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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Check out the new technology info. we uploaded to the site today.

With more and more companies producing plastic induction systems I felt it important to know that PLASTICS ARE NOT CREATED EQUAL.

My systems will deliver the best consistant performance on the more citical playing field: EVERYDAY DRIVING!

Uploaded the 05/06 TB pipe schematic specs. as you scroll down on the entry page.

WE WISH EVERYONE A GREAT HOLIDAY SEASON!!
 

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JP DeMolet said:
Check out the new technology info. we uploaded to the site today.

With more and more companies producing plastic induction systems I felt it important to know that PLASTICS ARE NOT CREATED EQUAL.

My systems will deliver the best consistant performance on the more citical playing field: EVERYDAY DRIVING!

Uploaded the 05/06 TB pipe schematic specs. as you scroll down on the entry page.

WE WISH EVERYONE A GREAT HOLIDAY SEASON!!
 

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I had never looked at the different materials in the tube... that's pretty cool!

I knew I liked the design, looks, and of course power... I don't know how much heat does but have been 'against' the material choise and thickness on the C&L... but then again they have proven their power on and on again...

But cruising around on a hot summer day the intake must get heat soaked and the intake air warmer... Now if the tube is of 'better' materials it must stay cooler provide for some cooler intake air providing some more power! On the dyno with the hood open, fans blowing, might not be the right compairon regarding every day driving power...

A metal pipe touching (or beeing very close to) a radiato hose must be, and stay warm even with tons of cooler intake air going by... there must be a (small?) power loss due to this?!?

But as Brent at Brenspeed says that's the never ending discussion... I just think that with volume, smooth insides and bends, a good large filter, why take a chance on not providing your engine with the coolest air possible... I asked C&L months ago and they said there was no dyno proven differance with or without the heat shield! They also went to say that a heat soaked intake is obviously not the best and that the dyno probably does not show the loss of power from it nor the gain of power from the heat shield while driving... They said they started with that alloy because it's what they work with and it was intended for people planning on adding NO2.... Now they have a plastic one for Racers so I guess they have realized the limitations in the design and materials on the initial intake. Unfortionately with that design (volume?) they 'lost preassure' somewhere on the way and it seems it's too large for the otherwise stock motor / exhaust...??

I wish there was a driving test conducted, measuring intake air temp at the TB and around the filter while driving. And of course the differance of power at the wheels between X degrees temp change. Also all and any turbulence in the air, at the filter and after the filter with and without the heat shield would be interesting!

There is many unknows as most testing is on the dyno or 1/4 with the car cooling down between runs...

I think cooler is better, hence COLD air intakes... :rolleyes:

Now all the C&L guys are going to shoot me down... :eyebulge: :laughlitt and I'm looking fwd to it... :smoke:
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
The temp will make more of a difference than most people realize.

You'll be able to put your hand on my system after running the motor all day in the summer. Don't try that with a metal system.

But it's also the weight. My whole system weighs a tick UNDER 5 lbs.

Thanks for all the openmindedness. After all if plastics didn't make a difference why would C&L switch, and show a better performing system to boot!

Check out the COMPLETE 05 GT' install guide we uploaded to the site today.

It's linked between the 2 White 05' GT Vert pics. on the entry page as you scroll down.

I've gotten tech calls asking about how difficult the install/tune is and this should help.

Everybody have a GREAT Weekend!
 

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Why not just leave a link for us :winks
 

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JP DeMolet said:
After all if plastics didn't make a difference why would C&L switch, and show a better performing system to boot!
I'm not even remotely going to address the "mine is better" arguement. Jay is already president of that club. Don't need anyone else bombarding the boards with that...

But to address your comment about why and better performing. C&L themselves said it does not perform better on a NA vehicle, it was designed for highly modified vehicles. They even show on their web site where on a NA vehicle their original intake pipe actually pulls better numbers than the "race version". Also Brenspeed ( or maybe someone else, don't actually remember ) did dyno comparisons and backed up that the original setup performs better than the race version for what most people have in mods on their cars.
 

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Which C & L with a S/C?

JP DeMolet said:
The temp will make more of a difference than most people realize.

You'll be able to put your hand on my system after running the motor all day in the summer. Don't try that with a metal system.

But it's also the weight. My whole system weighs a tick UNDER 5 lbs.

Thanks for all the openmindedness. After all if plastics didn't make a difference why would C&L switch, and show a better performing system to boot!

