just fine to the 4.6 though...I sure hope no disappointments anyways
V6 - V8 - They both have their virtues and their vices but at the end of the day they are both MUSTANGS. You want refinement - go someplace else. You want Bang for the $$$ this is the place to be. Kids love them, chicks are drawn to them like they swoon for Brad Pitt :laughlitt . Old guys feel young again and young guys know they are playing in the big leagues. This car has revived the Muscle Car Era. Way to go Ford :worship
I don't this guy really has a 'stang . . . he's been dissing everything the past few weeks.
P.S. I'm 36, I'm one of the guys who built Ford restomods and street machines in the 80s and 90s. I put together a 302, a 351, and a 390. (Tried to work with the 255 (what a waste)).
I've NEVER been stranded by any of my cars. I HAVE picked up friends in their Subarus, Hondas, Suzukis (seemed like 1ce a week), and mitsubishis when their cars failed.
Take care of the car, the car takes care of you.
P.S. I'm 36, I'm one of the guys who built Ford restomods and street machines in the 80s and 90s. I put together a 302, a 351, and a 390. (Tried to work with the 255 (what a waste)).
I've NEVER been stranded by any of my cars. I HAVE picked up friends in their Subarus, Hondas, Suzukis (seemed like 1ce a week), and mitsubishis when their cars failed.
Take care of the car, the car takes care of you.
lovcom said:
Well KSCoyote, I guess you're your normal intolarant to other view self.
For the record, I do have a 2006 White V6 Prem w/manual. I'm happy with it but not overtly because as good as it looks and as fun as it is to drive, there is still lots of room for Ford to refine and improve, and if you don't agree, then I would suggest you raise your standards for quality.
You can brag about "rescuing" your Subaru/Toyota/Honda friends all you want but that "fact" does not jive with Consumer-Reports, nor reality. Just ask any honest all-brand mechanic and he'll tell you that the domestics have many more problems then most Japanese brands.
So don't get mad at me for voicing the truth...it is what it is. Have you yet checked out what Consumer-Reports says about our beloved 05-06 Mustangs? You're not going to like it.
This is not to say the Mustangs are crap...rather, our Mustangs are great looking, big-fun, very powerful cars that need better refinement by Ford.
Get mad at Ford, not me.
I would suggest you improve your tolerance-abilities.
This forum has room for other alternative views and opinions.
For the record, I do have a 2006 White V6 Prem w/manual. I'm happy with it but not overtly because as good as it looks and as fun as it is to drive, there is still lots of room for Ford to refine and improve, and if you don't agree, then I would suggest you raise your standards for quality.
You can brag about "rescuing" your Subaru/Toyota/Honda friends all you want but that "fact" does not jive with Consumer-Reports, nor reality. Just ask any honest all-brand mechanic and he'll tell you that the domestics have many more problems then most Japanese brands.
So don't get mad at me for voicing the truth...it is what it is. Have you yet checked out what Consumer-Reports says about our beloved 05-06 Mustangs? You're not going to like it.
This is not to say the Mustangs are crap...rather, our Mustangs are great looking, big-fun, very powerful cars that need better refinement by Ford.
Get mad at Ford, not me.
I would suggest you improve your tolerance-abilities.
This forum has room for other alternative views and opinions.
kscoyote said:
Dude, My UNCLE is an all brand mechanic, I've worked on ALL BRANDS.
If you want refinement, get a Mercedes.
Sporty Cars aren't supposed to be refined.
Jeez, man. Drive a Lamborghini - I don't think there's a single "refined" part on the car, from it's V-10 to the tranny.
Ferrari is better, but "refinement" isn't part of the Ferrari experience.
Consumer Reports thinks the Taurus is a BEST BUY.
What do I care what Consumer Reports thinks? Their test results come from it's READERS, who average age 60.
GO buy a TAURUS!!
If you want refinement, get a Mercedes.
Sporty Cars aren't supposed to be refined.
Jeez, man. Drive a Lamborghini - I don't think there's a single "refined" part on the car, from it's V-10 to the tranny.
Ferrari is better, but "refinement" isn't part of the Ferrari experience.
Consumer Reports thinks the Taurus is a BEST BUY.
What do I care what Consumer Reports thinks? Their test results come from it's READERS, who average age 60.
GO buy a TAURUS!!
lovcom said:
Oh! 1 more thing.
Guess who gets the 1st models for civic, infinity, etc? the HOME COUNTRY. We get the cars AFTER the bugs have been worked out.
Helps a bit -So did Honda disabling the CEL indicator for oxygen sensors until a couple of years ago. That's just cheating, pure and simple.
