Ford Mustang Forum banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am ordering an '06 GT ASAP and would like to know if any of you knowledgeable folks know the difference in weight between the standard cast 17inch wheels and the optional forged 17inch wheels.I prefer the look of the cast wheels,but if the forged wheels are appreciably lighter I will get them instead.In addition,does anyone have any feeling on how much the weight difference would have to be to merit going with a wheel that is not to my liking cosmetically in order to improve performance? I know that the less unsprung weight the better relative to acceleration,braking performance,and suspension action on demanding surfaces.With the solid axle cornering at HIGH speeds, on rough corners,I believe that lighter wheels could be of benefit.I am not interested in the 18inch wheels or in after market wheels. Any insight would be appreciated. Oh,Ford should list this info in their specs,after all this is a high performance machine. David
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,724 Posts
david campfield said:
I am ordering an '06 GT ASAP and would like to know if any of you knowledgeable folks know the difference in weight between the standard cast 17inch wheels and the optional forged 17inch wheels.I prefer the look of the cast wheels,but if the forged wheels are appreciably lighter I will get them instead.In addition,does anyone have any feeling on how much the weight difference would have to be to merit going with a wheel that is not to my liking cosmetically in order to improve performance? I know that the less unsprung weight the better relative to acceleration,braking performance,and suspension action on demanding surfaces.With the solid axle cornering at HIGH speeds, on rough corners,I believe that lighter wheels could be of benefit.I am not interested in the 18inch wheels or in after market wheels. Any insight would be appreciated. Oh,Ford should list this info in their specs,after all this is a high performance machine. David
The difference is negligible. A couple pounds difference won't matter, because a general rule of thumb is you lose about 1 tenth of a second(in the 1/4 mile) for every 100 pounds of body wieght in the car(or something close to that). So therefore, 1-3 pounds per wheel won't make much of a difference.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
269 Posts
tw0scoops123 said:
The difference is negligible. A couple pounds difference won't matter, because a general rule of thumb is you lose about 1 tenth of a second(in the 1/4 mile) for every 100 pounds of body wieght in the car(or something close to that). So therefore, 1-3 pounds per wheel won't make much of a difference.
Thats true Twoscoops in terms of vehicle weight in general, but unsprung weight is a whole different ball of wax. It takes more power to spin heavier wheels up to speed and bigger brakes to stop them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
886 Posts
Yeah, I read somewhere that losing one pound of rotational weight is like losing three pound on the chassis. sounds like a factor Pi in there somewhere..

Do I think my GT with the Bullitts is slower? No. You can bet they're not much different in weight, both being factory designed and spec'd . If it matters to you, save the $ from the factory upgrade, and buy a lightweight set of aftermarket wheels. Go look at the Falken stuff (I like the Hanabi). Light, strong, and (relatively) cheap.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
..........

If you really want to know how much they weight... get 3 boxes large enough to hold a rim, then pack the different rims in each box... the 3rd box gets all the packing material amount used in ther other boxes... then go to a UPS store, ask the price to ship each box, they will weigh each box on their commercial scale (usually 0-200 lb scales), and that will be an accurate weight of the box with each rim... then using the empty box as a tare, subtract it from the weight of the other boxes, and that will give you the weight of each rim. :tongue :tongue Fool Proof method right there... of course, who the hell has that kind of time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,235 Posts
If your looking for serious lightweight wheels, try FISKE. They are not cheap, but i had a set on my Vette and they were the best wheels for track use, very light weight also. I know a company called ROTA makes light weight affordable wheels, but they are mainly an import car wheel, but I dont know if they have applications for s197 mustangs
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
335 Posts
Fiske wheels are what Multimatic uses on their team FR500 cars. They are about $900 apiece, and they are generally not coated. But Fiske and HRE are the best if you have the cake.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
659 Posts
Twoscoops is completly wrong. Typically true, forged wheels are lighter and stronger and this can help your car handle better and accellerate faster. BUT, what mass production thrid party wheel makers are calling a forged wheel is pretty lame these days. Most of the low priced so called forged wheels are actually melt/hot forged which is more like hot pressure castings than true forgings. All the marketability of the forging process but only some of the benifits and much lower cost to produce to the ignorant wheel buying public. Most real forged race wheels are 2 or 3 piece wheels either bolted or welded together. A typical 2 piece forged wheel are made up of a center piece or pancake that is forged and then droped into a spun or machine turned hoop and welded or bolted to the hoop. Three piece wheels typically have a forged pancake and a separate outer and inner hoop and bolted together providing true custom fitment. Trust me, a true forged racing wheel is a MUCH better wheel for racing than for street use and they are MUCH more expensive to buy, they usually start at $700-$800 per wheel and typically weight 15%-25% less than a light weight pressure cast wheel of the same dimension.