Check out the COMPLETE 05 GT' install guide we uploaded to the site today.

It's linked between the 2 White 05' GT Vert pics. on the entry page as you scroll down.

I've gotten tech calls asking about how difficult the install/tune is and this should help.

Everybody have a GREAT Weekend!
I've been looking at my CAI options. I have a Saleen S/C on my '05 GT. I read the article in the Mustang magazine ("Shootout") and didn't notice any reference to superchargers, only to other major mods, like bottom end mods, etc. I'm not planning any other engine mods, other than maybe an X pipe and mufflers. I have the Saleen Powerflash tune (for now). Would you recommend the Racer model for my car or the previous model? My car already has almost 400 rwhp. Will the CAI and a new tune make much of a difference? Thanks for your input.
 

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It's http://www.tunableinduction.com/ JP/John is not alowed to post that (too often) as it may be taken as advertisement... not cool ! :rolleyes:

Cooler is better, that's all what it's about, get as much air/oxygen in as you can, volume for max air, cold for max oxygen content... simple math! :tongue

If you can fit the above system with your Saleen it would be AWESOME! :drool:
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
My 05 Toy:


I'll check with Jannety racing Monday as we worked Friday and I forgot to call them.
They are checking the install/performance on a Saleen SC setup.

They related they would have the setup tested about 6 weeks ago but it's the busy shops, like them, Murillo, and Modular Depot, that I've found it worth the wait, and I'll only post independant findings.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Hawgman:


You're right I didn't read the whole site info enough.
I am surprised though that they call the new system the 'Racer' not recommending nitrous.

You can run nitrous with my systems, the old and new. The thickness of my systems compared to the injected molded plastic will make a difference.

I'm hoping to have more testing done next with the ZEX.
 

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JP DeMolet said:
You'll be able to put your hand on my system after running the motor all day in the summer. Don't try that with a metal system.
I installed the aluminum C&L intake, and after a hard run that lasted an hour in 90 F temps, I popped the hood and the intake was just slightly warm to the touch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
Hm. Even the strut tower brace in mine, not attached to the motor gets hot as a tick in the summer.


Ever since I introed the first plastic systems this argument has gone back and forth but none of us will be able to change the laws of physics:
- metal conducts heat
- plastic insulates
- metal will condensate
- metal can corrode
- plastic will not condensate or corrode
 

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JP DeMolet said:
Hm. Even the strut tower brace in mine, not attached to the motor gets hot as a tick in the summer.
That's because there's no air flowing thru the strut tower brace.
 

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JP DeMolet said:
- metal conducts heat
- plastic insulates
Did you ever check the temperature of the plastic intake manifold on a 2005 Mustang GT after a hard run or a heatsoak?
 

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JP DeMolet said:
- metal will condensate
- metal can corrode
An aluminum intake manifold on a 1988 Mazda 626 did not corrode or cause any problems whatsoever in the 16 years and 200,000 miles that I owned it.
 

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JP DeMolet said:
- plastic will not condensate
Have you ever seen how water can be collected in the outdoors when there are no puddles, streams, rivers, or lakes in the area, and it does not rain?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Anything that conducts heat located in a 150 degree envirornment is going to get hot.

That's like saying the upper intake manifold on my Mustang isn't going to get hot on a 90 degree day. It gets too hot to touch quickly and it flows air.

Why ice down an upper at the track after only 1/4 mile? It's hot.

They may have done some extensive intake temp testing in the shootout as I remember them remarking that there was a big temp difference on the WMS system without the shield in place. This is only about a 10" long system. I can see if I can obtain any data on this.

But we're really getting sidetracked with the original thread, partly my fault, as I was trying to show that there is differences in different plastics' insulative properties.

You have to let potential customers know the differences in construction otherwise most people would simply consider that there is no difference with plastics.
Another example of this would be the different shielding materials on the market: ABS & PCV, as all plastics, have a temperature ceiling before distorting and warping. I'm not at the shop where my plastics manuals are so I might be a little off with these quotes but it's around 140 degrees before ABS & PVC start to warp. It's 240 degrees before polycarbonate will warp.

With an emphasis in the shootout writeup denoting 'how the system will hold up in the long run' it's significant to know the temp limitations of different plastics.
Plus, cosmetically the polycarbonates look AWESOME, a very high gloss black, and very stiff for squaring off the airfilter location corner.
 
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