Guess who gets the 1st models for civic, infinity, etc? the HOME COUNTRY. We get the cars AFTER the bugs have been worked out.
Helps a bit -So did Honda disabling the CEL indicator for oxygen sensors until a couple of years ago. That's just cheating, pure and simple.
Ive waited this long, 2 more weeks aint a big deal anymore...whatevers meant to be will be. Gotta admit though, will probably be a nervous wreck till its home safe in the garage- the last week last time sucked, then to have the hauler mess it up at the last minute literally...
expecting the final week this time wont be much better...but, if it happens again, they'll build another one again...whatever...theres much more important things in life for sure.
expecting the final week this time wont be much better...but, if it happens again, they'll build another one again...whatever...theres much more important things in life for sure.
ssoss said:
The Taurus doesn't have a sexy retro-67-71 body style of the new Mustangs, nor is the Taurus half as much fun to drive as the Mustangs. True Honda has their own picadilloes too, but far less. I would have bought the Acura RSX as it is hyper-refined but it has a bland so-so body, and is smaller then the Mustang. I got the Mustang for the same reasons some men marry sexy models...for it's looks, and not for it's reliability....which can sometimes be a bad reason...I learned that this mind of thinking may be fine with some cars, but never with choice in women. I left my sexy model Bulgarian wife because aside from her near perfect Victoria-Secret body, she was a horrible mate. Still, even with my complaints of the Mustang, I still love it. Like you and many others here, I love my Mustang, but I also have no dillusions of it's short-comings either. And is the Mustang really a "sports-car"? Just because it's a muscle care does not make it a sports car in my opinion. It's a very fast fun car, but I never thought of it as a serious sports car....it certainly does not handle like a true sports car...it's mission is straight-line...in my mind a true sports car does better in the twisties. Just my opinion.
kscoyote said:
It won the Grand Am Cup series.
http://www.allfordmustangs.com/artm...g_FR500C_Clinches_Grand-Am_Championship.shtml
Sports depends on the Sport, doesn't it? Drag Racing is ALSO a sport.
It's in a faster class than the "neo-" sports cars, i.e. miata, etc as far as road racing.
What's your sport?
Came in 3rd behind the Viper and GTO in Drifting.
Which Sport?
SO.
-You would pick an NSX over a FERRARI? because of "refinement."
You are definitely a CR reader.
http://www.allfordmustangs.com/artm...g_FR500C_Clinches_Grand-Am_Championship.shtml
Sports depends on the Sport, doesn't it? Drag Racing is ALSO a sport.
It's in a faster class than the "neo-" sports cars, i.e. miata, etc as far as road racing.
What's your sport?
Came in 3rd behind the Viper and GTO in Drifting.
Which Sport?
SO.
-You would pick an NSX over a FERRARI? because of "refinement."
You are definitely a CR reader.
lovcom said:
Take a look at the results for this years Grand Am Championship.
www.multimaticmotorsports.com/web_pages/resultsindv.php?id=36&task=article
So if Mustang "does not handle like a true sports car" then what do you call the BMWs and Porsches that the Mustang had for lunch in the Grand Am Championship? This is not your father's Mustang. You've obviously never driven an '05 Mustang GT on "twisties" or don't know how to do it properly. Next time I lose an M3 in a triple S curve I'll take a picture of my rear view mirror so you can see what I see all the time.
Oh, yeah, and it does 13.32 @ 107.1 in a straight line on stock tires, a CIA and a tune.
www.multimaticmotorsports.com/web_pages/resultsindv.php?id=36&task=article
So if Mustang "does not handle like a true sports car" then what do you call the BMWs and Porsches that the Mustang had for lunch in the Grand Am Championship? This is not your father's Mustang. You've obviously never driven an '05 Mustang GT on "twisties" or don't know how to do it properly. Next time I lose an M3 in a triple S curve I'll take a picture of my rear view mirror so you can see what I see all the time.
Oh, yeah, and it does 13.32 @ 107.1 in a straight line on stock tires, a CIA and a tune.