Anyway, the total weight including tires and how far the mass is located from the axis is more important than simply considering wheel weights alone. Rotating weight is the WORST type of weight and the most important to reduce. From what I can tell the break point at the moment is 17"-18" for best performance as the 19"-20" wheels and tires bring the mass too far from the center of rotation and are going to slow you down. Of course the differences are going to be small compared to say running on a near empty fuel tank, stripping out that 200lbs. of audio junk in your trunk and a driver that is 100lbs. lighter.

For the street pick the wheel size that you can find the best tires for, the weight differences in Ford's wheels will make virtually no performance difference. For a performance minded driver keep you car light, don't carry a bunch of crap in your car and don't buy the Mach 1000 (it sounds like crap anyway), don't add a bunch of audio equipment, body kit or any other crap that doesn't make your car handle better or go faster.

My take on it anyway.



david campfield said:
I am ordering an '06 GT ASAP and would like to know if any of you knowledgeable folks know the difference in weight between the standard cast 17inch wheels and the optional forged 17inch wheels.I prefer the look of the cast wheels,but if the forged wheels are appreciably lighter I will get them instead.In addition,does anyone have any feeling on how much the weight difference would have to be to merit going with a wheel that is not to my liking cosmetically in order to improve performance? I know that the less unsprung weight the better relative to acceleration,braking performance,and suspension action on demanding surfaces.With the solid axle cornering at HIGH speeds, on rough corners,I believe that lighter wheels could be of benefit.I am not interested in the 18inch wheels or in after market wheels. Any insight would be appreciated. Oh,Ford should list this info in their specs,after all this is a high performance machine. David
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
SportsPix said:
Twoscoops is completly wrong. Typically true, forged wheels are lighter and stronger and this can help your car handle better and accellerate faster. BUT, what mass production thrid party wheel makers are calling a forged wheel is pretty lame these days. Most of the low priced so called forged wheels are actually melt/hot forged which is more like hot pressure castings than true forgings. All the marketability of the forging process but only some of the benifits and much lower cost to produce to the ignorant wheel buying public. Most real forged race wheels are 2 or 3 piece wheels either bolted or welded together. A typical 2 piece forged wheel are made up of a center piece or pancake that is forged and then droped into a spun or machine turned hoop and welded or bolted to the hoop. Three piece wheels typically have a forged pancake and a separate outer and inner hoop and bolted together providing true custom fitment. Trust me, a true forged racing wheel is a MUCH better wheel for racing than for street use and they are MUCH more expensive to buy, they usually start at $700-$800 per wheel and typically weight 15%-25% less than a light weight pressure cast wheel of the same dimension.

Anyway, the total weight including tires and how far the mass is located from the axis is more important than simply considering wheel weights alone. Rotating weight is the WORST type of weight and the most important to reduce. From what I can tell the break point at the moment is 17"-18" for best performance as the 19"-20" wheels and tires bring the mass too far from the center of rotation and are going to slow you down. Of course the differences are going to be small compared to say running on a near empty fuel tank, stripping out that 200lbs. of audio junk in your trunk and a driver that is 100lbs. lighter.

For the street pick the wheel size that you can find the best tires for, the weight differences in Ford's wheels will make virtually no performance difference. For a performance minded driver keep you car light, don't carry a bunch of crap in your car and don't buy the Mach 1000 (it sounds like crap anyway), don't add a bunch of audio equipment, body kit or any other crap that doesn't make your car handle better or go faster.

My take on it anyway.
I gotta disagree a bit here...I work at a plant that machines for alcoa, and their forged wheels are incredibly strong, one piece , cold forged(some use spun rim sections) and in a bad lathe crash, can twist like a pretzel without cracking. Ive seen cast(we used to do some cast for another company) roll off a bench and break a piece off the 'catear' (part where wheel weights go). The only problem with true forged wheels is they are extremely expensive to tool up- I was told many years ago if we machined them for free, they would still cost twice what a finished cast wheel costs. that was long before the chinese started cranking castings out...other bad thing about the forged- machining nightmare...all faces on the new 20" mopar wheels are cut on 5 axis mills some take an hour apiece...'forged feature' wheels like the 3 spoke dodge truck from the 90's are a bear to forge, even harder to machine- but strong as heck. most coldforged 6061-t6 are only justified for heavier trucks, or very high performance...
machining a cast car wheel might involve half a pound of chips- forged 2/3-3/4 of the forging weight gets machined off. Stronger/non porous/more salt resistant- but way more expensive.
Ive got centerlines on 2 of my cars, theyre spun, and ductile like forged, but bend easier than most OEM wheels- very lightweight though. In any event Id rather bend one than break one....too bad they cant forge a torq-thrust looking wheel:drool: I'd buy two sets to replace both my mustang sets...still think its the perfect looking wheel for a mustang-