lovcom said:
I think so long as you're happy with your car, there's no problem. I have had 2 V6 'Stangs; a '95 and an '01. Neither were manual. Both GTs I've had were manuals, my '96 and my '05. One of my neighbors owned a V6 'Stang with a manual. I helped get her out of the snow once in Virginia. The car had balls. I was pleasantly surprised and I thought if my '01 had a manual that it would be a lot more fun to drive than my automatic. I could imagine being quite happy with the V6. It's one of those, "hey this isn't so bad" moments, ya know? I personally don't think you're missing anything. Resale may be easier on a V8, but the V6 has a lot of things working in it's favor, perhaps most notably the reduction in insurance premiums! :winks
Not a sports car? Not as good a car as a V6? Any position on any topic can be debated. Let me boil it down to the bare facts: I live in Podunk Georgia. Ordered a cheese cake for a big Thanksgiving get together from the closest bakery about 15 miles down the road. It does happen to be four lane all the way into Midway GA just because it is a major feeder onto I-95 just south of Savannah. On the way, I of course notice that there are no cops or speed traps or any unpleasent things of that nature on my way over there so I am on my way back and I immediately get up to speed of about 85 and just keep it in fourth gear, just about 3000-3500 rpm where you can feel the engine starting to hum wanting to move up to redline; you can feel that fine, tight vibration right up through your butt into your hands on the wheel; the other cars that are pushing it to get where they are going are up there around 80mph but are only obstacles to be used to make Esmaralda happy by achieving that orgasmic plane known as redline as she flashes around and through them to come back down to the 80-85 range until the next obstacle is encountered to make her happy again. After 10 or 15 miles of this I can't get the grin off my face. ENOUGH SAID
lovcom said:
I don't know much about the cars that race in the Grand Am...are they stock? tricked out? Am I to assume those cars that race in the Grand Am are representative of the same stock cars we drive? If not, then we're talking apples and oranges. That Mustang that won the Grand Am is probably not representative of the Mustangs we drive, but do correct me if I'm wrong. Could it be that the real winner was the driver, the mechanics that tricked out the car? The well moneyed team owners?
I probably would take the NSX over the Ferrari for refinement alone. On the other hand the looks of Ferrari are very seductive and could pull me in...again, reminds me of my exceedingly beautiful ex-wife....I suppose I'll be happy as punch until the darned thing breaks down for the 3rd time in as many months. They're both very fast cars, and even though the Ferrari may be faster, how much faster do you need to go on the street?
For road racing, I'd insist on independent rear suspension...the Mustang is not a true sports car..sure a great fun car, great looker, big power, etc, but it's just a small car with a big powerful 4.6L motor. No more, no less. Muscle car, sure. Sports car, not IMHO....ok, I'll go for sporty.
Don't get me wrong, Ford did a LOT right about the 2005.2006 Mustangs. There's not much actually I'd change to make the Mustang an even better ride.
If I were Ford, I'd do the following for the 2007 Mustang:
Start with the 2006...
Keep the most excellent body styling,
Add rear independent suspension,
Use better refined materials for the interior...keep the current styling,
Refine the feel of the manual shifter, shorten the throw,
Refine the fuel-injection/computer system especiall when the car is cold,
Keep the nicely tuned exhaust note,
Improve the feel of the gas pedel..it's too vague, too dead, too numb IMHO,
Filter out the manual whirling noises, and engine noise from the interior,
Do a MUCH better job of quality-assurance,
For the v6, add multi-valves, and variable valve timing like everyone else,
Does the V8 have multiple-valve timing? If not, this would be a great addition. A dynamic engine is the way to go.
If Ford does at least these things oh man! :worship :worship :worship
I probably would take the NSX over the Ferrari for refinement alone. On the other hand the looks of Ferrari are very seductive and could pull me in...again, reminds me of my exceedingly beautiful ex-wife....I suppose I'll be happy as punch until the darned thing breaks down for the 3rd time in as many months. They're both very fast cars, and even though the Ferrari may be faster, how much faster do you need to go on the street?
For road racing, I'd insist on independent rear suspension...the Mustang is not a true sports car..sure a great fun car, great looker, big power, etc, but it's just a small car with a big powerful 4.6L motor. No more, no less. Muscle car, sure. Sports car, not IMHO....ok, I'll go for sporty.
Don't get me wrong, Ford did a LOT right about the 2005.2006 Mustangs. There's not much actually I'd change to make the Mustang an even better ride.
If I were Ford, I'd do the following for the 2007 Mustang:
Start with the 2006...
Keep the most excellent body styling,
Add rear independent suspension,
Use better refined materials for the interior...keep the current styling,
Refine the feel of the manual shifter, shorten the throw,
Refine the fuel-injection/computer system especiall when the car is cold,
Keep the nicely tuned exhaust note,
Improve the feel of the gas pedel..it's too vague, too dead, too numb IMHO,
Filter out the manual whirling noises, and engine noise from the interior,
Do a MUCH better job of quality-assurance,
For the v6, add multi-valves, and variable valve timing like everyone else,
Does the V8 have multiple-valve timing? If not, this would be a great addition. A dynamic engine is the way to go.
If Ford does at least these things oh man! :worship :worship :worship
kscoyote said:
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