if youre after unsprung weight, centerline is tough to beat- be ready for rough ride though- the ligher weight dont dampen out any bumps- suspension reacts much more quickly- made my camaro ride like a skateboard...(well the camaro I just got rid of to get the mustang that is...had that car 20 years)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
659 Posts
Hi ford4v429,

Help me out here, what part do you disagree with?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
If I were getting an 06, I would opt for the 18 inch Bullitt wheels,

I have an 05, and they came stock with 17inch bullits. They look awesome, and I am looking to get the Factory 18 inch Bullitts.

Just my opinion.:eyepoppin
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,235 Posts
I hear that HRE wheels are banned at some tracks because they are known to come apart. has anyone heard this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
SportsPix said:
Hi ford4v429,

Help me out here, what part do you disagree with?
my bad- tired, quick look, didnt even read everything...actually I agree- sorry... :)

I wish more advertising of cold forged advantages would be put out there...I saw in one of my many mustang reviews or ordering guides I downloaded, one said something like 'polished cast forged aluminum...' there is a lot of misunderstanding/misrepresenting out there...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
269 Posts
techiegt05 said:
If I were getting an 06, I would opt for the 18 inch Bullitt wheels,

I have an 05, and they came stock with 17inch bullits. They look awesome, and I am looking to get the Factory 18 inch Bullitts.

Just my opinion.:eyepoppin
I agree, the 18 inch Bullitt's are the nicest wheels offered thus far for the new stang IMHO, but to each his own, everyone has different likes and dislikes. Just curious, whats the cost of the 18 inch Bullit option and are they available in chrome?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
These were the lightest I could find at a reasonable price. You could probably get lighter from a customer manufacturer like CHE or HRE, or the likes. The rears are 18X9.5 and the fronts are 18X8.5. I got a screamin deal on these otherwise I would have probably gone with the Maximum motorsports wheels.

I think the weight is like 16lbs on these.


SSR Comp lights from tire rack 285 rear, 255 front. Still don't have the dam car, supposed to be here today or tomorrow, I will let you know how they do after I put some miles on them
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,235 Posts
mustangaretuff said:
These were the lightest I could find at a reasonable price. You could probably get lighter from a customer manufacturer like CHE or HRE, or the likes. The rears are 18X9.5 and the fronts are 18X8.5. I got a screamin deal on these otherwise I would have probably gone with the Maximum motorsports wheels.

I think the weight is like 16lbs on these.


SSR Comp lights from tire rack 285 rear, 255 front. Still don't have the dam car, supposed to be here today or tomorrow, I will let you know how they do after I put some miles on them
You know those are good rims! Hey, do you like your KDWs? I loved my KDs, and the Ws are not as sticky. I also liked the R1's(for track), which they dont make anymore. I hear everyone is going VictoRacer (khumos) now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
265 Posts
SINCITY,


I really wanted the beyonds but I didn't like the weight. I truthfully just lucked into these. I haven't put any miles on my KDW's as they are still waiting for a car. I will let you know next week as I am hoping to spend some time in the garage with the new car this weekend. Supposed to arrive tomorrow.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,235 Posts
mustangaretuff said:
SINCITY,


I really wanted the beyonds but I didn't like the weight. I truthfully just lucked into these. I haven't put any miles on my KDW's as they are still waiting for a car. I will let you know next week as I am hoping to spend some time in the garage with the new car this weekend. Supposed to arrive tomorrow.
The Beyonds are really nice, especially since my car is Tungsten Grey, they really look good. I get compliments on the look because the wheels really fill in my fenders and since my car sits on coil overs, it really rides nice too. I have the other KDWs on my car, the ones that do not have the "flame" pattern on the tread, but more of an directional pattern. I'm going to get a set of track wheels and i will get some lightweight ones also and go with the 18 inch and some Victoracers. Cant go wrong with the konigs either, they are really cheap and good bang for your buck, but they are on the heavy side.
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top